The jab ..

[Stevo1987]

saw that there were a couple of NHS staff that took the thing and ended up being ill, allergic reactions it seems, hopefully that can be ironed out!

I am sure it will be fine once it it has killed off a few hundred oldies.

probably stray into the thousands

Im also hearing that its fkin brutal the effects of the vaccine are really bad on everyone.... defies the point! lol

Hey, tut tut, get with the programme....

 

[Flyingfifer]

I am sure it will be fine once it it has killed off a few hundred oldies.

probably stray into the thousands

Im also hearing that its fkin brutal the effects of the vaccine are really bad on everyone.... defies the point! lol

Hey, tut tut, get with the programme....

Right enough, better tow the line or I wont get my freedom loicense

 

[enuff_zed]

If we removed all the 'I heard', 'someone said', 'my mate reckons', 'it's all over twitter/facebook/etc' - then the world-wide discussion surrounding Covid would probably decrease 100-fold.
And who knows, heaven forbid, the truth may just sneak into view. :roll:

 

[firebobby]

Apparently, the two NHS staff who had side effects where of the the "very sensitive" variety so no worries for the rest of us.
Oh, and no side effects form the flu jab so far, not even a sore arm

 

[sars]

I don’t think it’s for me to attempt to change your mind but a neighbours fit and healthy mid 30’s daughter is still suffering several weeks afterwards.

We’ve all heard the my Grandfather smoked 60 Woodbines a day stories but I don’t think it signifies smoking is safe.

I have attached a document that me and my mates were chatting about the other day.

It's about a month old but if you want the most up to date it will be on the office of national statistics.

Under 65 years of age (mentioned on the death cert - not the main cause of death) from Covid 5,584 people in the UK have died.

Under 65 years of age (mentioned on the death cert - not the main cause of death) from Influenza and Pneumonia 7,116 people in the UK have died.

Look I respect that you have your point of view and it won't change but this year Influenza and Pneumonia has killed around circa 36% more people Under 65 years of age (5,584 vs 7,116) than covid has this year. And these numbers are down because we have all stopped our lives compared to the years before.

Influenza and Pneumonia have killed on a 5 year average 336,483 people of all ages a year. Covid so far from March is at 55k now?

Do I think we should throw off our masks and cuddle each other? No. Do I think that we should be careful and should manager our risk- of course. But the realities are is that this King Kong than you see is a Tiger cat to alot of people. Those people that will be shafted by covid are likely to also get done over by a bad dose of flu. Do I have a flu jab to protest them from catching it? No. They have a flu jab to protect their immune system from it and they will also have a covid jab now to protect themselves from it.

You don't have a problem with people not having a Flu virus jab but yet you have issues with people not having a covid jab. :?

Nice to see some rational and logical thoughts on such an emotional topic. Given the impact of the coronavirus in the USA there is some really interesting data on the CDC website, the standouts

If your less than 24 years old you are 96 times more likely to die from something other than COVID-19
60% of all deaths from COVID-19 are in people aged 75 and over, though the proportion is only 10% of all deaths in that age group
The mortality rate for 85 year olds is 630 x that of 18 - 29 year olds. One caveat, is that the old and infirm have, by and large, isolated themselves so the mortality rate in that demographic could be higher.

We have finite resources, thus we should concentrate the vaccines on those most vulnerable, giving it to children and adults, <30 years, unless there is a medical need is a waste of resources.

You have a right to choose not to have it, I certainly will if I’m given the choice, but I see it pretty pointless to give it to my healthy 18 year old daughter, but that is her choice to make.

 

[exdos]

We have finite resources, thus we should concentrate the vaccines on those most vulnerable, giving it to children and adults, <30 years, unless there is a medical need is a waste of resources.

You are completely missing the point.

Although younger people are highly unlikely to die of C-19 or even have a serious illness from the virus, they can still become infected by the virus, and whilst infected, they can spread it to others, thus perpetuating the pandemic.

The extremely high incidence of C-19 in Care Homes demonstrates that younger people employed as care workers, can bring the virus into the care homes, where it can spread rapidly and tragically amongst the elderly residents, whom lie within the most vulnerable groups on account of age and co-morbidities, where it can then spread amongst other care workers who take the virus back outside the care home into the wider community, where they can then spread the virus to all the age groups not in care homes, including both you and your daughter, etc.

The rationale of a vaccination programme is not about protecting individuals only, but is all about protecting the greatest number of the wider population at large.

Whilst individuals within the UK do have freedom of choice to be vaccinated or not, it seems clear to me that those whom will not participate either do not understand how vaccination programmes operate or they selfishly choose not to seek to protect the most vulnerable in our society.

