I personally like to be filled with the spirit..........
M&S & Muslim Staff
- Thread starter TitanTim
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Lol NDB, I will quote you some verses which I came across so we could be firing them like a tennis match but hopefully with no malice. I went to a church of England school so the first religion I became aware of was Christianity but then in later life It had too many contradictions for my heart to settle with not least with the greatest respect because of the many revisions to it by man. I'm not sleepy so I will go see if I can find that bible !
Thing about the Bible is, that it is full of contradictions, mainly due to the fact that lots of it was written after the fact and what was included in it mainly decided by the Council Nicea - this included the wholesale writing out of women ! However, the Christian church ( if you are not part of some nutty fundamentalist movement ) does acknowledge this, hence the move towards women priests, gay marriages, etc. despite the fact that the Bible says no to these.
Ok work this one out - Blue Nun Wine !!!!! 
New Testament King James edition and revised standard version
Leviticus - chapter 11 verse 7
And the swine,though it divides the hoof,having cloven hooves, yet does not chew the cud, is unclean to you
Deuteronomy- chapter 14 verse 8
Also the swine is unclean for you,because it has cloven hooves yet does not chew the cud; you shall not eat their flesh or touch their dead carcasses
Isiah chapter 65 verse 2 - 4
I have stretched out my hands all day long to a rebellious people who walk in a way that is not good, according to their own thoughts; Apeople who provoke me to anger continually to my face, who sacrifice in gardens and burn incense on altars of bricks' who sit among the graves and spend the night in tombs, who eat swines flesh and the broth of abominable things is in their vessels
Ephesians chapter 5 verse 18
And do not be drunk with wine in which is dissipation
Proverbs chapter 20 verse 1
Wine is a mocker, strong drink is a brawler and whoever is led astray by it is not wise
Corinthians chapter 11 verse 6
For if a woman will not veil herself then she should cut off her hair but if it is disgraceful for a woman to be shorn or shaven , let her wear a veil
I can't find the ones that I was looking for but these are some which i'm sure will be on the net so can be looked up.
Anyway I don't really like a debate on important subjects unless its face to face so hope I haven't offended anyone ...God bless and good night :lol:
Leviticus - chapter 11 verse 7
And the swine,though it divides the hoof,having cloven hooves, yet does not chew the cud, is unclean to you
Deuteronomy- chapter 14 verse 8
Also the swine is unclean for you,because it has cloven hooves yet does not chew the cud; you shall not eat their flesh or touch their dead carcasses
Isiah chapter 65 verse 2 - 4
I have stretched out my hands all day long to a rebellious people who walk in a way that is not good, according to their own thoughts; Apeople who provoke me to anger continually to my face, who sacrifice in gardens and burn incense on altars of bricks' who sit among the graves and spend the night in tombs, who eat swines flesh and the broth of abominable things is in their vessels
Ephesians chapter 5 verse 18
And do not be drunk with wine in which is dissipation
Proverbs chapter 20 verse 1
Wine is a mocker, strong drink is a brawler and whoever is led astray by it is not wise
Corinthians chapter 11 verse 6
For if a woman will not veil herself then she should cut off her hair but if it is disgraceful for a woman to be shorn or shaven , let her wear a veil
I can't find the ones that I was looking for but these are some which i'm sure will be on the net so can be looked up.
Anyway I don't really like a debate on important subjects unless its face to face so hope I haven't offended anyone ...God bless and good night :lol:
pvr said:I don't mind a tennis match, at least you do not threaten anyone with a different upbringing or view like someone else on this forum
No problem mate, I was born into a traditional family who didnt practise the faith of Islam in any recognisable way. I became Muslim at age 30 after a lot of reading and questioning. If it doesn't make sense then you cant submit to it.
Once again the Z4-forum proves what a great bunch are on here. The word religion will generally start WWIII on most forums.
