ESS Supercharger

pilchardthecat

Active member
I'm tempted. What else would i need to do to the car so i don't die?

- Some sort of big brake upgrade (will these fit with the stock wheels? - i really don't want anything bigger than 18")
- Some noisy back boxes (the car would be retired from commuting duties)
- Strut brace... what other suspension changes would be a good idea? I want the car to remain compliant on country/bumpy roads.

My car has about 63,000 miles on it now, and by the time i have garage/workshop built to put it in it will probably be about 70k - does this make it less suitable for a forced induction modification?
 
I'm sorta thinking the same as you.

Just got suspension and supercharger left to do.
Next year.....I hope.

Leaning towards Bilsteins and a VF570.

Perhaps just get your rod bearings done before the supercharger?
 
Byron (Beedub) is your font of knowledge on FI.

As you probably know, I'm an advocate of adjustable suspension such as KWV3 and AC Schnitzer Racing which allows you to set up the car for fast road use as well as track. When properly set up, it's far more compliant than OEM and considerably improves the handling/ride.
 
Well, I'm doing the brakes (Alcon calipers, OEM discs) and suspension (Bilstein B16/PSS10) over the winter (and at over 100k miles). It's also having new bushes & suspension components all round as part of it's century makeover. Hopefully all in time for our first 'Ring trip of 2014 in April.

Did ask Bilsteins technical department if I could have custom B16s for the Z4M with the RideControl/IRC kit on - but despite them saying they could customise everything, they simply said they've got no plans to to Ridecontrol/IRC for the Z4M.

Supercharger is on the horizon, but my specialist (and his supercar specialist mate) have persuaded me to let them devise/select/build a supercharger set-up for mine. Until I know what they're planning and the cost, I don't know if I'll go ahead with them or simply drop it off at Simpsons.
 
with recent rod bearing threads im going to guess the added TQ will be hurting these more quickly, at 60k miles id 100% swap rod bearings before bolting on the supercharger, sorry to be a naysayer and negative talker.. The ess setup is wonderful imo, still the best mod ive ever done to a car... period, the list of things that have been changed is now getting pretty serious, the last being the rear DSS 1000hp rated drive shafts, and a new feramic clutch.... Brakes is a definite must...
 
If there is serious interest in the ESS SC, we should enquire aboout a group buy. I'm back in the UK in February so hope to be be fitting a supercharger next year. I have the following suspension upgrades waiting to be fitted on my return: KW Clubsports, Rogue rear shock mounts, Turner rear trailing arm bush limiter kit, and H&R front and rear sway bars. I already have a strut brace, so that should be it for me as far as suspension upgrades go (although I'm thinking about asking MachineMonkey if he can fabricate a rear strut brace if it looks to be possible once I've fitted the new top mounts). I'm looking for a BBK at the moment but cannot find the AP Racing kit I want at a reasonable price, so I'm considering other options. I'll also be fitting the Exdos brake cooling mod when I'm fitting all of the above, and when I fit the SC I'll fit new engine mounts.
As a side point, my car has been heavily tracked in my ownership and driven very enthusiastically on the road. I had my bearing shells checked (and replaced) at 50K miles when I was having other engine work done. They were pristine.
 
Will you need the RTAB limiters if you go for aftermarket bushes, or are you sticking with OEM/Meyle rubber ones?
 
BMWZ4MC said:
If there is serious interest in the ESS SC, we should enquire aboout a group buy. I'm back in the UK in February so hope to be be fitting a supercharger next year. I have the following suspension upgrades waiting to be fitted on my return: KW Clubsports, Rogue rear shock mounts, Turner rear trailing arm bush limiter kit, and H&R front and rear sway bars. I already have a strut brace, so that should be it for me as far as suspension upgrades go (although I'm thinking about asking MachineMonkey if he can fabricate a rear strut brace if it looks to be possible once I've fitted the new top mounts). I'm looking for a BBK at the moment but cannot find the AP Racing kit I want at a reasonable price, so I'm considering other options. I'll also be fitting the Exdos brake cooling mod when I'm fitting all of the above, and when I fit the SC I'll fit new engine mounts.
As a side point, my car has been heavily tracked in my ownership and driven very enthusiastically on the road. I had my bearing shells checked (and replaced) at 50K miles when I was having other engine work done. They were pristine.


