Not happy with my ///M ride....solutions..??

[DONDP]

Today my mechanic installed the kws. I had to install 10mm spacers at the front so that the wheel wouldn't rub on the spring. Has anyone had to do the same with kw v3s and oem wheels? Once we were at it i also installed 10mm spacers at the rear. It looks really flush at the rear and makes me wonder if it will rub. I took some pics but i don't know how to upload them. So far i haven't gone for a drive. Monday i should be able to do so
i installed the top mounts as advised but he still needs to install the limiter kit.
So far it's on the kw setup but is definitely too low for maltese roads. I will be increasing it to max possible.

I'll get back with my comments afetr driving it

kerstien

I run mine with CSLs and 5mm spacers on the front only. I haven't tried it without spacers so not sure if they are needed or not. I run the spacers as the CSLs have a marginally higher offset than the oem 224s. Also widening the front track whilst keeping the rears the same should help reduce understeer so I am told...

Looking forward to your reviews

 

[kerstien]

I got my car back this evening. The settings are nearly on the softest for now. I will have a go at different settings over the weekend. So far the car is definitely more comfortable than stock. The fact that the back is less bumpy makes it loose traction more gradually if that makes any sense. I will however set the front to a more stiff setting as advised previously.

Once we raised the car closer to stock height we no longer required spacers. On the setup sent over by kw it was alot lower so was rubbing up front. At the movement the back reservoir seems to be hitting the body undere compression. Has anyone experienced this? I will be going over to the agent for him to have a look.
Everywhere that I read mentioned that even on the highest setting, the kws are still slightly lower than stock. At the moment my car is sitting higher than stock up front. Do they eventually settle down? My car from body to centre wheel was about 36.5cm with oem setup. The front is about 38

I can't wait to settle these issues and have her setup properly. Thanks for all the help

Kerstien

 

[kerstien]

I too have pulled the plunge and ordered kw v3s after reading all the info supplied by exdos. Thank you for providing so much information on the matter. My car is a DD and I just can't live with the bumpy ride on the bad roads we have In Malta.

Is there anything else I need to update whilst installing the new suspension?
Exdos I tried looking up your alignment settings and from what I gathered you are running 0 toe front and back, -1.3 camber front and -1.0 camber rear. Can you confirm these settings and are they adaptable for daily driving?

Dondp, since the kws have so many settings can you maybe suggest where I should start from.

Thanks

Kerstien

Sure no problem for the road I have settled on the following (all settings are from full hard (+) or full clockwise)

Front 5 clicks rebound 1 turn(6 clicks) compression
Rear 12 clicks rebound. 0.75 turns compression (roughly 5 clicks if you can feel them)

And for track:

Front 5 clicks rebound 0.66 turns (4 clicks) compression
Rear 8 clicks rebound. 0.75 turns compression (roughly 5 clicks if you can feel them)

Depending on the track and conditions I sometimes soften the compression on the rear too 1 full turn if I want to reduce a bit of oversteer.

My setup has an Alan key for the front shocks whereas the rear have a roller knob with numbers for both bound and rebound. Are yours set te same way? Asking since for your rear settings you still quote clicks.

Thanks

Kerstien

 

[Beedub]

I got my car back this evening. The settings are nearly on the softest for now. I will have a go at different settings over the weekend. So far the car is definitely more comfortable than stock. The fact that the back is less bumpy makes it loose traction more gradually if that makes any sense. I will however set the front to a more stiff setting as advised previously.

Once we raised the car closer to stock height we no longer required spacers. On the setup sent over by kw it was alot lower so was rubbing up front. At the movement the back reservoir seems to be hitting the body undere compression. Has anyone experienced this? I will be going over to the agent for him to have a look.
Everywhere that I read mentioned that even on the highest setting, the kws are still slightly lower than stock. At the moment my car is sitting higher than stock up front. Do they eventually settle down? My car from body to centre wheel was about 36.5cm with oem setup. The front is about 38

I can't wait to settle these issues and have her setup properly. Thanks for all the help

Kerstien

the back external canisters are LARGER on the clubsport and are no-where near the car body.... the are orientated on the outboard of the damper case, so basically for them to be inboard you'd have to have the dampers in the wrong side, so im willing to bet your got the Right and left hand units mixed up, the canister should sit closer to the calliper.... this way the shock case is closer to the body of the car and clears with massive space, and ive used the suspension to is fullest with track tyres.... in terms of the ride height my KW clubsport units were MUCH lower on their highest setting than the stock car, this NEARLY forced me to return them as i was kinda disappointed, luckily theirs still more than enough ground clearance for speed humps, curbs, heavy gradients and even the most severe of road compressions... but i wanted a stock ride height.... but on the grand scheme of things its till higher than lowering springs so i'm happy....

