Zed vs Boxster

I've had a 2.2 Z4 a couple of years ago and I've just given up an 07 987 Boxster S. Most of what has been said with regard to handling and trim I agree with but one thing that has not been mentioned is the cost of repairs.

Now I'm sure I have been very unlucky during my ownership but in 7 months the car needed a clutch, an oil and air separator, a water pump, a track control arm and a track rod end, if you add all that lot up it's well over £2k. Porsche parts are not cheap even the aftermarket ones and good indie's are not so easy to find either. I was fortunate and didn't pay for any of that as I had a good warranty but that's not always going to be the case.

And to put the boot in a little further the car has now gone back to the supplying dealer as the engine was suffering from scored bores, a well know Porsche problem, again very unlucky as only a very small % of cars suffer this but at £6k+ to fix it's a bloody scary prospect.

I'm sure there are lot's and lot's of owners out there who have never had any problems with theirs and would happily buy another one but I'm not one of them unless it's new or almost new and any problems would then be the dealerships to fix.

My new ride??????????
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Thanks Guys for all your opinions, very interesting!

Upon test driving the 987 Boxster S, my initials thoughts were its a nice cabin, felt more refined & Comfortable than the Z. It drove great however it didn't feel like it had an extra 50 horses than my Z. If anything my Z felt as quick if not quicker and more nimble!

To conclude the Boxster S was a lovely piece of kit but didn't Wow me enough, I also think my Z looks better & sounds better!

911 Turbo though might Wow me!!
 
I also had a 911 before my Zed and the repair costs made me sell it on after only 10 months of ownership. I spent about 6.000 euro on repairs in that period... I love the 911 and everything about it but would just never see me buy it again unless I get filthy rich.
 
And to add a bit of balance I had my 2 911's over a 6 year period (and about 40k miles) cumulatively and the only thing I needed outside of normal servicing and consumables was a seat heating element for about £250.....
 
Interesting i was looking at getting a cayman next year... The price difference between a second hand cayman and a 997 c2s are much less then i expected - to the point where maybe a 4 seater 911 would be a better option..


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aquazi said:
Interesting i was looking at getting a cayman next year... The price difference between a second hand cayman and a 997 c2s are much less then i expected - to the point where maybe a 4 seater 911 would be a better option..


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Price-wise yes... but servicing cost of the Cayman is half the cost as to the 911. That is if you want to stay with an official dealer, which is usually recommended as it makes the car keep its value over time.
 
uuf361 said:
And to add a bit of balance I had my 2 911's over a 6 year period (and about 40k miles) cumulatively and the only thing I needed outside of normal servicing and consumables was a seat heating element for about £250.....
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i've had 2 911s over a 5 year period and didn't have any other costs other than normal servicing and consumables.
 
My mate has a 987 3.2 S in guards red - looks absolutely stunning - a sound to die for and faster than my 3.0 SE - at the end of the day it's a red Porsche so draws a lot of attention - a real sports car experience when driving - bad points : very thirsty and costs an arm and a leg to maintain.

Depends if what you want is a weekend toy or a DD - the zed is easier to live with as a DD - for someone my size ( very tall ) the zed is more roomy and more refined - would have bought a Porker if I could have got in it comfortably :( , zed is a lot more economical and plenty of Indies around to avoid stealer prices
 
Check out all the reviews on bore scoring on the gen 1 engine. If that doesn't put your off(it did me!), think about the cost of the porker in relation to the zed (capex and servicing)
 
apw67 said:
Check out all the reviews on bore scoring on the gen 1 engine. If that doesn't put your off(it did me!), think about the cost of the porker in relation to the zed (capex and servicing)
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Yep. Early Boxsters, 996 C2 & C4, Early 997 and Caymans also suffer from the same problem. Got to get an inspection before purchase and have a boroscope put into cylinder 6.

It's for this reason I would only consider a 997 Gen2.
 
Is that bore scoring caused by small debris in the oil from failing ims bearings, or is this _another_ seperate problem?
Is it always 1 side? (bottom or top)

I think these whole generations porsche engines (996, 986, 987 except the mezger based) are really flauwed beyond the reasonable.
rear/mid mounting doesnt make these repairs (when possible) not any cheaper.
IMS bearing failure, cracked blocks, cilinder bore scoring.... all expensive or fubar.

Most porsche owners are really precise on serviceing, much more than bmw owners, and then still so much blown/damaged engines with so little cars sold (realtively).....
 
GuidoK said:
Is that bore scoring caused by small debris in the oil from failing ims bearings, or is this _another_ seperate problem?
Is it always 1 side? (bottom or top)

I think these whole generations porsche engines (996, 986, 987 except the mezger based) are really flauwed beyond the reasonable.
rear/mid mounting doesnt make these repairs (when possible) not any cheaper.
IMS bearing failure, cracked blocks, cilinder bore scoring.... all expensive or fubar.

Most porsche owners are really precise on serviceing, much more than bmw owners, and then still so much blown/damaged engines with so little cars sold (realtively).....
Click to expand...

When I was looking at getting a 996 i was told that the scoring is usually cylinder 5 and 6 and is generally caused by oil starvation. The engines do use a bit of oil up 1l per 1k miles is apparently ok and if previous owners haven't been diligent checking the oil then it can cause a problem. On fast corning the oil is thrown away from the oil pick up and the lower oil level can mean not enough oil is getting circulated and cylinders 5 and 6 are the last in line so they get hotter and wear more. The wear usually gets bad around 30k miles so anything around that mileage or multiples thereof then it is best to get them properly inspected. A sure visual tell tail is smoke from one exhaust when cold.

The turbo's and the GT2/3 never had this problem as they have a dry sump
 
If it would be oil starvation you would see the oil light blink in corners as it is directly coupled to the pressure sensor.
 
Its not oil starvation that causes the problem..There are a couple of problems..

One is heat soak due to bad coolant design around the outer bores..The heat can expand the bores causing them to tighten onto the pistons and rings..
The oil film that protects the bore is wiped away and damage gets caused to the bore,in the extremes of this situation you can experience "D" chunking........ This is where the top if the cylinder liner breaks off in a "D" shape. The piston actually seizes in the bore due to heat and then unseizes,microseizing then puts excess stress on the bore and a lump flies out :thumbsdown:

Also...Piston coatings can fall off and get stuck between piston skirt and bore wall.... More bore score.. :thumbsdown:

Both major design faults that cannot be avoided.....

More of a "when" than "if"...
 
Boxster - dated styling and flakey reliability

Zed - styling that is still holding its own today and good reliability

Overall the Z4 is a massively lower risk investment.

I'm no Porsche hater either, in fact the 80's 911 turbo is pretty much my favourite car of all time. If I could afford to take the risk of ownership I'd have one in a heartbeat.
 
Z4M-2006 said:
One is heat soak due to bad coolant design around the outer bores..
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Than that is a really really poor design.

I mean first of all they're open deck engines, so there is massive room for coolant flow. And it's a boxer, a really short engine, so no/less cascading heat buildup than say an inline six :wink: , And it is low, so almost no highspots where bubbles can nest (they nest elsewhere...unlinke in an inline, you can get heat spots in the cilinder head). And full aluminium, so no stress between head&block etc.

If that's the cause, someone at the designdepartement really fucked up....

It is also very strange that their normal engines are less reliable than the mezger engine what is race derived and a high rpm running block. Like the bmw difference m54 - s54 but that than the m54 would have the rodbearing problemsn :lol:
 
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