Great news about the shells, really great news, i WISH WSH you'd have posted pics at the time, Re the s/c kit id love to meet up with All of you really as maybe a s/c meeting to give you all the low down, on general ownership, i'll be heading into my 3rd iteration of s/c life shortly...!! Extracting further power is dangerously easily once the hardware is in place.... The engine comes alive with boost, it really feels like a modern unit with massive mid-range/top end clout.... As Long as your maintaining to car to a high standard ( a must) then imo this car with the s/c kit in place is just as reliable as before.... and the noise..... the noise alone is worth the cost.... To hear the s54 overlaid with s/c whines, whistles and pops.... incredible....
 
mmm-five said:
Will you need the RTAB limiters if you go for aftermarket bushes, or are you sticking with OEM/Meyle rubber ones?

I've read mixed reviews of aftermarket polyurethane bushes - those opposed to their use have mentioned squeaking as an annoyance and of greater concern that they restrict rotational movements or even bind. The conclusion I came to after reading the links below was that OEM / other rubber bushes with a RTAB limiter kit was the best solution.

m3forum.net said:
A few useful posts on Poly vs. Rubber RTABs.

Fair View Post said:
We always say for the Rear Trailing Arm Bushing on the E36/46 BMW rear suspension, either "go spherical" or "stay rubber and use limiters".

After seeing too many issues with poly RTAB and LCA bushings when used in street cars and dual use cars, I just can't recommend them for those situations. Polyurethane is too stiff a material (generally, although there is a large range of durometers available) to allow for the proper articulation that this (and the front LCA) bushing needs during suspension travel. Poly tends to only work well for static bushings or mounts (diff mounts, motor mounts), or ones that pivot in one direction only (a single axis suspension bushing). The RTAB goes through a dual axis of rotation and using a material that has very little flex will add bind in this joint. This can cause erratic rear suspension characteristics, especially with a certain range of spring rates and/or on cars that see use on roads or tracks that aren't perfectly smooth.

Note: Many BMW road course drivers/racers use poly successfully in this RTAB joint (and the LCA) on dedicated race cars with relatively high (or extremely high) spring rates. Some swear by them and will espouse their perfect use and wonder why everyone doesn't jump right on the "put poly everywhere!" band wagon. Remember, bone crushing race car spring rates tend to limit suspension travel substantially, and the bind that can happen with "normal" suspension travel will likely not be seen on these cars when used on a smooth race course with very high spring rates. I'm not saying they are wrong, just that poly works in some situations but not all.

On our 400hp E36 that has 305mm R compounds and makes enough grip to rip your face off, we use rubber RTABs and limiters. There's still "plenty of suspension travel" in the rear of our car (too much, actually) and no bind - its still fairly effortless to drive with no weirdness in the rear suspension, and it puts down power exceptionally well (maybe too well). Its by no means a perfect car, not hardly, but rear suspension bind is not a problem. We've used similar rubber+limiter set-ups in all all manner of E36 and E46 street, race, and dual use cars with zero drama.



Going to spherical bushings in the RTAB is an expensive, somewhat race-only solution, but its the best solution to re-do the RTAB joint if your racing class and/or budget allows. Sphericals work best in many other multi-axis bushing locations, such as the camber plate upper mounts and rear shock mounts - and we recommend them for use in these locations even on "enthusiast" street driven BMWs. Designed and sized properly, spherical bearings can last a very long time in these two locations (maybe indefinitely) with no banging or rattling. The RTAB bushing location, however, is very near ground level (under the car) and would be more directly exposed to road salts/rain/grit than an RSM or camber plate location - which may impact it's long term durability (becomes a wear item like other rod ends and sphericals that also see weather/dirt). Also, installing sphericals into the ends of factory control arm is "a bit more difficult" (that's an understatement).

So if you do not have the resources to use a spherical end in the RTAB location, replace the OEM RTAB with a new M3 rubber bushing and use our's or some other vendor's RTAB limiters. There is pretty broad agreement on the design/shape of BMW RTAB limiters. We chose a self lubricating, ultra high density polymer material for a variety of reasons, while others use Delrin or Nylon (both of which are similar to what we use) or even aluminum for their limiters. These all tend to work similarly and they do allow for the proper articulation at this bushing location, yet limit the deformation that this rubber bushing would normally see. Its what we think is "the best compromise solution". As with much of the BMW front and rear suspension, its all about the best compromise.

Do replace the RTAB bushing every few years or every 30-40K miles, as it is a common wear item. Front LCA bushings are as well, of course. These multi-axis bushings take a beating in normal use and tend to come off of cars torn and cracked after a number of miles.

Just my $.02.



Fair View Post said:
On the order of "years". My E36 M3 has had new rubber RTAB bushings and limiters for the past 4 years and ~45K of street and competition miles (80+ autocrosses and lots of laps) and they are still good (we check them periodically). But with regular track/street use and with limiters, they still do wear out eventually. Of course the limiters should extend the life of the rubber RTABs considerably.

