Z4M ESS Supercharger Options released

sixspeed said:
I've owned supercharged and turbocharged cars previously, and I can tell you that the supercharged car felt almost indistinguishable from a NA motor... it just feels like the engine has been super-sized!

Whether that applies also to the ESS solution for our Ms I don't know, but I'd expect it to be very similar.

As I've been debating between upgrading to an M and buying a supercharger for my 2.5, I'm glad to hear that. I love the idea of the NA power, but my 2.5 has everything exactly as I want. So with the supercharger, I can get M power at a fraction of the cost...but was concerned about the driving feel. Thanks for the input!
 
First off, I love power, and I have no issues with modded vehicles. My Corrado VR6 has a stripped interior with a rollcage and 100shot of NOS direct port. But I didn't go for any forced induction because its already extremely finicky and unreliable.

Back to the M

Agreed it is a different car. But if you were to spend ~10K extra on a Coupe, it would be the same cost as a new m3. Assuming base is ~65K (USD)

My gas mileage is already ....ehhh, about 15-25 mpg (But I heard the e92er M3 is worse)

What would the supercharger due to our mpg?

It will be worse

With that much power would we need a new clutch?

No but it will wear faster


Will it work without a modded CDV?

Yes but everyone should remove CDV even if you dont have a SC


Would we need a new final drive to take advantage of the power?

No

To get 4.6-5.0s 0-60 times we have to shift extremely fast and accurately, sure with more power maybe we could get to 4.1-4.5, can we shift that fast?

Can you ? if not try adding a SSK it helped me

Uncorked our cars can approach 170-175 stock...aerodynamically I think we can hit 186-190 beyond that we would need more than 600hp.

Im not interested in going 200mph here in the US

When is it too much? But I'm still interested I just have to play the devils advocate....

Its too much when you decide it is too much , like most things in life :D
 
Rom3n said:
What would the supercharger due to our mpg?

It will be worse

There's room for arguement on this one...at leat theoretically and depending on how you currently drive your car. Since you'll get more power at lower RPMs, one might have not have the tendency to rev the engine as high. So in theory at least, it's possible to get better gas mileage by staying in the lower rpm/more fuel efficient range.
 
sixspeed said:
ESS ECU software for NA applications is available now. The software will raise the rev limit to 8200 RPM. Top speed limit is removed and the car will pick up 11HP on 91 octane and up to 20HP with 100 octane.

dont spose there's any word on economy on this? id be very interested in a few extra horses anyway but if it came with a few less pints of juice id be smiling even more =)
 
mattholecko said:
There's room for arguement on this one...at leat theoretically and depending on how you currently drive your car. Since you'll get more power at lower RPMs, one might have not have the tendency to rev the engine as high. So in theory at least, it's possible to get better gas mileage by staying in the lower rpm/more fuel efficient range.
Ultimately, the supercharger is called a 'blower' because it pumps more into the engine. You have to match that with more fuel (otherwise it runs lean and goes bang). So even if you're using less rpms you're still pumping in more fuel than you would without the blower. It's a bit different with a turbocharger, but as a supercharger is directly driven from the crankshaft it's blowing all the time.
 
carl, it is clutched so it shuts off below 1500 rpm, but even still I agree that it would have to use more fuel, I just don't see how it can be any more economical. Thing is, spending what will probably amount to £10k fitted, and on a £30k+ car, you won't be bothered about a few mpg here and there.
 
I agree with Wondermike.

If you have the money to have a M, and even still the money to supercharge it and perhaps upgrade the rest of the car to follow . . . why care about a few extra bucks in gasoline??

That's kind of the wrong focus IMHO.
 
Each to their own, but after modifying 2 350Z's (1 supercharged to 400bhp) and the other one to 600bhp (twin turbo), I would honestly say it really just isnt worth it. The doing of such projects is the fun, once its finished you find yourself having spent the same amount that the car cost, and chasing never ending niggles and things breaking. The car wasnt designed to cope with the power, and you cant get the chassis to keep up.

Not saying it cant be done and have fun, but Id never highly modify a car again.

:thumbsup:
 
Baptist said:
Each to their own, but after modifying 2 350Z's (1 supercharged to 400bhp) and the other one to 600bhp (twin turbo), I would honestly say it really just isnt worth it. The doing of such projects is the fun, once its finished you find yourself having spent the same amount that the car cost, and chasing never ending niggles and things breaking. The car wasnt designed to cope with the power, and you cant get the chassis to keep up.

