List of problems.. Back from dealership with more problems..
- Thread starter JDM
- Start date
JaEdBa said:
You're right, it's not. But it's still worth doing
Stuart Truman said:
Use "without prejudice" carefully. The purpose of the phrase is to facilitate resolution of disputes without resorting to formal legal proceedings, by allowing parties to make arguments and/or offers to settle the dispute, without fear (as you rightly say) that it could prejudice formal legal proceedings further down the line.
The major down-side of this is that communications marked "without prejudice" cannot (generally speaking) be relied on in formal proceedings. This means that if you make a proposal to your dealer as to how to resolve the dispute, you cannot usually rely on having made this proposal later on in formal proceedings, even if you wanted to or if it helped your case. Similarly, if your dealer responds to your correspondence on a without prejudice basis (which is highly likely, since they would not generally be permitted to refer to anything you had said without prejudice in any other way), then you cannot later rely on anything said by your dealer in that without prejudice response in formal proceedings.
To complicate matters, simply marking correspondence "without prejudice" does not make it without prejudice and, conversely, correspondence that is ostensibly "open" (the opposite of "without prejudice") can in fact be without prejudice by its intent or content.
In short, choose your strategy wisely. Using "without prejudice" incorrectly is likely to flag up to a BMW lawyer that you don't know what you are doing and you risk allowing yourself to be tied in knots. The clearest and safest signal that you can send to BMW that you are considering legal action is to say so.
Hence seek guidance! 
A
Anonymous
Guest
I would just write the letter to BMW Financial services explaining the problems you have had with the car, the timescales involved, the damage caused by the dealer. Dont get personal, just list the facts.
You can then say you want a replacement car due to having no confidence in the dealer (i.e. due to the damage) etc.
I didn't threaten any legal action in my letter and they have agreed to replace my car. Still working on the compensation though.
Nothing to stop you seeking legal advice though, or CAB perhaps?
You can then say you want a replacement car due to having no confidence in the dealer (i.e. due to the damage) etc.
I didn't threaten any legal action in my letter and they have agreed to replace my car. Still working on the compensation though.
Nothing to stop you seeking legal advice though, or CAB perhaps?
Just a quick update on this post. The car has been with the dealers over a week now. I dropped it off on Friday 10th August. I haven't heard anything from them since dropping it off which doesnt suprise me to be honest. They have loaned me a lovely 12 plate 530d M Sport with all the bells and whistles on it until its sorted. What a machine that is. The torque is unbeleivable and its returning close to 40MPG and thats booting it.
Thanks Carol.. Im keeping my fingers crossed... and toes... and eyes
The 530d is awesome. If they said to me keep that and we will keep your zed I would probably snap their hand off to be fair. Such a great all rounder.
Any news on when your new baby will be arriving... I mean car before anyone jumps to any conclusions lol.
The 530d is awesome. If they said to me keep that and we will keep your zed I would probably snap their hand off to be fair. Such a great all rounder.
Any news on when your new baby will be arriving... I mean car before anyone jumps to any conclusions lol.
Sometime in September but don't know when.
Waiting to get a call from the DP to take mine in to swap for a loan car til the new one arrives. Should think he'll be in touch this week as they want to get it in to shift it on. Will report on loan car - hoping it will be one of the Olympic fleet. They don't need them now after all!
Waiting to get a call from the DP to take mine in to swap for a loan car til the new one arrives. Should think he'll be in touch this week as they want to get it in to shift it on. Will report on loan car - hoping it will be one of the Olympic fleet. They don't need them now after all!
Car picked up on Saturday and all I am saying is Absolutely FUMING!!!!!!!!
Just sent off another letter...
Dear Sirs
Following on from my previous letters and emails dated the 4th July 2012 and 18th July 2012, you will be aware that my vehicle has been with your dealership for one month (10th August until 8th September inclusive) at your request for all of the previously listed defects to be addressed.
Throughout this period you did provide me with a very nice courtesy car for which I am grateful.
I arrived at the dealership on Saturday morning as agreed with ******** to collect the vehicle as I was informed that all items had been addressed and were to both his and the chief technicians satisfaction after numerous inspections and road tests of the vehicle.
After inspection of the vehicle by myself prior to leaving the dealership, it was noticed that the passenger seat base cover which had been replaced was not only ill fitted, it was in fact a driver’s seat base cover which had been fitted to a passenger seat. This is clear as there is suede material to the full outer edge of the seat cover which should be on the inside and abut the transmission tunnel.
After questioning this with ********, he checked on the system and noted that BMW had in fact sent the wrong seat cover. If this is the case, surely this would have been picked up by either ***** or one of Chief technicians in one of the many inspections of the vehicle prior to allowing me to collect the vehicle? If I noticed it straight away then surely a trained BMW technician should do?
I was also informed that a new seat base cover will never fit as good as when it comes from the factory so will always be more wrinkly and saggy than the other seat. This is not acceptable. Do you think that it is fair that I should have to accept ill fitting seat covers on a brand new car, especially as the seat cover is being replaced due to damage caused prior to me collecting the vehicle on delivery?