canister orientation

ride height, (around 2 fingers between tyre and arch lip)

Roll and pitching/squatting is now all but eliminated

Braking from 105mph foot stamped as hard as i can go before tight right hander

 

[kerstien]

I got my car back this evening. The settings are nearly on the softest for now. I will have a go at different settings over the weekend. So far the car is definitely more comfortable than stock. The fact that the back is less bumpy makes it loose traction more gradually if that makes any sense. I will however set the front to a more stiff setting as advised previously.

Once we raised the car closer to stock height we no longer required spacers. On the setup sent over by kw it was alot lower so was rubbing up front. At the movement the back reservoir seems to be hitting the body undere compression. Has anyone experienced this? I will be going over to the agent for him to have a look.
Everywhere that I read mentioned that even on the highest setting, the kws are still slightly lower than stock. At the moment my car is sitting higher than stock up front. Do they eventually settle down? My car from body to centre wheel was about 36.5cm with oem setup. The front is about 38

I can't wait to settle these issues and have her setup properly. Thanks for all the help

Kerstien

the back external canisters are LARGER on the clubsport and are no-where near the car body.... the are orientated on the outboard of the damper case, so basically for them to be inboard you'd have to have the dampers in the wrong side, so im willing to bet your got the Right and left hand units mixed up, the canister should sit closer to the calliper.... this way the shock case is closer to the body of the car and clears with massive space, and ive used the suspension to is fullest with track tyres.... in terms of the ride height my KW clubsport units were MUCH lower on their highest setting than the stock car, this NEARLY forced me to return them as i was kinda disappointed, luckily theirs still more than enough ground clearance for speed humps, curbs, heavy gradients and even the most severe of road compressions... but i wanted a stock ride height.... but on the grand scheme of things its till higher than lowering springs so i'm happy....

canister orientation

ride height, (around 2 fingers between tyre and arch lip)

Roll and pitching/squatting is now all but eliminated

Braking from 105mph foot stamped as hard as i can go before tight right hander

Thanks for that Beedub. Had a look below the car and I'm quite sure your are correct. I'm taking the car to the mechanic at 2 to have a look. Hopefully that's one thing solved. Ill report back

The drop looks perfect on your car. I live the way the gap look even all round. Do you remember how many fingers fit before the swap? You really have removed pitching. That braking pick looks like the car is level
Mine is driving like a boat at the moment. Would you know if our cars are level as standard? Or should the front be dropped slightly more?

Thanks

Kerstien

 

[Beedub]

hmmmm i was alittle dissapointed with the lowness but it is even all round.... but in hindsight its not that low at all really and looks higher in the flesh than most spring only shod cars..... travel = compliancy.... not interested at all in the low look of the car, performance is essential to me. i added a small amount of rake angel but imo its not needed for a road car.

 

[kerstien]

hmmmm i was alittle dissapointed with the lowness but it is even all round.... but in hindsight its not that low at all really and looks higher in the flesh than most spring only shod cars..... travel = compliancy.... not interested at all in the low look of the car, performance is essential to me. i added a small amount of rake angel but imo its not needed for a road car.

Little update after my visit to the mechanic...you were correct beedub. thanks for that. The top mounts came handy as reversing them took no time (thanks Exdos for the tip)

Whilst there I quickly setup the car using DONDPs settings. What a difference. Just had a quick drive but the car definitely feels more planted. The front is definitely staying much more level in the corners and the bak isn't bouncing around. I also installed the RTAB limiter kit. I will play around with the setting over the weekend and will also lower the fronts it's still too high.

Thanks guys for all the help. Exdos thanks for the constant mention that the ride can be improved with an aftermarket setup. Your constant reminder made me pull the trigger.

Kerstien

 

[exdos]

Exdos thanks for the constant mention that the ride can be improved with an aftermarket setup. Your constant reminder made me pull the trigger.

Kerstien, It sounds as though your suspension set-up is now coming together nicely. Just remember for your fast-road settings to keep the back end softer than the front and keep the rear rebound setting the softest of them all to preserve the ride quality.

 

[gwatson]

Sounds promising, glad you got it sorted.

If the z4m is a keeper I'll be investing in a set of KW3`s in a years time. As we all know, the rear doesn't play ball. I assume with these the ride is much better on our bumpy roads. Hopefully get more grip at lower speeds too.