Not saying it cant be done and have fun, but Id never highly modify a car again.

:thumbsup:

I disagree. And not only that, but there's a big difference between a 600bhp turbocharged 350Z and what we're talking about here.

There will of course be plenty of people that are more than happy with the stock car, but I haven't lost the enjoyment or driveability from any of the mods I've done to my car so far. In fact, each and every one of my modifications I've done has made the car a better fast road/track performer (IMO). And I can quite honestly say that another 100hp in these cars (certainly the Z4MC) is well within the capabilities of the standard running gear and suspension/brakes etc, and has been proved by owners running the same kits in the E46 M3 (which, don't forget, is a much heavier car than ours). As such, the price is relatively small. $9000 (or £4,500) for the 440bhp kit. Which is what, 12% of the car's original price (at least here in the UK!)? Even if you factor in another £3,500 that you may want to spend on uprated brakes and coilovers (and to be honest, anyone looking at a SC kit will most likely have considered or even upgraded already) it's not a huge amount compared to the cost of buying the car for what should be quite an acceptable jump in performance.

However, it's not surprising you had trouble getting the chassis to keep up in a 350Z with 600bhp (let alone the money it must have cost to get the engine to that point)! But I don't think that will be as much as an issue here tbh.

Money spent on modifications though is nearly always money thrown away. Just because you spend £xxxx on your car making it go faster, or stop quicker, won't see that money realised when it comes to sale time. At best, you can strip the car back to standard spec and sell off your upgrades used. So long as you realise this, and you make sensible (!) modifications, then I think the balance can be kept in check...
 
I agree, the first car was a bolt on modification and i reverted back to standard come resale time. The turbo car was a different matter.
All Im saying is, its addictive, once you get the bug............. :lol:

Does that 4500 include fitting? then you'll need a clutch, as you say, bigger brakes etc.
Gets the point where you might as well just buy a better car, or one more suitable to track days.

Driver training would probably improve your laptimes more than another 100bhp.
 
I can imagine there must have been a fair bit of work in that 600bhp monster!

And you're right, it can be addictive. But there's a quest for the highest "headline figure", or a realisation of the full potential of the car (or otherwise, knowing when to stop! :P)

The £4500 doesn't include fitting that I'm aware of... not checked tbh, but the ESS kits that were available for the M3 are straightforward enough that you could do the work yourself if you have the confidence and basic mechanical knowledge. I have a mechanic friend that I would entrust to fitting my kit if I went ahead....

Agree on another car. But the Z for me is a part-time track toy. I do just as many weekend road miles in it. If I wanted a pure track car, I'd start looking down the Radical route. But I want a car that is still reasonable for road use, and that I can take the gf out in (thankfully she's quite patient/forgiving/understanding :P) For the money it's cost me so far, there's not much on the market i'd want instead anyway. I went through all the available options at the time I bought it, and still settled on the Z. Like yourself, it would seem, the next stop for me would be a Gallardo, which is quite a jump from the Z4MC (even with 'charger) but upgrading my house will come before then...
 
Yeah, the turbo'd car too a decent amount of fettling to reach 600bhp. Although the cams/heads were standard, the internals were beefed up to suit.
If your going to do it for the reasons you say, then go for it! at least the supercharger is bolt on and can be returned to stock come resale time if you cant sell it.
They are pretty unique value wise these cars, looking forward to getting one and having a bit of cheaper fun.
You do right with the house, Ive just taken a step back and am going to do some mortgage reducing and come back to the Lambo next year. Especially with the new model coming out, be interesting to see how it affects residuals.

Just out of interest is it a centrifugal blower? or roots/screw type?
 
I don't understand what all the fuss is about. Dude wants more power, and the ESS supercharger has been tested for both the E46 M3 and the Z4M. If he cared about gas mileage he would have bought a prius.
 
I just drove this...

http://www.bmwpower-bg.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=83844

which belongs to my younger brother as of Saturday afternoon. It has 525Bhp and makes the Z4MCoupe that I have seem slow and pedestrian. Is it more difficult to drive - hell yes, a paddle clutch in London traffic, 1" travel on the 6spd box takes getting used to etc. No air-con... Is it more fun to drive - hell yes... I will be buying the kit from G-Power when they release it for my Z4MC...
 
sixspeed,

i've gone down the supercharged route with my Z4 and half a year later, it's no longer enough.... so be warned.... boost can be addictive! :fuelfire:

i have an ASA supercharger in my car and i can assure you, regardless of what they tell you, once the clutch engages, it is LOUD and HIGH PITCHED. you may not hear it over the engine and exhaust roar while driving, but people outside of your car can definitely hear it. this high pitched whine is amplified when driving through city centers, tunnels and semi-enclosed areas like underground car parks and hotel lobbies. these days, my arrival is recognised not by my exhaust note but by the characteristic "helicopter" whine my charger gives out. cop magnet... no doubt about it.

at this moment, i'm actually seriously thinking of selling my supercharger (any takers?) and am doing some preliminary research on a chevy v8 transplant. somehow, the idea of a naturally aspirated V8 rumbling beneath the Z4's long bonnet seems more appealing now than a high-pitched and whiny 6-cylinder. think rottweiler versus chihuahua.

cheers
 
louis said:
sixspeed,

i've gone down the supercharged route with my Z4 and half a year later, it's no longer enough.... so be warned.... boost can be addictive! :fuelfire:

i have an ASA supercharger in my car and i can assure you, regardless of what they tell you, once the clutch engages, it is LOUD and HIGH PITCHED. you may not hear it over the engine and exhaust roar while driving, but people outside of your car can definitely hear it. this high pitched whine is amplified when driving through city centers, tunnels and semi-enclosed areas like underground car parks and hotel lobbies. these days, my arrival is recognised not by my exhaust note but by the characteristic "helicopter" whine my charger gives out. cop magnet... no doubt about it.

at this moment, i'm actually seriously thinking of selling my supercharger (any takers?) and am doing some preliminary research on a chevy v8 transplant. somehow, the idea of a naturally aspirated V8 rumbling beneath the Z4's long bonnet seems more appealing now than a high-pitched and whiny 6-cylinder. think rottweiler versus chihuahua.

cheers
BMW's straight six is no chihuahua.. more like german shepherd!
with a S/C should be like a german shepherd on steroids!

i wouldn't throw an american V8 in a Z4, although the V8 roar & torque would be tempting :driving:
 
thebighash said:
BMW's straight six is no chihuahua.. more like german shepherd!
with a S/C should be like a german shepherd on steroids!

i wouldn't throw an american V8 in a Z4, although the V8 roar & torque would be tempting :driving:

not the engine.... the SC. fast forward and watch from the "2:05" minute mark onwards.

[youtube]WuAdojmEFoY[/youtube]
 
louis said:
sixspeed,

i've gone down the supercharged route with my Z4 and half a year later, it's no longer enough.... so be warned.... boost can be addictive! :fuelfire:

i have an ASA supercharger in my car and i can assure you, regardless of what they tell you, once the clutch engages, it is LOUD and HIGH PITCHED. you may not hear it over the engine and exhaust roar while driving, but people outside of your car can definitely hear it. this high pitched whine is amplified when driving through city centers, tunnels and semi-enclosed areas like underground car parks and hotel lobbies. these days, my arrival is recognised not by my exhaust note but by the characteristic "helicopter" whine my charger gives out. cop magnet... no doubt about it.

at this moment, i'm actually seriously thinking of selling my supercharger (any takers?) and am doing some preliminary research on a chevy v8 transplant. somehow, the idea of a naturally aspirated V8 rumbling beneath the Z4's long bonnet seems more appealing now than a high-pitched and whiny 6-cylinder. think rottweiler versus chihuahua.

cheers

I'm just learning about superchargers (and really cars in general) but isn't the ASA supercharger a centrifugal system? I've heard these have their problems and is why ESS is switching to the twin screw. (Please feel free to correct me on this.) But maybe the Lysholm twinscrew type doesn't make as much noise? Here's the sound clip from ESS on the Z4...doesn't sound too whiny to me...but a bit. http://www.esstuning.com/default.asp?c=movies&n=&id=130
http://www.esstuning.com/default.asp?c=movies&n=&id=131
how's that compare to yours?

Plus, I'm not sure if these clips are from thier old centrifugal chargers or the new lysholm twin screw ones.
 
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