I would also like to note that the following defective items still appear to be present.
• The clutch still judders when moving away when the engine is cold.
• The windows still leak when washing the car, despite me being told that the car was water tested over a number of days with no water entering the car. I would like to note that I only wash the car with a garden hose. Do you think that this is acceptable for a brand new car to leak water? I cannot comment on whether rain enters the car as it did before as we have not had any rain since collecting the vehicle.
• The RPM still varies considerably on occasion when the car is ticking over. I am informed by the chief technician the vehicle was showing no faults on the computer and that some fluctuation is normal. I have had numerous BMW’s in the past, 3 of which have been Z4’s and I have never had this problem.
• The semi integrated navigation still freezes.
• The sound system is still disappointing and makes the dash rattle when you turn the volume up.
As I stated in my email on the 17th July, I agreed to give your dealership one final attempt to put right the defective items. I agree that a number of the items have been addressed (damaged trim) but it has now left your dealership with more problems (the seat cover) and as stated earlier in this letter from discussions with ******** and the Chief technician, the seat base could be swapped for the correct one but still will not look as it did when it left the factory.
I feel that I have been very accommodating with all of the issues and your dealerships attempts to put them right over the past 5 months, however; I now wish to formally reject the vehicle and request that a replacement vehicle is provided.
Can you please contact me to discuss my options at your very earliest convenience.
Many thanks
Yours Sincerely
Mr J D Mason
Just sent off another letter...
Dear Sirs
Following on from my previous letters and emails dated the 4th July 2012 and 18th July 2012, you will be aware that my vehicle has been with your dealership for one month (10th August until 8th September inclusive) at your request for all of the previously listed defects to be addressed.
Throughout this period you did provide me with a very nice courtesy car for which I am grateful.
I arrived at the dealership on Saturday morning as agreed with ******** to collect the vehicle as I was informed that all items had been addressed and were to both his and the chief technicians satisfaction after numerous inspections and road tests of the vehicle.
After inspection of the vehicle by myself prior to leaving the dealership, it was noticed that the passenger seat base cover which had been replaced was not only ill fitted, it was in fact a driver’s seat base cover which had been fitted to a passenger seat. This is clear as there is suede material to the full outer edge of the seat cover which should be on the inside and abut the transmission tunnel.
After questioning this with ********, he checked on the system and noted that BMW had in fact sent the wrong seat cover. If this is the case, surely this would have been picked up by either ***** or one of Chief technicians in one of the many inspections of the vehicle prior to allowing me to collect the vehicle? If I noticed it straight away then surely a trained BMW technician should do?
I was also informed that a new seat base cover will never fit as good as when it comes from the factory so will always be more wrinkly and saggy than the other seat. This is not acceptable. Do you think that it is fair that I should have to accept ill fitting seat covers on a brand new car, especially as the seat cover is being replaced due to damage caused prior to me collecting the vehicle on delivery?
I would also like to note that the following defective items still appear to be present.
• The clutch still judders when moving away when the engine is cold.
• The windows still leak when washing the car, despite me being told that the car was water tested over a number of days with no water entering the car. I would like to note that I only wash the car with a garden hose. Do you think that this is acceptable for a brand new car to leak water? I cannot comment on whether rain enters the car as it did before as we have not had any rain since collecting the vehicle.
• The RPM still varies considerably on occasion when the car is ticking over. I am informed by the chief technician the vehicle was showing no faults on the computer and that some fluctuation is normal. I have had numerous BMW’s in the past, 3 of which have been Z4’s and I have never had this problem.
• The semi integrated navigation still freezes.
• The sound system is still disappointing and makes the dash rattle when you turn the volume up.
As I stated in my email on the 17th July, I agreed to give your dealership one final attempt to put right the defective items. I agree that a number of the items have been addressed (damaged trim) but it has now left your dealership with more problems (the seat cover) and as stated earlier in this letter from discussions with ******** and the Chief technician, the seat base could be swapped for the correct one but still will not look as it did when it left the factory.
I feel that I have been very accommodating with all of the issues and your dealerships attempts to put them right over the past 5 months, however; I now wish to formally reject the vehicle and request that a replacement vehicle is provided.
Can you please contact me to discuss my options at your very earliest convenience.
Many thanks
Yours Sincerely
Mr J D Mason
OK.. So here's a couple of pics showing the new seat cover...
Drivers thigh support (standard from factory)
Passenger thigh support very baggy at edges (recently replaced by dealer)
Drivers seat cover (standard from factory)
Passenger seat cover very wrinkly where it meats the back section (recenty replaced by dealer)
Passenger seat cover with suede to outside face (recently replaced by dealer)
Drivers thigh support (standard from factory)
Passenger thigh support very baggy at edges (recently replaced by dealer)
Drivers seat cover (standard from factory)
Passenger seat cover very wrinkly where it meats the back section (recenty replaced by dealer)
Passenger seat cover with suede to outside face (recently replaced by dealer)