 

[kerstien]

Exdos thanks for the constant mention that the ride can be improved with an aftermarket setup. Your constant reminder made me pull the trigger.

Kerstien, It sounds as though your suspension set-up is now coming together nicely. Just remember for your fast-road settings to keep the back end softer than the front and keep the rear rebound setting the softest of them all to preserve the ride quality.

So far I'm very happy. We have crap roads here so it already feels better. Due to the loss of traction I drive with dsc always off ( unless raining) and I can definitely feel the rear loosing traction more progressively

I'm currently running setting advised by DONDP

Rebound has 16 settings and bound has 12 settings. Settings are from max hard backwards

FRONT rebound 5 bound 6
REAR rebound 12 bound 5

I st I'll need to drive this for longer and to try different settings. If I go softer with rebound at the rear should I leave bound the same? I should probably be able to o stiffer up front right? Should bound and rebound be increased/ decreased at the same rate or can they be set on opposite sides?

Thanks

Kerstien

 

[exdos]

Rebound has 16 settings and bound has 12 settings. Settings are from max hard backwards

FRONT rebound 5 bound 6
REAR rebound 12 bound 5

I st I'll need to drive this for longer and to try different settings. If I go softer with rebound at the rear should I leave bound the same? I should probably be able to o stiffer up front right? Should bound and rebound be increased/ decreased at the same rate or can they be set on opposite sides?

Thanks

Kerstien

Finding the best settings is a case of trial and error. If the settings don't instantly feel wrong (i.e. too stiff or too hard) then drive the car for a while so that you can discover the driving characteristics and learn to assess whether you think the suspension should be stiffened or softened for rebound/ bump. If the car feels as though the suspension is hard when going over bumps in the road at speed, then try softening the bump settings by one setting at a time, and then reassess. If the suspension feels too reactive, then the rebound should be softened by one setting at a time.

OTOH, if you think that the suspension at either end of the car could be a bit stiffer, then try increasing the settings by one position at a time. By making adjustments and testing, you'll soon get a feel for the handling changes with different settings. If you also make a few written notes of the different settings you try, you'll not get "lost" with what you've already tried. When you've honed in on the right settings, you'll find that just one setting which is "too far" (either soft or hard) will show you that you need to go back to the settings you've just had. Don't be afraid to change just bump or rebound on one axle at a time, to see the change it makes.


Once you've got the suspension set-up to your taste, you should try some changes to the geometry to really make the handling superb.

 

[kerstien]

Rebound has 16 settings and bound has 12 settings. Settings are from max hard backwards

FRONT rebound 5 bound 6
REAR rebound 12 bound 5

I st I'll need to drive this for longer and to try different settings. If I go softer with rebound at the rear should I leave bound the same? I should probably be able to o stiffer up front right? Should bound and rebound be increased/ decreased at the same rate or can they be set on opposite sides?

Thanks

Kerstien

Finding the best settings is a case of trial and error. If the settings don't instantly feel wrong (i.e. too stiff or too hard) then drive the car for a while so that you can discover the driving characteristics and learn to assess whether you think the suspension should be stiffened or softened for rebound/ bump. If the car feels as though the suspension is hard when going over bumps in the road at speed, then try softening the bump settings by one setting at a time, and then reassess. If the suspension feels too reactive, then the rebound should be softened by one setting at a time.

OTOH, if you think that the suspension at either end of the car could be a bit stiffer, then try increasing the settings by one position at a time. By making adjustments and testing, you'll soon get a feel for the handling changes with different settings. If you also make a few written notes of the different settings you try, you'll not get "lost" with what you've already tried. When you've honed in on the right settings, you'll find that just one setting which is "too far" (either soft or hard) will show you that you need to go back to the settings you've just had. Don't be afraid to change just bump or rebound on one axle at a time, to see the change it makes.


Once you've got the suspension set-up to your taste, you should try some changes to the geometry to really make the handling superb.

I took your advise and left this morning with the settings listed above and found it still bouncing slightly at the rear. I then took the rebound at the rear one click down and it's made such a difference. I still have loads of playing around to do by I think I get what you mean.

I intend to try your geo settings once I have the height sorted out. John I think I read that you do this also. Is it complicated? Am I better taking it to a shop for alignment?
One last thing; is your ride height level front to back or is it slightly higher in the front?

Thanks again

Kerstien

 

[exdos]

I took your advise and left this morning with the settings listed above and found it still bouncing slightly at the rear. I then took the rebound at the rear one click down and it's made such a difference. I still have loads of playing around to do by I think I get what you mean.

