UK "NETT ZERO" ENERGY POLICY VERY TROUBLING

MrPT said:
Nanu said:
If you look at the miniscule proportion of what are termed "Greenhouses gases" that make up the planets atmosphere, then it's illogical to assume that a minor change to a minor amount will make a major difference.
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Like when you go from having a polonium-free diet to just sprinkling a little bit on your cereal in the mornings?
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Extreme example perhaps. So please explain how the UK producing zero CO2 would effect the planets average temperature and the climate?

What the figures show is how little if any mankind can influence nature. The rise and fall of CO2 is a natural phenomenon that was happening long before we existed and will continue to happen after we don't.

In addition, if as some state, we are responsible for all these greenhouse gases in the atmosphere, what happens to the flora, fauna and the sea life, which feeds on CO2 and turns it into the oxygen that we need if we stop producing CO2?
 
You can choose not to believe that our climate is gradually warming, be it from either man-made sources or through the natural order of things, but changing it is. Again you can believe or not believe the scientific consensus that climate change is man-made, however are you going to bet your children's or grandchildren's future on that, as they're the ones that will pay that bill.
 
sars said:
You can choose not to believe that our climate is gradually warming, be it from either man-made sources or through the natural order of things, but changing it is. Again you can believe or not believe the scientific consensus that climate change is man-made, however are you going to bet your children's or grandchildren's future on that, as they're the ones that will pay that bill.
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Only problem I can see is that, as individuals, there is not much we can do. It needs serious commitment from all the world's politicians/ leaders; something which has been woefully lacking so far and I don't hold out much hope that will change in the near future.
Money, jobs, standards of living, etc are far more important.
Buying an EV and a heat pump ain't gonna cut it IMHO. :roll:
 
Pondrew said:
sars said:
You can choose not to believe that our climate is gradually warming, be it from either man-made sources or through the natural order of things, but changing it is. Again you can believe or not believe the scientific consensus that climate change is man-made, however are you going to bet your children's or grandchildren's future on that, as they're the ones that will pay that bill.
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Only problem I can see is that, as individuals, there is not much we can do. It needs serious commitment from all the world's politicians/ leaders; something which has been woefully lacking so far and I don't hold out much hope that will change in the near future.
Money, jobs, standards of living, etc are far more important.
Buying an EV and a heat pump ain't gonna cut it IMHO. :roll:
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Your right, as individuals there is not much we can do to change things but the ones who can change things only want it to change if they can make money from it.
Take cars for instance, they don't really care if you buy a so called greener electric car as they will just charge you more and more for using petrol/diesel instead. They don't want you to stop, they just want to find ways to make it your fault and make money from it.
 
Nictrix said:
Your right, as individuals there is not much we can do to change things but the ones who can change things only want it to change if they can make money from it.
Take cars for instance, they don't really care if you buy a so called greener electric car as they will just charge you more and more for using petrol/diesel instead. They don't want you to stop, they just want to find ways to make it your fault and make money from it.
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The more I see and read about this the more I come to the conclusion that we are totally fecked. It is quite depressing TBH.
If the scientists are correct then there is no time left for 'assessing' how we tackle the problem and make small money-making changes. I would be happy to go and live in a cave with a big blanket if it would help, but it won't so I'm not gonna! :P
 
The old adage, if one person gives you a penny it is nothing, if everyone in the whole world gives you a penny…….

But alas, Governments with large and/or poor populations have more pressing concerns than climate change.
 
As a world, we have bigger problems than climate change. Russian and muslim terrorists need to be dealt with, including their supporters.
 
Nanu said:
In addition, if as some state, we are responsible for all these greenhouse gases in the atmosphere, what happens to the flora, fauna and the sea life, which feeds on CO2 and turns it into the oxygen that we need if we stop producing CO2?
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This is a lovely example of unsound reasoning[1].

Posit: Trees consume CO2
Posit: We produce CO2

Inference: Therefore, if we stop producing CO2 the trees die

The faults are:

1) There is always naturally occurring CO2
2) While flora wants CO2, it can be poisoned by an excess of it

This is the sort of simple minded stuff seen everywhere these days in our sound bite culture and used to massive advantage by those out to make a quick buck, sow division or run for government.


[1] Not being accusatory, I just like fallacious logic
 
Sound logic actually. At least you agree that CO2 is produced naturally which we can do nothing about.

The CO2 (Carbon cycle) is a little more complex however. The more CO2 in the atmosphere, the more plants especially trees produce more green growth in the form of leaves but less fruit / flowers/ seeds. The outcome however is they take more CO2 out of the atmosphere and replace more oxygen.

Over time the levels of CO2 drop and with it leaf and oxygen production. Because the trees are under more stress they produce more fruit /flowers / seeds but take less CO2 out of the atmosphere so those levels rise again. And so the cycle repeats itself with one lagging behind the other for several years.

it would appear we at a point in the cycle with CO2 being high but nature will catch up.
 
Nanu said:
it would appear we at a point in the cycle with CO2 being high but nature will catch up.
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Have you seen long term graphs of atmospheric CO2? We’re not really in a cyclic pattern anymore, we’ve sort of shot off into the heavens.

I think you are confusing the short term carbon cycle, which involves trees and plants, with the long term one involving the fossilisation of marine life, geological processes etc.

Agree that the rest of nature will probably still catch up, but at this rate it might need us to go away first.
 
pvr said:
As a world, we have bigger problems than climate change. Russian and muslim terrorists need to be dealt with, including their supporters.
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Can't see that will ever happen as the west is too weak kneed. It knew what was going to happen with Ukrain but sat back and let it happen, as for the Arab states they've been at it for eternity and it will carry on for eternity, it's not the west's fight.

Tim.
 
I had air source Fujisi heat pumps when I lived in New Zealand (installed new as no other options except wood burner) and it was great for blowing cold air in the summer, worked OK in autumn n spring but was hopeless in mid winter, just blew a tepid draught throughout the bungalow we lived in. Oh, and in sub zero temperatures it would often cut out as the wind chill from the large fans caused a ice build up.
In a word.......PANTS......I'll stick to my woodburner n oil boiler thanks :thumbsup:
 
The bungalow I live in was built in 1971 and the heating system was warm air, think it was a thing in the 70s so you had ducting in the floors and walls with grills and a small gas burner. It was an awful heating system being noisy as it relied on a fan to push the air around and was an all or nothing warmth, dog used to like sleeping over the grill in the floor though 😀 They were basically just a large fan heater as soon it switched off the temp would drop like a stone.

Tim.
 
TitanTim said:
The bungalow I live in was built in 1971 and the heating system was warm air, think it was a thing in the 70s so you had ducting in the floors and walls with grills and a small gas burner. It was an awful heating system being noisy as it relied on a fan to push the air around and was an all or nothing warmth, dog used to like sleeping over the grill in the floor though 😀 They were basically just a large fan heater as soon it switched off the temp would drop like a stone.

Tim.
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l used to maintain them back in the day and pulling the fans and filters was a horrible job, especially if the house had cats n dogs, the dust levels were beyond!!! They also were responsible for lots of breathing problems. Fortunately the last one I serviced was over 20 years ago.
 
I guess I should rea :rofl: d back the comments as I've know idea how we've ended up at warm air heating and drowning bed bugs in France????!!!
 
On a lighter note..........(this'll kick things off again) ....mortgage lenders are going to stop remortgages or increase the premiums on houses without high EPC efficiency certificates.......yep.......YOU WILL COMPLY
This could make non complying properties un saleable......... :punch:
 
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