A vaccination programme with a very high uptake of the vaccine by the population will create the much needed herd-immunity so that normal life in the UK can be resumed as soon as possible.

 

[Thrustyjust]

A friends mother has been contacted by the NHS about having the first jab on Tuesday coming. She lives in Reading. Not in a care home either. No idea on why she was picked although surname is Chambers, so early in the alphabet . I will advise if she grows extra ears or spits out the tracker chip :roll:

 

[pvr]

I think even the government has stated that the vaccine is not helping the pandemic coming to an end, just that it reduces the impact of the illness.

Don’t think there is any data available yet to suggest that the vaccine stops the actual spread.

 

[exdos]

Anyone want to tell [ref]exdos[/ref], that even if he/she has the jab he/she will still have the ability to infect others? The jab only gives you some form of guarantee of not getting seriously ill.

If someone without antibodies to the C-19 virus becomes infected, then the virus will use the victims own cells to replicate the virus in considerably greater numbers than the infected viral dose which the victim received to become infected. During that phase of infection, the victim will become a viral "factory" thus enabling the victim to become a viral "spreader" transmitting the virus to all the other people with whom the victim comes into close contact.

Once someone has either, recovered from C-19 infection and has developed sufficient antibodies, or, has been successfully vaccinated, thereafter, any future infection to such person by C-19 should be resisted within that person's body by the antibodies destroying the virus units, thus preventing the virus from replicating within the person, limiting the seriousness of infection AND considerably reducing the viral load that can be passed on to others.

You clearly don't understand the modus operandi of viruses.

 

[maxman]

mgrlane ,what right have you to try and influence people not to take the vaccine.You are within your rights to refuse it,selfish though that is .You now have gone past the point of being boring.

 

[TitanTim]

Personally I think you would be mad not have the vaccine, more of the population who have it young and old the better, spend less time, money and resources messing about with mass testing in tier 3 areas and use it rolling out the vaccine especially as figures suggest people testing positive are simply not self isolating anyways.

You also don't have a clue how you will react to the virus good or bad but as said taking the vaccine is a personal choice.

Of course once all this is over next year we will all be starving through food shortages or unable to afford the new food tarrifs with a no deal Brexit looming.

Just ensure you shop with Tesco as they seem to have the foresight with stockpiling :?

Tim.

 

[john-e89]

It may be fact that more die of flu etc, but winter is a hard enough time for the NHS as is, do they need another huge burden of Covid patients taking up beds and staff with longer recovery times, more staff and equipment needed per patient than flu...? Not to mention the huge backlog of cancelled operations people are desperate for.

It’s not always the stats of the virus itself that needs to be picked over, it’s the wider consequence of it that is kicking the hell out of the system that’s doing as much harm health wise.

 

[exdos]

If you get vaccinated, it’s not clear if you can still get infected, not develop symptoms, and possibly pass the virus on to others. That’s why even if you get vaccinated, you still need to wear a mask and maintain social distancing.

Viruses have absolutely no means of replication of their own and can only replicate by using the host's own cellular replication apparatus. Therefore, if the virus units can be destroyed by antibodies/immunity before they have a chance to invade the host's cells, then they have no means of replication, so minimal numbers of virus could be retransmitted from a vaccinated/immune host. Read some proper text books on virology.

Please don't replicate your anti-vax propaganda to me because I'm immune to it.

 

[Nictrix]

If you get vaccinated, it’s not clear if you can still get infected, not develop symptoms, and possibly pass the virus on to others. That’s why even if you get vaccinated, you still need to wear a mask and maintain social distancing.

Viruses have absolutely no means of replication of their own and can only replicate by using the host's own cellular replication apparatus. Therefore, if the virus units can be destroyed by antibodies/immunity before they have a chance to invade the host's cells, then they have no means of replication, so minimal numbers of virus could be retransmitted from a vaccinated/immune host. Read some proper text books on virology.

Please don't replicate your anti-vax propaganda to me because I'm immune to it.

I am not an antivaxer.

Question for you then. Boris had the virus? Then a month or so later he had to self isolate after coming into contact with someone who had the virus.

Why do you think that is?

Because he didnt have it the first time :lol: :lol:
He was in the clinic drying out :lol: :lol:

 

[exdos]

Question for you then. Boris had the virus? Then a month or so later he had to self isolate after coming into contact with someone who had the virus.

Why do you think that is?

Simple: because those are the government's rules and Boris was demonstrating the example.

The concept of viral replication is difficult for most people to understand. So rather than assume the public know anything about virology, disease transmission, vaccination programme theory etc. it is far easier to create a "blanket" policy.

 

[exdos]

And these people that have caught covid twice? Propaganda again?