Excellent! If you are methodical and logical in your approach you soon get to understand what changes you need to make and it makes you a far more perceptive driver.

I intend to try your geo settings once I have the height sorted out. John I think I read that you do this also. Is it complicated? Am I better taking it to a shop for alignment?
One last thing; is your ride height level front to back or is it slightly higher in the front?

Thanks again

Kerstien

Again, setting up the geometry is a logical and methodical process. So if you are thorough and make notes before and after adjustments, it's easy enough to do provided you have a good method of checking the angles.

I have the rear set at OEM height and I've lowered the front by about 10mm more than OEM to increase the rake angle. I've done this to reduce any tendency to lift and I've found my car now very stable at up to 150mph.

 

[kerstien]

Thanks for that John. I'll have a go at ride height and different settings over the weekend

Kerstien

 

[DONDP]

Glad your getting on the with new setup, i think you might have the new adjusters for compression damping on the rear of your KWs whereas i have to use a long needle like tool to move a small dial with holes in it...

A picture probably explains it best...

I just stole the picture off google so not from my actual shock incase you wondered why the rest of it looks odd...

 

[kerstien]

Glad your getting on the with new setup, i think you might have the new adjusters for compression damping on the rear of your KWs whereas i have to use a long needle like tool to move a small dial with holes in it...

A picture probably explains it best...

I just stole the picture off google so not from my actual shock incase you wondered why the rest of it looks odd...

Yes mine are different. They have a roller with numbers stuck on the shock for both rebound and bound. I was wandering what that needle kind of tool was for. :?

Thanks for giving me your settings to start off with. They really helped

Thanks

Kerstien

 

[BonkersBM]

Yes mine are different. They have a roller with numbers stuck on the shock for both rebound and bound. I was wandering what that needle kind of tool was for. :?

Thanks for giving me your settings to start off with. They really helped

Thanks

Kerstien

i wondered the same.. lol

 

[kerstien]

Today i spent the best part of 3 hours sorting out the ride height. the max specified by kw is 360mm from centre wheel to fender on both front and back. The rears are at that height whereas the fronts are slightly less - pne at 359mm and the other at 357mm. I'll let them settle a bit more before getting the fronts at perfect height. The rears are alot easier to measure since it it easy to use a measuring tape.
I haven't fiddled more with bound and reboound settings but today a increased the front bound by one stop as i think it can get firmer - the bonnet still rises and dips at the moment. I'll change settings during the week between drives to meetings and hopefully get to a setting that works best for me.


kerstien

 

[exdos]

Today i spent the best part of 3 hours sorting out the ride height. the max specified by kw is 360mm from centre wheel to fender on both front and back. The rears are at that height whereas the fronts are slightly less - pne at 359mm and the other at 357mm. I'll let them settle a bit more before getting the fronts at perfect height. The rears are alot easier to measure since it it easy to use a measuring tape.
I haven't fiddled more with bound and reboound settings but today a increased the front bound by one stop as i think it can get firmer - the bonnet still rises and dips at the moment. I'll change settings during the week between drives to meetings and hopefully get to a setting that works best for me.


kerstien

Kerstien, I wouldn't stress about ride height being absolute to the mm on both sides L <-> R, because it all changes with tyre wear on individual tyres. Likewise it will change with different loads in the car: i.e. with and without a passenger, luggage and fuel in the tank. Just make sure the front is at least 10mm lower than the rear.

 

[kerstien]

Today i spent the best part of 3 hours sorting out the ride height. the max specified by kw is 360mm from centre wheel to fender on both front and back. The rears are at that height whereas the fronts are slightly less - pne at 359mm and the other at 357mm. I'll let them settle a bit more before getting the fronts at perfect height. The rears are alot easier to measure since it it easy to use a measuring tape.
I haven't fiddled more with bound and reboound settings but today a increased the front bound by one stop as i think it can get firmer - the bonnet still rises and dips at the moment. I'll change settings during the week between drives to meetings and hopefully get to a setting that works best for me.


kerstien

Kerstien, I wouldn't stress about ride height being absolute to the mm on both sides L <-> R, because it all changes with tyre wear on individual tyres. Likewise it will change with different loads in the car: i.e. with and without a passenger, luggage and fuel in the tank. Just make sure the front is at least 10mm lower than the rear.

Thanks for that John....I was going mad trying to get them to match
Is there real need to have the front lower by 10mm? i was trying not to go lower because of the bad roads we have here. The original height form centre wheel to fender was 365mm so i'm basically already about 5-7mm lower than stock. Even at stock height i hit the fangs a few times in the past.

thanks

Kerstien