I have heard it said that religion would be great were it not for the religious. I see so many within all religions cherry pick one verse from one chapter in there "book", Then make that the main point and use only that one point to pound away at others. To me as a Christian, The beauty of my religion is the fact that it is freewill based. One can choose to be Godly or not. The punishment or not is supposed to happen after one's death and carried out by God, not mortal men. Yet far too many in my faith read the bible and feel so strongly about it that they make laws on non-violent moral issues based on the bible. There are 13 states in America that still have Sodomy laws on the books even though the supreme court struck down all sodomy laws as unconstitutional in 2003. So, even though I'm Christian, My bible clearly states that I must witness to others and spread the word. Yet It also states that if I see someone committing a sin, My ONLY responsibility is to point out to them that they shouldn't do that because of the consequences and pray for them. I do not have the right to punish them for a biblical immoral act nor enact laws mandating that nonbelievers adhere to the morals of the bible. Of course there are some exceptions where there is a violent harmful act involved.
I have heard it said that religion would be great were it not for the religious. I see so many within all religions cherry pick one verse from one chapter in there "book", Then make that the main point and use only that one point to pound away at others. To me as a Christian, The beauty of my religion is the fact that it is freewill based. One can choose to be Godly or not. The punishment or not is supposed to happen after one's death and carried out by God, not mortal men. Yet far too many in my faith read the bible and feel so strongly about it that they make laws on non-violent moral issues based on the bible. There are 13 states in America that still have Sodomy laws on the books even though the supreme court struck down all sodomy laws as unconstitutional in 2003. So, even though I'm Christian, My bible clearly states that I must witness to others and spread the word. Yet It also states that if I see someone committing a sin, My ONLY responsibility is to point out to them that they shouldn't do that because of the consequences and pray for them. I do not have the right to punish them for a biblical immoral act nor enact laws mandating that nonbelievers adhere to the morals of the bible. Of course there are some exceptions where there is a violent harmful act involved.
I hold most religions as paralell sets of rules or codes to control society and maintain some type of civilized life. There are too many similarities (IMHO) for them to be any thing but. If you disregard the modern additions made by the ruling elite to broker power and wealth then it all makes more sense , to me any way. Basic guidelines originally spread as fables or tales to keep the peace...and explain what was then unexplainable.
As for spirits, I tend to go further back, I'm more in line with North America Indians , Druids, the early tribal beliefs of everything having a spirit. Not quite Carlos Castenada peyote eating crazy but close...
If everyone followed their own religious basics we would all be following the same general rules ... just need to get rid of the bits about killing off all the non-believers and heathens etc.
I counted among my friends a Mormon Bishop (retired), a couple of Muslims, a few Jews and a bunch of atheists, agnostics and of course the occasional Christian..( I was brought up C of E)
We all got along and we all knew right from wrong.
Happy Christmas ( or whatever you celebrate after the winter solstice ) to Everyone...
As for spirits, I tend to go further back, I'm more in line with North America Indians , Druids, the early tribal beliefs of everything having a spirit. Not quite Carlos Castenada peyote eating crazy but close...
If everyone followed their own religious basics we would all be following the same general rules ... just need to get rid of the bits about killing off all the non-believers and heathens etc.
I counted among my friends a Mormon Bishop (retired), a couple of Muslims, a few Jews and a bunch of atheists, agnostics and of course the occasional Christian..( I was brought up C of E)
We all got along and we all knew right from wrong.
Happy Christmas ( or whatever you celebrate after the winter solstice ) to Everyone...
A
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pvr said:I don't mind a tennis match, at least you do not threaten anyone with a different upbringing or view like someone else on this forum
I hope thats not aimed at me. I just find some religious things (admittedly, I am ignorant of most of the facts) too over the top and it seems the whole country is so scared of being branded racist, that the country will bend over backwards to accomodate other religions/cultures even at the expense of Christianity. Racism works in both directions.
Most of my thoughts on this subject are based on the media, so could quite well be wrong!
edit: Now know it wasnt aimed at me.
kevinmarkwhite said:pvr said:I don't mind a tennis match, at least you do not threaten anyone with a different upbringing or view like someone else on this forum
I hope thats not aimed at me. I just find some religious things (admittedly, I am ignorant of most of the facts) too over the top and it seems the whole country is so scared of being branded racist, that the country will bend over backwards to accomodate other religions/cultures even at the expense of Christianity. Racism works in both directions.
Most of my thoughts on this subject are based on the media, so could quite well be wrong!
I'd put good money on it not being aimed at you...
I find it concerning the way that we, in this country bend over backwards and pander to every different cultures sensitivity and requirements, no matter how ridiculous.
In the final analysis, all these different religions/cultures are doing is alienating themselves. It does no good for cultural integration, but then again it seems quite clear that in some instances they don't want to integrate, e.g. some want Sharia law in the UK.
For example. if your parents clearly favoured one of your siblings over yourself, there is a strong likelihood that you would grow up with feelings of resentment to that sibling.
Like most of us, I can only go with what the media report and how they choose to report it. Caveat over.
There was a well publicised case of a single mother who got married in the Caribbean. She wanted her young teenage son to give her away, however she couldn't afford to fly out during school holidays because as those with kids will know, the costs get ramped up horrendously. She exercised the only option for her and took her son out of school for a few days and advised the school of the situation. She gets taken to court by the education authority and ends up with a criminal record.
And yet....
Mrs Geezah is a teacher in a secondary school with a high concentration of pupils of Pakistani parentage, some of whom regularly 'dissappear' for weeks on end, even at crucial stages of their exams, to go to Pakistan for 'important' cultural/religious reasons and you can guess what happens to their parents on their return.
Absolutely nothing.
It is the way in which our authorities discriminate against US which gets our backs up, not the other religious/cultural elements of our society, however, I believe they should shoulder some responsibility themselves for ignoring the way in which their actions create resentment.
She should have been told that, she is taking things too far and if she does not want to handle the merchandise that it's employer sells then she should not have taken up the employment. I'm with Sainsburys on this one!
In the final analysis, all these different religions/cultures are doing is alienating themselves. It does no good for cultural integration, but then again it seems quite clear that in some instances they don't want to integrate, e.g. some want Sharia law in the UK.
For example. if your parents clearly favoured one of your siblings over yourself, there is a strong likelihood that you would grow up with feelings of resentment to that sibling.
Like most of us, I can only go with what the media report and how they choose to report it. Caveat over.
There was a well publicised case of a single mother who got married in the Caribbean. She wanted her young teenage son to give her away, however she couldn't afford to fly out during school holidays because as those with kids will know, the costs get ramped up horrendously. She exercised the only option for her and took her son out of school for a few days and advised the school of the situation. She gets taken to court by the education authority and ends up with a criminal record.
And yet....
Mrs Geezah is a teacher in a secondary school with a high concentration of pupils of Pakistani parentage, some of whom regularly 'dissappear' for weeks on end, even at crucial stages of their exams, to go to Pakistan for 'important' cultural/religious reasons and you can guess what happens to their parents on their return.
Absolutely nothing.
It is the way in which our authorities discriminate against US which gets our backs up, not the other religious/cultural elements of our society, however, I believe they should shoulder some responsibility themselves for ignoring the way in which their actions create resentment.
She should have been told that, she is taking things too far and if she does not want to handle the merchandise that it's employer sells then she should not have taken up the employment. I'm with Sainsburys on this one!
As someone who has been to Egypt many times and the Maldives this is so ridiculous.
Been served loads of alcohol in Egypt by Muslims and the bacon at breakfast was great and cooked just nice by the guys in the Maldives.
Does that make them bad people? How ridiculous it all is!!!!!
Been served loads of alcohol in Egypt by Muslims and the bacon at breakfast was great and cooked just nice by the guys in the Maldives.
Does that make them bad people? How ridiculous it all is!!!!!
religion is something people should keep to themselves.
Everyone has their own views and its not anybodies position to question them.
One thing I don't like is people pushing religion on others.
Why apply for a job that she wasn't capable of performing in its entirety...ridiculous.
Everyone has their own views and its not anybodies position to question them.
One thing I don't like is people pushing religion on others.
Why apply for a job that she wasn't capable of performing in its entirety...ridiculous.