Who are these people, where do they live, how many of them are there?

 

[exdos]

A quick look at the total number of recorded cases of C-19 in the World https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/ shows presently 71,773,820 cases that have been tested as +ve. Obviously, this will be a gross underestimation of the true numbers of those whom have been infected but have not been tested. Would you care to estimate the true number of those whom have been infected?

Therefore one pro cyclist in your first link and Sanne de Jong in your second reference are statistically totally insignificant.

 

[Stevo1987]

A quick look at the total number of recorded cases of C-19 in the World https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/ shows presently 71,773,820 cases that have been tested as +ve. Obviously, this will be a gross underestimation of the true numbers of those whom have been infected but have not been tested. Would you care to estimate the true number of those whom have been infected?

Therefore one pro cyclist in your first link and Sanne de Jong in your second reference are statistically totally insignificant.

Lies, damned lies, and statistics.

 

[sars]

We have finite resources, thus we should concentrate the vaccines on those most vulnerable, giving it to children and adults, <30 years, unless there is a medical need is a waste of resources.

You are completely missing the point.

Although younger people are highly unlikely to die of C-19 or even have a serious illness from the virus, they can still become infected by the virus, and whilst infected, they can spread it to others, thus perpetuating the pandemic.

The extremely high incidence of C-19 in Care Homes demonstrates that younger people employed as care workers, can bring the virus into the care homes, where it can spread rapidly and tragically amongst the elderly residents, whom lie within the most vulnerable groups on account of age and co-morbidities, where it can then spread amongst other care workers who take the virus back outside the care home into the wider community, where they can then spread the virus to all the age groups not in care homes, including both you and your daughter, etc.

The rationale of a vaccination programme is not about protecting individuals only, but is all about protecting the greatest number of the wider population at large.

Whilst individuals within the UK do have freedom of choice to be vaccinated or not, it seems clear to me that those whom will not participate either do not understand how vaccination programmes operate or they selfishly choose not to seek to protect the most vulnerable in our society.

A vaccination programme with a very high uptake of the vaccine by the population will create the much needed herd-immunity so that normal life in the UK can be resumed as soon as possible.

You are deluded to think that this is going away and can be solved by vaccination anytime soon, why? Three reasons

1) It would require a significant percentage of the global population to be vaccinated within a finite window of time, see 2)
2) The vaccine does not offer indefinite immunity and so we are probably looking at annual or biannual vaccinations
3) At present there is insufficient data to suggest that the vaccines eliminates contagiousness.

COVID-19 is not going away anytime soon and may never be eradicated, as I said previously, the best we can do is protect the most vulnerable by prioritising them with the vaccines and then working down the list of vulnerability. That means if you’re less than 50 years old and do not have an underlying health issue you are at the back of the queue and it will be many months before it’s your turn

Yes I do understand how a virus replicates, yes I do have some idea how vaccinations works, but unfortunately there is just insufficient data on how effective the current batch of vaccines are, what we do know from the published data is that it may prevent you getting seriously ill, unless you’re one of the 5%

 

[exdos]

You are deluded to think that this is going away and can be solved by vaccination anytime soon, why? Three reasons

1) It would require a significant percentage of the global population to be vaccinated within a finite window of time, see 2)
2) The vaccine does not offer indefinite immunity and so we are probably looking at annual or biannual vaccinations
3) At present there is insufficient data to suggest that the vaccines eliminates contagiousness.

COVID-19 is not going away anytime soon and may never be eradicated, as I said previously, the best we can do is protect the most vulnerable by prioritising them with the vaccines and then working down the list of vulnerability. That means if you’re less than 50 years old and do not have an underlying health issue you are at the back of the queue and it will be many months before it’s your turn

Yes I do understand how a virus replicates, yes I do have some idea how vaccinations works, but unfortunately there is just insufficient data on how effective the current batch of vaccines are, what we do know from the published data is that it may prevent you getting seriously ill, unless you’re one of the 5%

I haven't said that C-19 will be going away soon or will be eradicated.

It may end up like influenza, with a reduced lethality and which perpetually mutates and would require seasonal vaccination for the most vulnerable.

Of course the vaccination programme needs to prioritise various groups based on risk of serious illness and death, but note that health professionals in the "front-line" have been prioritised, even if they are under age 50, because if they presently possess no immunity, they could act as viral spreaders, as I've mentioned in a previous posting. The purpose of a vaccination programme is all about PUBLIC Health and NOT about protecting individuals.

As a country, we simply cannot afford to trash our economy by repeated lockdowns and furlough schemes, therefore a vaccination programme costing £50 per head with maximum participation by the public is money well spent.