E89 20i - Hill Assist

TitanTim said:
The only time I see it could be a problem is in a line of traffic where the car in front is slow off the mark and then stops, or in slow moving traffic on a steep gradient.
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That is an accurate description of our daily commute home. :)



I cannot believe anyone would be thinking of cancelling their order for something over this.

Tim.
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If we lived or worked in Edinburgh I'd probably cancel. As it was it took me a lot longer to decide than I thought it would.

YMMV. I think it has a lot to do not just with driving ability but how well you can adapt to the way this thing works.

My best advice to everyone reading my review is to try it for yourself and make your own decision.
 
Thanks for the review. You have proved that it is something that gets better with practice....after only 30 minutes you had confidence to try it on the road, so imagine what it will be like after a week or two living with it, sounds like it is something that in a few months it will be second nature (well, nearly!).

If the EPB (EMF, ELF, ABC whatever....) takes a second to release, then it sounds like that could be used as the hill start - in the way you described it, you have a second from pressing the button to get yourself sorted. Doesn't full hillstart just give you 2 seconds? ok, so full hillstart gives you more, and I hear your comment about getting it slightly wrong and shooting forward, but, again, with practice (and getting used to the clutch in the car) but this is perhaps a halfway house?

Impossible for me to test without at least a 150 mile round trip, none of the dealers in my local dealer group have a 20i, only 23i. So I'd have to travel further afield. I'm not that fussed, and at this stage wouldn't be cancelling.

Thanks to everyone with 20i cars who has contributed. And also thanks to Sars for initially trying to calm the storm. The only reason I was reluctant to just take your word for it was due to your car being different, and as we now know they've made changes to the 20i, I was concerned something else was different (i.e. perhaps the brake worked differently), so it wasn't a direct comparison.
 
Maybe my 3.0l has a little more low down grunt so I hardly have to depress the accelerator to hold on the clutch and thus not get that annoying chime.
 
Ive been following this with great interest as I earlier thought I had hill assist on my 2.0. Turns out it was actually the brief delay between releasing the brake switch and them actually releasing. My 2.0 doesn't have hill assist which makes me a slightly less happy bunny than I was. I'm pursuing BMW for an explanation and perhaps an apology would be nice ( some goodwill would be even better).

But, and this is a big but for me, I'm trying not to let it spoil my enjoyment of what I still consider to be a wonderful car.
 
kevinmarkwhite said:
Doesn't full hillstart just give you 2 seconds? ok, so full hillstart gives you more, and I hear your comment about getting it slightly wrong and shooting forward, but, again, with practice (and getting used to the clutch in the car) but this is perhaps a halfway house?
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Real hill start is very different. The service brake stays on until you apply enough power to start the car moving. It makes the car much easier to drive.

I'm sure that with more experience I will be able to get a smooth start on a moderate grade every time. At this point, I can't say if I will ever master steep hills. Parallel parking on steep hill would be very unpleasant. I'll just look for somewhere else to park.
 
Any updates from new owners on living with(out) hiilstart?

Someone mentioned other cars release the brake automatically when driving off. Do you think this could be rectified with a software update, cos all the hardware and sensors must be present already...
 
2 days now, 3 if you count the day I spent with the dealer demonstrator.

Someone mentioned other cars release the brake automatically when driving off.
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Other cars may work that way. Our sDrive20i does not.


Do you think this could be rectified with a software update, cos all the hardware and sensors must be present already...
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Possibly. I have not found out why hill start isn't on our car. Dealer did show me an email from a tech or engineer at BMW saying hill assist could not be retrofitted to our car.
 
Andrew*Debbie said:
2 days now, 3 if you count the day I spent with the dealer demonstrator.

Someone mentioned other cars release the brake automatically when driving off.
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Other cars may work that way. Our sDrive20i does not.


Do you think this could be rectified with a software update, cos all the hardware and sensors must be present already...
Click to expand...

Possibly. I have not found out why hill start isn't on our car. Dealer did show me an email from a tech or engineer at BMW saying hill assist could not be retrofitted to our car.
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Hi,

Yeah, I know it doesn't work that way on ours, my friend mentioned Aldi (audi) - keep the brake on, then it releases automatically when pulling away.

I was just wondering if BMW could possibly make such a change in the cars software (everything on BMW seems to be coded in one way or another....try changing a head unit!). It probably can't, just a thought.
 
