The auto vs manual debate

[Rockhopper]

I've had my licence for over forty years now. I'd only ever driven manuals up till maybe ten years ago when i bought my Focus with the Ford "Powershift" DSG gearbox. I cannot actually remember why I decided to go down that route! These boxes have their issues but on the diesel engined Fords they are very good and reliable. Its a very very good driving experience and changed gear far better that i ever could.
When I needed to change to a petrol car I went for the E85 3.0i auto - its a traditional 5 speed torque converter gearbox which whilst nowhere near as good as a DSG box its still not bad. Put it in sport and plant your foot into the Axminster and it really takes off. Around town its just superb. I'm averaging 27mpg which is mostly around town. On a motorway trip I reset the computer and it was getting over 40mpg.
I'm very happy with it and have no intention to change it but having said that I'd never driven a manual Z4.

My Mrs has a newish Ford Puma with a manual six speed box - i can swap between both types of box with no issue whatsoever - but to be brutally honest the manual gear box is just a ball ache in normal usage. The only reason she went for it is that it was about £1500 cheaper than the auto version.

In my view there is no debate - its whichever you prefer.

 

[Zed Baron]

Just test drove an auto 23i
Think auto is definitely the way forward!
However the 23i felt underpowered. Less powered than the diesel Volvo I used to have.

Did you have it in sports mode and use the paddles?

 

[deltasierra]

A 2.5 or 3.0 auto feels docile even slow until you press the sport button then they really take off, for touring or around town they are much better to drive, on the track or driving flat out, manual of course is a better choice. That’s why most new high performance cars come with auto.

 

[Geddin]

I tried with the paddles, but didn't pop it in sports mode, I assumed sports mode only mattered when not using the paddles..

 

[Zed Baron]

I tried with the paddles, but didn't pop it in sports mode, I assumed sports mode only mattered when not using the paddles..

When I bought my 23i auto, I thought I made big mistake (especially after an aluminium 4.2 Jag), I drove it home and thought hmmmm. Next morning (which was a Sunday) I took it out early up the back roads and discovered the sport button :evil: , combined with the paddles and a heavy right foot I came back with a smile. Don't confuse it with Sports+ mode... it is only really for the brave, make sure it's dry before you try! My G29 30i is the same, in eco or comfort mode it toodles along, put it into sport/sport+/sport individual it's like putting the spurs to it! Its caught me out a couple of times.

 

[Geddin]

Now I feel like I missed out on the test drive.

Either way still think I’ll aim for a 3.0, but I’ll not rule the 2.5 out just yet

 

[Jembo]

Note to a fellow Volvo owner

Don't ever try the very latest XC40 auto - it's in another league for smoothness everywhere & response.

Bugzy's earlier comment nailed it IMO

 

[Mr Tidy]

I grew up with manual cars, and since 1976 I've only ever had 4 torque convertor Autos. All 6 cylinder petrol cars, 2 were 3 speed and 2 were 4 speed, but they really blunted performance and made them thirsty so every other car I've owned has been manual!

No choice with my MC anyway as they were all manual, so if I did decide to try an E89 I'd look for a manual 35i. But my Z4 is a fun car so doesn't tend to get used in traffic, and now I'm retired my manual daily doesn't if I can possibly avoid it.

But maybe I should try a 6 or 8 speed Auto sometime?

FWIW OP the 23i does seem to need to be revved hard to perform, if my experience of the same engines in 3 Series is anything to go by. After a year of 325i I replaced it with a 330i that I've had over 5 years!

 

[Nanu]

Having to take one hand off the steering wheel to change gear is just so last year. Couple that with pushing a pedal with your foot just makes the decision so simple.

Manuals are far too much effort for so little if any gain.

PS Never did like manual labour

 

[Mr Tidy]

I've always thought if you want a job done properly do it yourself!

 

[flybobbie]

Manual is clunky and notchy, go auto.
Can't see how the manual 23 is faster than the auto 23i. You have to wait to change 1-2.

 

[Nathanio]

I've moved from an e85 3.0i manual to an E89 30i auto because of a bad ankle injury and struggling to use the clutch properly since.

There are times when I miss the manual, I loved a good down shift with a rev match to get a nice sweet shift. You don't get the same with the auto imo, it changes down when I ask, but doesn't have the same effect.

The paddles really help the car. I don't have these in my DSG Superb and do notice it now.

But for those days when I am using the car for pootling back from work the auto is streets ahead. The CDV in the e85 made for an inconsistent clutch and made me feel like a noob occasionally.

The e89 suits an auto imo, probably more than the e85 would've.

 

[Argyll Andy]

Don't confuse it with Sports+ mode... it is only really for the brave, make sure it's dry before you try!

That’s the mode I drive mine in most of the time Rich

 

[Bombur]

I was only considering a E89 manual, its a weekend car. I'm happy with it and glad I went manual. Each to their own obviously and can see the benefits of Auto if its a daily or is used on long trips on regular basis.

 

[Zed Baron]

Don't confuse it with Sports+ mode... it is only really for the brave, make sure it's dry before you try!

That’s the mode I drive mine in most of the time Rich

You brave man Andy! I got caught out just outside Stirling on a big roundabout in the wet, it must of been in sport+ and I noticed the back end catching up with the front end! Maybe white leather seats are not the best colour to have :w00t:

 

[Nanu]

if your auto has a paddle shift option, best of both worlds.

I only use the paddles with sport mode when the wife is not in the passenger seat however :evil:

 

[Silverstar]

Don't confuse it with Sports+ mode... it is only really for the brave, make sure it's dry before you try!

That’s the mode I drive mine in most of the time Rich

You brave man Andy! I got caught out just outside Stirling on a big roundabout in the wet, it must of been in sport+ and I noticed the back end catching up with the front end! Maybe white leather seats are not the best colour to have :w00t:

I thought sport+ doesn't totally deactivate the DSC and only deactivates traction control so you get some slip but still have a safety net. Only if you press and hold the traction button do you switch off both DSC and traction which then can lead to trouble. Is this not correct?

 

[Jollygiant]

My E85 is manual and I love it for the fact you are more involved in the mechanics of driving it, but then again I love the fact there are no buttons on the steering wheel for the same reason.

My daily is a 5 Series Touring with the 8 speed auto and paddle shift, which is also lovely for every day driving and bit of occasional fun, but it really comes into it's own on long drives in traffic.

To me you want a little sports car to be all about the actual driving mechanics, unless you race, but that's a completely different setup anyway.