vaccine passports

[Nanu]

Not my point. The last posts on this subject were getting ridiculous and there was a lot of flack flying so I chose not to read or post anything further. Commented on this post because it was about the App not anything to do about the vaccine. Feels like I am being stalked and anything that refers to the vaccine is being pounced on just repeating the same arguments over and over.

 

[ihadablackdog]

.... there is no discrimination as the choice is yours. Nobody is being forced to have the jab. It's just like having your National Passport. You can have it or choose not to but by choosing not to have it you have self imposed restrictions like not being able to leave the UK. Can't recall anyone successfully suing anyone.

Spot on

 

[Vornwend]

Lots if throwing around of this vaccination and how it "significantly reduces the likelihood of transmission" not seen any evidence to that effect, what are you basing it on?

Someone who has had covid will also have the same protection as someone with a vaccine through natural immunity how will that be tracked?

A plethora of recent evidence emerging about reduced transmission after vaccination - here's a prominent one:
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/one-dose-of-covid-19-vaccine-can-cut-household-transmission-by-up-to-half

Having had Covid may offer protection but its not been sytematically tracked therfore you will have to rely on the passport (or testing)

 

[rdgreen]

There's already numerous places you can't go without producing evidence of vaccination.....for Yellow fever and Meningococcal for instance. No jab....no go.....been around for donkeys years.

 

[Deleted member 32480]

I think there is no need for passports myself.

But if we are going to have them then in my opinion vaccinated or not you need to have a test (the one that is least likely to throw a false positive or negative).

I don't personally see why the vaccinated who can still catch and pass on covid get a free ride with the passport system when at best you are 50% less likely to pass on the virus.

If they do that and your crappy holiday to Spain costs another 500 quid or so I see the majority of you changing your tune rather pronto and then you will soon see it for the stupid idea that it is.

 

[enuff_zed]

If they do that and your crappy holiday to Spain costs another 500 quid or so I see the majority of you changing your tune rather pronto and then you will soon see it for the stupid idea that it is.

Nah! I'm loaded, off to the Caribbean and don't give a stuff.

 

[Deleted member 32480]

[ref]enuff_zed[/ref], Less families and poor people on flights. Got to be a winner that.

 

[mr.tourette]

Wow.. Haven't been in the other thread for a long time but if the tone is as hateful as this is getting already then I'm kinda glad :thumbsdown:

 

[enuff_zed]

[ref]enuff_zed[/ref], Less families and poor people on flights. Got to be a winner that.

Yup. Begin to think the virus was engineered for middle-aged folk.
Get rid of all the oldies who slow up the queues at the airports, make it too expensive for families to take their screaming brats.
Leave the best destinations to the folk with no kids at home, no mortgage, cash rich and plenty of free time.
I'm a winner!


(Now just sit quietly and wait for someone to take this seriously. :roll: )

 

[Deleted member 32480]

[ref]enuff_zed[/ref], Less families and poor people on flights. Got to be a winner that.

Yup. Begin to think the virus was engineered for middle-aged folk.
Get rid of all the oldies who slow up the queues at the airports, make it too expensive for families to take their screaming brats.
Leave the best destinations to the folk with no kids at home, no mortgage, cash rich and plenty of free time.
I'm a winner!


(Now just sit quietly and wait for someone to take this seriously. :roll: )

Now we are talking. If we could work out a way to make the women folk take a separate flight or perhaps strap them to the roof (lets give them a free set of goggles) then we all set.

Wait I have an idea now.... I think I might have inadvertently solved the covid crisis here. Here me out.... Open aired air plane travel for the vulnerable.

We design a open air plane for all you old folk- say a modern day twist on a tigermoth -keep you guys a meter apart (socially distanced). You can all fly to your destination without any covid worries.

There wouldn't be any inflight refreshments or toilets- so complimentary nappies- (most off you pee your pants these days anyways so no major concerns here).

Anyone got Michael O'Leary's number? I think I am on to something here!

 

[Flyingfifer]

Who cares if its 4/6/8 or 12 months?
You need an MOT on the car every 12months so why worry about a vaccine certificate?

Because having a car with an MOT isnt a requirement to living my life

No ones saying it’s perfect....nobody knows the long term effects of any of this, but, speaking for myself, I believe Covid is a real risk (there are plenty of people who disagree, I’m not saying you are one of those)

Its certainly dangerous if you are 55+ and/or have an underlying health condition.

If people chose not to have the vaccine, then that is their choice, but I don’t agree that they should be allowed to continue to risk the transmission by going back to life as usual.

Oh wow, so take the vaccine or never live a normal life again...? jesus
You have already stated above that having the vaccine doesnt prevent you from spreading the disease... so what the issue? If a vaccinated person can spread it and an unvaccinated person can spread it, why is one a monster worthy of being stripped of their rights and the other isnt?