I don't know what or why.

My guesses.

BMW deliberately left off the feature to differentiate the 20i and 28i from the 35i. If this was true, it should be possible to code the car to enable it. I think this is unlikely because even the 23i has it and BMW says it can't be retrofitted.

BMW intended to have the feature but something went wrong when they changed engines.

Hardware issue. Something about the controller -- not enough memory or not enough interface lines to connect everything.

Software issue. Programming error or accidental omission. In theory this could be fixed by a patch. Any changes to car firmware should require extensive testing. They may not want to commit the resources to fix it. It is possible the firmware was done under contract by an outside firm. Even a simple change may require a large investment.

It is possible the hill assist is there but they found a problem during testing. If true it could be coded on but who knows what might happen.
 
Updates:

I spoke with our dealer this morning. They are still waiting to hear back from BMW. He said BMW UK are inundated with complaints.

Last week, I sent an email to BMW CCGB outlining the issue and offering to write an article for Inline Six. No reply yet.

========

After 10 days, we getting better at driving the car.

I'm able manage backing into our narrow uphill drive without much difficulty.
Hit or miss if either of us can get a smooth start start without the chime going off. That will probably improve as we drive the car more.

Long uphill queues are still difficult. It takes too long to stop the car, apply the brake and then wait for it to release. The brake release delay will always make pulling out into traffic a little more difficult. Maneuvers that require the parking brake will always be more difficult in this car.


I wish the car had a normal handbrake or hill start assist.

The thing is other than that, we got a good one. Our Z is currently trouble free. Good paint job, no rattles, the electronics all work correctly, not even a low fluid warning light. . . Every other new BMW we've owned has had at least one minor problem in the first month.
 
Bit of an update on this from my end aswell. I complained to my supplying dealer and the outcome is that BMW UK have offered to pay for the semi intergrated nav that I was toying with having (£490.00) I am very happy with this as I think I will use this more than I would the hill start assist and also saves me having to fork out nearly £500 on the sat nav :thumbsup:
 
Nice result. So what did you say to them, considering you dont have the car yet?

I said to my dealer about it, and said that it may not be an issue for me, but if it is then I will be going back. Until I have got used to the car I don't know if it will be a problem for me personally, so I can't make a fuss until I know for sure.
 
Going to be honest,

Z4 in my area of town has been a bit of a pain without hill assist. I feel really let down by BMW UK!
 
If we lived or worked Edinburgh, I would have pressed hard for replacement car with an automatic. If BMW refused, we probably would have asked for a refund and bought something else.


We plan to go the fringe again this year. Not looking forward to the hill starts.
 
So I took the car to some hills tonight to have a go at hill starts. Before I go any further, I have to say that I don't need to do many hill starts, so in everyday life, its not going to be a regular occurrence for me.

Firstly I took it to a hill which was reasonably steep and actually steeper than any that I regularly drive. I was comfortably able to hold the car on the footbrake without using the handbrake, and get to throttle/clutch in time to pull off without rolling back. If it did roll, it was no more than a centimetre (thats a rough guess!) and certainly not dangerous.

Then I took it to a steeper hill and tried. Without the handbrake, the car definitely rolled back by going from footbrake to throttle, and it was too much to be safe. So I tried with the handbrake applied.

I noticed the other day that the car will bong if you have the handbrake on and rev the engine, even if in neutral, so the bong doesn't necessarily mean you are stressing the brakes. I tried finding biting point then releasing the handbrake. It bonged before I actually think I had biting point, so again, I think was was just down to revs. I found the best method to be releasing the handbrake and then pulling away - so not bothering to try and find the biting point and release, but just to push the brake button and at the same time, throttle and release clutch. I found the time taken for the brakes to release was about right to simultaneously get the throttle/clutch right. At no time did the car "jolt" forward, sometimes it rolled back a small bit, but no where near dangerous, I'd say similar to 1st hill, say about 1cm.

Now this is the first time I've tried it, and I was expecting it to be a nightmare due to others reports, but I have to say it was fine, and nothing to worry me. I must stress though, that hill starts on hills steep enough to roll back significantly are extremely rare for me, so using the handbrake and getting the bong will be rare, and not a problem.

If it was a regular occurrence, it might be different!
 
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