What worries me is that people aren't recognizing that the rubber RTAB bushings wear out because they are functioning correctly. Again, this bushing location needs to be rotating and flexing in multiple directions - something stiffer polyurethane bushings just can't do unless they have a durometer rating that's much lower (softer) than what we usually see. So in an RTAB set-up with stiffer poly bushings.... what's going to flex instead? The chassis or the "tires"? There may be some poly RTAB bushings made in the 50-70A durometer range that might soak up this bind, but I don't keep tabs on what everyone is selling nor have we done testing on every bushing sold for BMWs. Dunno...

Not going to argue that in a race car with stiff enough springs (and significantly limited suspension travel) poly RTABs won't work well... they can work under those conditions and limited travel. But on a street driven car with more suspension travel and significantly stiffer poly bushings they are causing bind. You might not feel it, might not know it, but it is happening. It has to - look at how the rear E36/46 suspension travels in dual arcs. That rubber RTAB bushing is what is supposed to absorb these conflicting arcs of travel, to minimize bind at this location. A spherical bearing can also work with these competing arcs.

The BMW is not the only car that has a dual-axis of rotation and potentially binding suspension bushing - this isn't something new or unique to BMWs, as a lot of cars have similar bushings in the front or rear suspensions (I can name about a dozen off hand). Those cars tend to work best with rubber or spherical bushings at those locations, too. Still, a lot of people put poly in those other car's bushings and eventually figure out it isn't working - yet others never know, or don't care.

One of the first bushing tests I did ~18 years ago was with a similar car afflicted with "dual-axis" rear suspension bushing - a RWD Fox Mustang. It was popular back then to "put poly everywhere!" and several fellow Mustang racers were noting some funky handling after doing a full poly rear bushing swap. We took one of these poly equipped cars and raised it in the air, removed the bars, springs and shocks, and moved the rear suspension.... or tried to. It was stuck after less than an inch of travel. Bound-up completely in both directions, with no springs. We didn't measure the load necessary to overcome the bind in these bushings but it was on the order of an "OMG I can't believe this!" range. That was an eye opener and something that applies to BMWs as well....

What is "too stiff" for a poly RTAB bushing? I don't know. It would be interesting if someone accurately measured the binding loads vs. inches of travel, with various poly bushings on the back of an E36/46 in every location to settle this debate.



Fair View Post said:
Yep. We use the E46 M3 bushings (BMW part numer 33326770817) on all E36 cars as well, and sell several sets every day of these RTAB bushings with our UHMW limiter kits.


We still don't recommend poly RTAB bushings, as they are terrible in bushing locations that have to both pivot and rotate. It can sometimes work on a race car that has limited suspension travel, but on a street car with more travel its not going to last forever, and the inherent bind could lead to bushing failure, funky handling - or worse: failed RTAB buckets.

OEM rubber M3 RTABs + Limiters or a spherical bearing - those are the two proper RTAB upgrade choices that won't rip themselves to bits over time. Of course, the spherical solution doesn't work for many/most racing classes, or street cars, but its a better solution when its class legal.

Cheers,



It's not the definitive be all end all answer people may be looking for, but it's food for thought. There is also plenty more discussion over in Bfc's track section (where I pulled these). The general consensus seems to be that poly is questionable, though it may work without any perceptible issues for most street or track driving.

That said, the oem bushings with delrin limiters provide most of the benefit of poly, without the drawbacks (reduced movement in all axes, noise, need for lubrication, NVH penalty etc). I have poly FCAB and RTAB along with monoball RSM's on my E36, my E46 will be sticking with OEM FCAB, OEM RTAB (with limiters), and Rogue RSM's. The tradeoffs of race and poly parts simply aren't worth the nonexistent benefit on the street.

Links:

http://www.m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?s=2146e68d7df63232ff0ad99b604a7d83&t=378279

http://www.zpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=786978

http://m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=378468
 
Beedub said:
BMWZ4MC said:
If there is serious interest in the ESS SC, we should enquire aboout a group buy. I'm back in the UK in February so hope to be be fitting a supercharger next year. I have the following suspension upgrades waiting to be fitted on my return: KW Clubsports, Rogue rear shock mounts, Turner rear trailing arm bush limiter kit, and H&R front and rear sway bars. I already have a strut brace, so that should be it for me as far as suspension upgrades go (although I'm thinking about asking MachineMonkey if he can fabricate a rear strut brace if it looks to be possible once I've fitted the new top mounts). I'm looking for a BBK at the moment but cannot find the AP Racing kit I want at a reasonable price, so I'm considering other options. I'll also be fitting the Exdos brake cooling mod when I'm fitting all of the above, and when I fit the SC I'll fit new engine mounts.
As a side point, my car has been heavily tracked in my ownership and driven very enthusiastically on the road. I had my bearing shells checked (and replaced) at 50K miles when I was having other engine work done. They were pristine.