The only moral dilemma I have is for people who can’t have the vaccine (I don’t know the details on reasons). Technically my above comments about not going back to normal could apply to them also, but I agree that is grossly unfair on them.

Correct. But unless you are completely ok with imposing your will on people it should be a choice.

Have you had the vaccine or will you have it when offered (if you can)?

At 32 I havent been offered and will decline when offered, 98% chance of survival negates my need for the vaccine and id rather not risk any potential gremlins from the vaccine until its necessary.

We have had this argument before and there is no discrimination as the choice is yours. Nobody is being forced to have the jab. It's just like having your National Passport. You can have it or choose not to but by choosing not to have it you have self imposed restrictions like not being able to leave the UK. Can't recall anyone successfully suing anyone.

You P****d a lot of people off in another post with your anti Vaccine theories. Why can't you just stick to that one.

You can take it if you want, we aren't forcing you but if you don't we will remove your ability to travel, prevent you from socialising, attending events etc, basically you will be kept at home barred from leaving and will be treated like a pariah.... but its totally your free choice :idunno:
10/10 logic there.

I cant remember the last time I had to show my passport to get into a pub.....?

If I hurt peoples feefees because I disagreed with them thats their issue :idunno:
Still not an anti vaxxer though, or if I am I'm a really bad one being fully vaccinated as humanly possible with the exception of the covid one :?

A plethora of recent evidence emerging about reduced transmission after vaccination - here's a prominent one:
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/one-dose-of-covid-19-vaccine-can-cut-household-transmission-by-up-to-half

Thank you

There's already numerous places you can't go without producing evidence of vaccination.....for Yellow fever and Meningococcal for instance. No jab....no go.....been around for donkeys years.

The pub? Music festival? hotels in the UK?
Just a wee smidgen different.

Wow.. Haven't been in the other thread for a long time but if the tone is as hateful as this is getting already then I'm kinda glad :thumbsdown:

Unfortunately people who dont like being disagreed with tend to jump to personal attacks, its just one of those things. The other thread ended up being very venomous towards anyone who wasnt pro jab.


I will achieve that one response per page... I'm determined!

 

[PerryGunn]

A not unexpected response from the people who constantly rubbished the vaccine effort in the 'Jab' thread - they declared that they weren't going to have it and are now complaining that they 'may' be treated differently from people who have had it.

Actions have consequences! They've made their choice now they need to learn to live with the restrictions that that choice may bring.

The current situation in India should be a lesson to everyone regarding what could have happened here - although I'm sure the anti-vax brigade will say that it's all propaganda...

Sorry if mainstream media in the form of the BBC offends the anti-vaxxers but, if you haven't seen it, this account from Viveki Kapoor, a charge nurse in a Delhi hospital is worth reading https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-56926119

 

[Flyingfifer]

A not unexpected response from the people who constantly rubbished the vaccine effort in the 'Jab' thread - they declared that they weren't going to have it and are now complaining that they 'may' be treated differently from people who have had it.

Actions have consequences! They've made their choice now they need to learn to live with the restrictions that that choice may bring.

The current situation in India should be a lesson to everyone regarding what could have happened here - although I'm sure the anti-vax brigade will say that it's all propaganda...

Sorry if mainstream media in the form of the BBC offends the anti-vaxxers but, if you haven't seen it, this account from Viveki Kapoor, a charge nurse in a Delhi hospital is worth reading https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-56926119

Still slinging the mud of "aNtI-vAxXeR" how original

Interesting article... here is another https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/88-of-all-covid-19-deaths-in-india-in-age-group-of-45-years-and-above-government/articleshow/81672749.cms

88% of COVID deaths in india are age 45+

 

[TitanTim]

I can understand people's freedom of choice but I still don't get why you wouldn't want the vaccine, no side affects, reduces substantially affects of the disease, will go a long way to bringing you back into reasonable normality sooner, so no don't get it really.

There does seem to be some misconception it's all being forced on you but it's not and taking the vaccine is really a win win.

Tim.

 

[Rucky]

Times of India stats Indian stats need to be treated with care I would suggest as the situation circumstances are not comparable with UK
Life expectatnacy is already much lower than that in UK/Europe - maybe 69 years. Most of the " elderly" population is between 45 and 65.

Average population age is skewed in that the majority are in the younger age groups - I think its about 5% over 65 whereas in uk its 20%
The vast majority of the population will not even see a hospital - and I suspect they are only counting Covid deaths with any degree of certainty in metropolitan areas.

It is a heart wrenching situation - the majority of Indian populatiin would be delighted to be able to have a vaccination.
Maybe some of the anti vaxxers should go there and help out - oh I forgot its all a hoax to most of them!

