Atacama Yellow 35is build thread

ultramega said:
B21 said:
It doesn’t look that complicated..they all are variations of drain, new filters, new oil, move the trans through some gear shifts and reach certain temperatures and then ensure excess dribbles out through the relevant hole.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LpiRVOPVNf4
Yes, that makes it sound straight forward. It was the fill/run/fill-more part that seemed fraught with danger to me. This is the thread I read:
https://e89.zpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=442369 (EDIT: I see this has been previously mentioned in this thread. Still catching up!)

Is it something you are going to do yourself, or have you found a garage with the correct knowledge?

I have a couple of tame local garages…one garage has the MOT capability so since it’s MOT time for the other Zed and oil change I’ve booked both in as a job lot…

Once my garage is built in the Spring and I get a hydraulic lift I’ll do more jobs myself :thumbsup:
 
B21 said:
New speakers for the upgrade arrived today..

They have optimised settings for the DSP..happy days..

2021-11-26 17.43.21.jpg
How much of a straight swap are those Helix P6B for the footwell woofers? What modding is required?
 
ultramega said:
B21 said:
New speakers for the upgrade arrived today..

They have optimised settings for the DSP..happy days..

2021-11-26 17.43.21.jpg
How much of a straight swap are those Helix P6B for the footwell woofers? What modding is required?

I covered that and other things in this write up on my 20i minor audio upgrade..basically its a bit of faff..need some O level woodwork skils to help and a soldering iron :thumbsup:

https://z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=116918&start=60
 
B21 said:
Beeacon said:
Bit of advice on the leaky front adaptive dampers, you can buy remanufactured ones from Poland for about £250 a corner, but they work on an exchange program. This has been on my radar for a while in case it comes up as being required.

https://nagengast.pl/en/kategoria-produktu/bmw-en/bmw-z4-en/

Hello, yes saw these guys before, wonder why they only do front 35is suspenders? :tumbleweed:

Alledgedley there are some folks in Notts that can re-furb them so now they are off, will investigate that, prior to selling them as 'good to go' for those you stick with 35is adapative suspension. :thumbsup:

Starting to have a small amount of oil misting on mine now. Did you ever find the company that refurbs in Nottingham? Would be interested to give them a call if you can post their details please. Refurbished ones from Nagengast are actually more expensive than they first appear when tax/customs/shipping is added on.
 
Beeacon said:
B21 said:
Beeacon said:
Bit of advice on the leaky front adaptive dampers, you can buy remanufactured ones from Poland for about £250 a corner, but they work on an exchange program. This has been on my radar for a while in case it comes up as being required.

https://nagengast.pl/en/kategoria-produktu/bmw-en/bmw-z4-en/

Hello, yes saw these guys before, wonder why they only do front 35is suspenders? :tumbleweed:

Alledgedley there are some folks in Notts that can re-furb them so now they are off, will investigate that, prior to selling them as 'good to go' for those you stick with 35is adapative suspension. :thumbsup:

Starting to have a small amount of oil misting on mine now. Did you ever find the company that refurbs in Nottingham? Would be interested to give them a call if you can post their details please. Refurbished ones from Nagengast are actually more expensive than they first appear when tax/customs/shipping is added on.

HI, yes I spoke to the chap, 07877 453936

He wanted £280 each or £260 for 4 at the same time, but he couldn't do the rears anyway..my two rear 35is dampers appear to be non misting / non leaking if you wanted to buy them, Im about to put a lot of old N20 /20i /redundany 35is bits on eBay.. :thumbsup:
 
B21 said:
I covered that and other things in this write up on my 20i minor audio upgrade..basically its a bit of faff..need some O level woodwork skils to help and a soldering iron :thumbsup:

https://z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=116918&start=60
Sounds like a faff, but good fun. I've resigned myself to taking the easy option and paying somebody else to replace the audio. My car has base audio, and it's terrible.
 
ultramega said:
B21 said:
I covered that and other things in this write up on my 20i minor audio upgrade..basically its a bit of faff..need some O level woodwork skils to help and a soldering iron :thumbsup:

https://z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=116918&start=60
Sounds like a faff, but good fun. I've resigned myself to taking the easy option and paying somebody else to replace the audio. My car has base audio, and it's terrible.

I never had the 6 speaker version but I gather it’s not good..

It’s not that difficult to do a decent upgrade…

I’ve got a DSP/amp setup that would blow your socks off for a reasonable price…(sound of vulture picking over the remains)

However there are plenty of audio specialists …just be aware the E89 is unique and does not share the same audio setup as almost all other BMWs…so make sure he knows what he’s doing with a Zed :thumbsup:
 
B21 said:
I’ve got a DSP/amp setup that would blow your socks off for a reasonable price…(sound of vulture picking over the remains)
The Match one for the 676 you had in your 20i? I couldn't see that making that compatible with base audio would be an easy process. Match don't list any of their DSP as compatible with base audio, so I don't even know if the connector on the back of the headunit is the same. Then there's recoding the car to make it think it has 676 (to flatten the EQ), and the missing speakers it would expect to find, and the factory amp not being there. But I'd be very happy to have you tell me it's nowhere near that complicated.

B21 said:
However there are plenty of audio specialists …just be aware the E89 is unique and does not share the same audio setup as almost all other BMWs…so make sure he knows what he’s doing with a Zed :thumbsup:
I've spoken to www.audiofile-incar.co.uk. They have a good reputation and have experience of the E89 too. They are out of my way, but I'll be down in London next month anyway. But again, I'd be keen on doing it myself if it's not as big a project as I think.
 
It’s not difficult, if you’ve already done the journey…the single biggest issue is that in the event that the wiring loom specifics are not there for the extra speakers you will have to lay the extra cables in…but if you were doing the Match 7 for the E89 as opposed to a 3 series you’d be over half way there anyway.

If you are interested best take it off line..to avoid cluttering this thread..the re-coding part is trivial if you have Bimmergeeks Protool..
 
B21 said:
HI, yes I spoke to the chap, 07877 453936

He wanted £280 each or £260 for 4 at the same time, but he couldn't do the rears anyway..my two rear 35is dampers appear to be non misting / non leaking if you wanted to buy them, Im about to put a lot of old N20 /20i /redundany 35is bits on eBay.. :thumbsup:

Unfortunately it is the fronts on mine, rears are holding up well. Thanks for the contact info, very handy to have!

Cheers,
Beeacon.
 
Beeacon said:
B21 said:
HI, yes I spoke to the chap, 07877 453936

He wanted £280 each or £260 for 4 at the same time, but he couldn't do the rears anyway..my two rear 35is dampers appear to be non misting / non leaking if you wanted to buy them, Im about to put a lot of old N20 /20i /redundany 35is bits on eBay.. :thumbsup:

Unfortunately it is the fronts on mine, rears are holding up well. Thanks for the contact info, very handy to have!

Cheers,
Beeacon.

No worries…I wonder if the fronts fail first more often? :tumbleweed:
 
B21 said:
Quaife LSD kept both wheels in check with small amount of yoh- yoh through the wheels as they each gripped and then lost it but kept going straight.

Electronic diff / traction control coded out..didn’t try the same trick mid corner…

Just to clarify, does coding out the e-diff leave you with no traction control? I realise the e-diff is effectively traction control, but it would be nice to still have traction control left beyond my right foot!
 
No, tractiion control and stability control remain effective…what’s coded out is that if either rear wheel spins it’s not braked by the DSC system and the engine doesn’t shut down due to that event…if the car starts to yaw (ie get out of shape) then DSC starts to intervene by applying differential braking and /or throttle reduction… :thumbsup:
 
As detailed earlier I bought an Audiotec Fischer Match UP 10 DSP digital amp and DSP tp replace the 677 Top Fi set up in the 35is..

https://www.audiotec-fischer.de/en/matc ... s/up-10dsp

I bought the SDM125 box that allows the fibre optic signal with the audio information from the head unit to be decoded and fed to the DSP/amp

https://www.audiotec-fischer.de/en/heli ... ies/sdmi25

Amongst many other bits I bought a specific BMW to Match 1p cable adapter.

Given the confusing and overlapping nomenclature over names for various speaker positions I was suspicous that yet again, like the 676 Hi-FI version and the Match 7 that was 'plug n play' that it wouldn't all work out perfectly.

So I sat down today for about 5 hours to try and see if the custom cable matched and which amp channel (there are 10)on the DSP was powering what speaker..

Super colour coded spreadsheet later..plus multi meter..

So bottomed it out..as I suspected close but not exact.. most of the audio out of the orginal 677 amp goes via a 20 pin connector.

BUT..the rear centre channel between the seats at head height for reasons only known to BMW comes out on another connector whose primary job is to supply power to the amp.

Quite why oh why they did this when there are two spare connector pins going begging on the 20 way connector god only knows.

I guess, yet again, on the E89 they bodged and existing design to save costs.

AF obviously lost the will to do something about it as the 10 channel amp has one spare channel which would marry nicely with the missing rear centre channel..but they just didn't bother..

I'll work a way to patch that channel across to that connector.

It wll have to wait till the spring / summer when I finish building my garage and then can take the back end of the car apart in the warm and dry..all first world problems..
 

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Flyingfifer said:
I very much appreciate the attention to detail here... 10/10 :thumbsup: 8)

#multimonitorgang :hattip:

Thank you there will be a written test on "Life and times of AF Match DSP integration with E89 Audio systems 2009-2016" :tumbleweed: :rofl:

Another newbie with the 6 speaker basic system is going to use a Match 7 as well..so between us we'll have covered all the versions. :thumbsup:
 
While my brain was in gear I thought it would be best to fire up the DSP configuration tool and try and embody the wiring /configuration details in the DSP programming system.

Of course if you buy a modern mid range upwards (and in fact quite some cheaper cars) car then they almost all use DSPs to make the audio sound better and this allows them to use cheaper speakers very effectively/

WIth a general purpose DSP/amp you have to do the heavy lifting..often manufacturers supply 'sound set-ups' which are pre-canned for specifc cars..of course going off-piste means that you either start with one of theirs and mod it or roll your own..

Between day jobs I gave it a go..

So the first job with this fairly sophisticated puppy is to decide which inputs are going to be associated with the intended outputs. In this case this DSP extends the concepts of signal processing to a whole new level..this system can embrace the concept of virtualisation which allows an even cleverer bunch of tricks to be performed on the sound image..this screenshot shows the two channels that will come in on the digital optical link from the MOST E89 bus that has been decoded by the SMI25 MOST to FO Digital on the left..then those two channes (basically left and right) are allocated to the various virtual channels that everntually will be allocated to the actual physical 10 channels of amplifcation
Screenshot 2022-02-08 12.57.32.png

Next is an interim step (which if you used multiple alternative inputs like analogue lines in or on board bluetooth /usb etc) which for our simple two channel input is largely a repeat of what we just did.it allows you to treat say a woofer/mid/tweeter as a block of DSP logic

Screenshot 2022-02-08 14.03.11.png
Then we tie the virtual world to the real channels of the amp..in this case the main event is to ensure that the two high power channels 160 watts RMS each go the subwoofers as these need an awful lot of grunt to be effective. In the E89 we have a channel driving the door mounted mid and tweeter and a channel driving the kickwell woofer (this is where the virtual bit comes in as two amps per side are treated logically as one for the purposes of sound stage image creation) The other 8 channels can deliver 65 watts RMS per channel..ideally a bit more for the woofers would have been great..but we limp on..

Screenshot 2022-02-08 12.57.47.png
Then we move on to the virtual processor which uses the array of speakers to do lots of very very clever things. So we digitally process the sound stage so for music it feels 'wider' and 'crisper'. We do similar tricks for the centre speaker so voices as in say a news broadcast are very crisp and centralised, and finally in this section we do some heavy processing to make the subwoofers feel much stronger and deeper than they really are.

Screenshot 2022-02-08 12.58.04.pngScreenshot 2022-02-08 12.58.33.png
Finally for now we add a filter characteristic for each set of speakers connected to a physical channel..so subwoofers get cut off from below and above, the door mid range and tweeter get cut off from the bottom and the woofers get cut off from below and above..this is done so they don't fight each other but complimentt each other, avoid using power to drive redundant or inefficient areas and avoid 'flaws' in the design .All sorts of tricks done digitally here, boosting or reducing specifc frequencies using a parametric equaliser, altering the steepness of the curves in 6db increments and using different filters, Butterworth, Bessel, Linkwitz, Tschebyschev or custom to tweak these aspects.



So we are now done as far as the basic set up is..the next stages have to be done in the car..where pink noise is played and we see how in the real world the speakers, their locations and the interiorof the car affect the actual sound..then a real time analyser does very clever stuff, which along with time aligment, phase shifts and changes in individual frequencies (per channel) and their levels related to the reference are all twiddled with either manually of automically or both!Screenshot 2022-02-08 12.58.56.png

But that's for another day.
 
Another wet weekend so did some bench testing of the Match 10 DSP and the Director the little off baord unit that going to fit in the ash tray and allow you to do several tricks with the DSP including the one of..how do you set it up to play at 70 mph and what about rood up and roof down..you can load different DSP set ups in real time to suit every occasion (well 10 of them).so you can have a 'hooning in sprts mode+ with top down over rough scottish roads' or 'pottering along at 30 mph in a south east billiard smooth road'

Did a quick youtube too..enjoy

https://youtu.be/dgdGfSq6KGs
 

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I assume the final setup occurs once in the car with the engine running.

Sound is very personal thing.

My aviation doctor could tell what type of aircraft you have flown doing the hearing audio test, by what frequencies your hearing lost.
Personally i have tinnitus from 40+ years in light aircraft, so quite happy with the standard set up with a few extra tweeters.
 
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