Great news about the shells, really great news, i WISH WSH you'd have posted pics at the time, Re the s/c kit id love to meet up with All of you really as maybe a s/c meeting to give you all the low down, on general ownership, i'll be heading into my 3rd iteration of s/c life shortly...!! Extracting further power is dangerously easily once the hardware is in place.... The engine comes alive with boost, it really feels like a modern unit with massive mid-range/top end clout.... As Long as your maintaining to car to a high standard ( a must) then imo this car with the s/c kit in place is just as reliable as before.... and the noise..... the noise alone is worth the cost.... To hear the s54 overlaid with s/c whines, whistles and pops.... incredible....

I'll definitely take you up on that offer Beedub - as I've said before your car is the inspiration for mine and I'll be glad to learn from your experiences :D
 
BMWZ4MC said:
mmm-five said:
Will you need the RTAB limiters if you go for aftermarket bushes, or are you sticking with OEM/Meyle rubber ones?

I've read mixed reviews of aftermarket polyurethane bushes - those opposed to their use have mentioned squeaking as an annoyance and of greater concern that they restrict rotational movements or even bind. The conclusion I came to after reading the links below was that OEM / other rubber bushes with a RTAB limiter kit was the best solution.

I fitted polyurethane trailing arm bushes on my Z3MC and they drove me mad! I tried everything I could think of to stop them creaking but nothing worked for longer than about 1k miles. In the end I reverted to OEM rubber bushes. I found that the Meyle rear top mounts didn't fit properly with AC Schnitzer suspension on my Z4MC, so I'd stick with OEM RTABs and limiter kit.
 
When my car is paid off I'll be going down this route...maybe not with ess unit however, I think having some variation would be good..

Shame vf has mixed reliability reviews, I think it looks the best...
 
exdos said:
BMWZ4MC said:
mmm-five said:
Will you need the RTAB limiters if you go for aftermarket bushes, or are you sticking with OEM/Meyle rubber ones?

I've read mixed reviews of aftermarket polyurethane bushes - those opposed to their use have mentioned squeaking as an annoyance and of greater concern that they restrict rotational movements or even bind. The conclusion I came to after reading the links below was that OEM / other rubber bushes with a RTAB limiter kit was the best solution.

I fitted polyurethane trailing arm bushes on my Z3MC and they drove me mad! I tried everything I could think of to stop them creaking but nothing worked for longer than about 1k miles. In the end I reverted to OEM rubber bushes. I found that the Meyle rear top mounts didn't fit properly with AC Schnitzer suspension on my Z4MC, so I'd stick with OEM RTABs and limiter kit.

The squeaking complaint I was citing was yours from zpost, as referenced in the link posted... :D
 
BMWZ4MC said:
I've bought them direct from Turner Motorsport in the States and it came to less than £90 delivered to Buckinghamshire :thumbsup:
I did look at buying direct, but they were £90 (including shipping), plus tax/duty, plus RM admin charges - so assumed they'd be more like £120 delivered - and as such £70 for Beedub's was a good saving!

I've got plenty of time to decide though, as I'm not starting the mods until Feb/Mar 2014, and the car will be off the road completely for a couple of weeks while all the replacements are ordered/delivered/fitted.
 
I am definitely interested in going this route with others if a group buy is organised. What variants would you go for? I was thinking the 550 version or is that too much for the engine?

My brakes and exhaust will be going on next couple of weeks as per my thread.
 
TikoV said:
I am definitely interested in going this route with others if a group buy is organised. What variants would you go for? I was thinking the 550 version or is that too much for the engine?

My brakes and exhaust will be going on next couple of weeks as per my thread.


the 550 isnt to much for the engine.... you'll need to mod the rest of the car to keep up however.... If you going FI ou must must do your engine mounts, the Tq kills the stock units very quickly.
 
I know I'll get slated for this, but what's the effect on MPG if you add the supercharger - assuming you drive as you do now and only use the extra power 'when needed'?

I'm not asking due to the cost side - although if you're going down from 30mpg to 10mpg it may be an issue - but rather how far can I travel on a tank, as for a daily driver I don't want to have to stop to fill up before I leave, half way, and when I arrive at my destination.

If there is an impact on MPG, then I assume this will increase as you up the power levels.

Personally, I'm aiming for a 25-30% increase as a first step, and then increase it by another 25-30% once I get bored.
 
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