Lets get back to disc brakes, flashing lights and vaccine passports and say a prayer for those less fortunate

 

[Flyingfifer]

no side affects

Em... wut :?
There are side effects that we know of already to the extent that multiple countries having pulled certain vaccines for certain age groups and I believe the J&J one was pulled completely

Its really not that complicated, 98% chance of survival if I catch it, maybe 99% with a vaccine.
Vaccine only lasts about 6-8 months it seems so multiple ongoing jabs required.
Completely unknown if there are long term complications with the vaccine, already sudden discoveries of blood clotting which has caused deaths.
Vaccinated people still catch, transmit and can be platforms for mutation.

Why take something with unknown risks for a 1% extra bit of protection... is it REALLY that mindboggling? :roll:

Times of India stats Indian stats need to be treated with care I would suggest as the situation circumstances are not comparable with UK
Life expectatnacy is already much lower than that in UK/Europe - maybe 69 years. Most of the " elderly" population is between 45 and 65.

Average population age is skewed in that the majority are in the younger age groups - I think its about 5% over 65 whereas in uk its 20%
The vast majority of the population will not even see a hospital - and I suspect they are only counting Covid deaths with any degree of certainty in metropolitan areas.

It is a heart wrenching situation - the majority of Indian populatiin would be delighted to be able to have a vaccination.
Maybe some of the anti vaxxers should go there and help out - oh I forgot its all a hoax to most of them!

Lets get back to disc brakes, flashing lights and vaccine passports and say a prayer for those less fortunate

So the 88% deaths in the 45+ in context of India means that the number is skewed lower because of the significantly higher number of younger people. I agree, its definitely a threat to the old and very much not so for the young and healthy.

 

[TitanTim]

no side affects

Em... wut :?
There are side effects that we know of already to the extent that multiple countries having pulled certain vaccines for certain age groups and I believe the J&J one was pulled completely

Its really not that complicated, 98% chance of survival if I catch it, maybe 99% with a vaccine.
Vaccine only lasts about 6-8 months it seems so multiple ongoing jabs required.
Completely unknown if there are long term complications with the vaccine, already sudden discoveries of blood clotting which has caused deaths.
Vaccinated people still catch, transmit and can be platforms for mutation.

Why take something with unknown risks for a 1% extra bit of protection... is it REALLY that mindboggling? :roll:

Times of India stats Indian stats need to be treated with care I would suggest as the situation circumstances are not comparable with UK
Life expectatnacy is already much lower than that in UK/Europe - maybe 69 years. Most of the " elderly" population is between 45 and 65.

Average population age is skewed in that the majority are in the younger age groups - I think its about 5% over 65 whereas in uk its 20%
The vast majority of the population will not even see a hospital - and I suspect they are only counting Covid deaths with any degree of certainty in metropolitan areas.

It is a heart wrenching situation - the majority of Indian populatiin would be delighted to be able to have a vaccination.
Maybe some of the anti vaxxers should go there and help out - oh I forgot its all a hoax to most of them!

Lets get back to disc brakes, flashing lights and vaccine passports and say a prayer for those less fortunate

So the 88% deaths in the 45+ in context of India means that the number is skewed lower because of the significantly higher number of younger people. I agree, its definitely a threat to the old and very much not so for the young and healthy.

Face reality, the vaccine is safe with minimal risks, it's more risky crossing the road.

If booster jabs are required so be it, no different than flu vaccine.

Don't think being in a younger age bracket is a guarantee cert you would be ok, just gambling with your life when you don't need too.

Tim.

 

[Flyingfifer]

Face reality, the vaccine is safe with minimal risks, it's more risky crossing the road.

If booster jabs are required so be it, no different than flu vaccine.

Don't think being in a younger age bracket is a guarantee cert you would be ok, just gambling with your life when you don't need too.

Tim.

You simply do not know that and to try and claim otherwise is outright dishonest. We have no idea of any possible long terms side-effects as
A- No long term testing has been carried out as it would normally have been with vaccines.
B- No one has had the vaccine long enough to discover if there are unknown and unforeseen side effects, such as blood clotting in younger people.

Do I anticipate that there are long term side effects? No, at the very least I certainly hope not. But I am honest enough to say as much.

At no point have I claimed that I am immune and unable to catch the virus through being younger, I am surprised if that is what you have managed to take that from what I have said.
I have, at all times, clearly and openly, talked about my chance of survival as is statistically understood from the data available. Measuring survival chance inherently requires that you catch the virus in the first place.

 

[ronk]

3 pages down - 145 to go!

 

[enuff_zed]

Biggest side effect of all this seems to be the need to wade through pages of 'discussion' repeated ad infinitum until we all die of boredom or old age. :roll: