The jab ..

[Flyingfifer]

These vaccines have been scrutinised like no others in history

Based on the simple linearity of time this is a false statement, most vaccines go through a long process of testing on animals over a long period of time to track long term repercussions of their use as well as long term studies into human exposure. Unless we have a time machine squirreled away its impossible that this extent of testing was completed.... might also be why there was an legal invulnerability added to protect the companies should long term side effects appear.

Whatever these are, they aren't vaccine side effects. It even lists congenital conditions - you do understand the definition of congenital don't you?

Your argument is based on a false premise, obviously its not possible to say 100% certainty that these are directly due to the vaccine but that isn't the point, they might be and where there is a statistically significant number that is what helps to identify which, if any, are likely caused by each vaccine. This is partly how thalidomide's awful side effects were discovered.

In terms of congenital you would need to speak to the UK Government who produced those reports for their rationale in including those, it wasnt mgrlane or I that put that document together, we arent responsible for justifying its content.

 

[Deleted member 32480]

You have to laugh at this whole debacle or you just cry:

Died of anything within 28 days of testing positive for covid (with PCR tests that throw a number of false positives or negatives) or pronounce by a doctor to be showing covid like symptoms (incidentally the same symptoms as many other ailments) = Covid death (no questions asked)

VS:

(just an example) Died within 12 hours of having a covid vaccination =

Where does it say that any of these conditions or deaths are caused by vaccines? You do realise that people will continue to suffer from conditions and die irrespective of whether they have been vaccinated? The key is whether any of these are directly attributable to having been administered a vaccine. These vaccines have been scrutinised like no others in history and every study or investigation has pronounced them safe for use. Whatever these are, they aren't vaccine side effects. It even lists congenital conditions - you do understand the definition of congenital don't you?

Not picking on you z4pilot- just observing human bias and behaviour from my cubical in here cold mother Russia.

 

[Flyingfifer]

You have to laugh at this whole debacle or you just cry:

Died of anything within 28 days of testing positive for covid (with PCR tests that throw a number of false positives or negatives) or pronounce by a doctor to be showing covid like symptoms (incidentally the same symptoms as many other ailments) = Covid death (no questions asked)

VS:

(just an example) Died within 12 hours of having a covid vaccination =

Where does it say that any of these conditions or deaths are caused by vaccines? You do realise that people will continue to suffer from conditions and die irrespective of whether they have been vaccinated? The key is whether any of these are directly attributable to having been administered a vaccine. These vaccines have been scrutinised like no others in history and every study or investigation has pronounced them safe for use. Whatever these are, they aren't vaccine side effects. It even lists congenital conditions - you do understand the definition of congenital don't you?

Not picking on you z4pilot- just observing human bias and behaviour from my cubical in here cold mother Russia.

Very true!
This is common to everyone tbh a perfect example is when someone sees something on the news that they know is misrepresented or untrue in someway and then immediately see something else that they believe entirely as gospel and 100% indisputable fact, because its on the news and the news wouldn't lie or misrepresent. :slaphead: :slaphead: :slaphead:

 

[z4pilot]

Wow... you wait all day for a vaccine refusnik, and two show up at once.... which double act are you two styling yourself on? Is it Ant and Dec or the Chuckle Brothers, because it sure as hell isn't Crick and Watson...

Time and again you've set yourselves up as paragons - researchers par excellence and yet when challenged on the dubious information you post, you slide away and resort to tired old arguments and 'don't ask me, ask the government'.

Fact is you've changed nobodies minds on this and all you've done is reinforced your own beliefs and insecurities.

By the end of the summer, I'll be stood in a pub somewhere enjoying a pint in the certainty that I am 100% protected against against death and serious illness. You'll be proudly wearing your 'I refused the jab' t-shirt, still not knowing whether you are going to be seriously ill or worse, when you inevitably catch it ‐ and you will unless you hide away from society as it opens up and the rest of us get on with our lives.

You know when you have an odd symptom of something and look it up on Google and within 3 clicks you've self diagnosed that you've got 3 weeks to live? Well, you've had 12 months of tying yourself in knots over this. You and your bestie have lost the plot.

You'd have done better surfing porn in the last year - at least you would have got some pleasure out of it.

 

[Deleted member 32480]

By the end of the summer, I'll be stood in a pub somewhere enjoying a pint in the certainty that I am 100% protected against against death and serious illness. You'll be proudly wearing your 'I refused the jab' t-shirt, still not knowing whether you are going to be seriously ill or worse, when you inevitably catch it ‐ and you will unless you hide away from society as it opens up and the rest of us get on with our lives.

I know it's a real strange concept but I feel how you say you will feel then... Now. And I have done for 11 months out of the last 12 (1st to admit I sh1t my pants when it was 1st announced.

I have attached some further figures for you "anti-staters" to explain my reasoning for my statement above.

PS Z4pilot- nice to see you have dodged any factual debate re: above and just got straight on the offensive.

 

[craig3.2]

Wow... you wait all day for a vaccine refusnik, and two show up at once.... which double act are you two styling yourself on? Is it Ant and Dec or the Chuckle Brothers, because it sure as hell isn't Crick and Watson...

Time and again you've set yourselves up as paragons - researchers par excellence and yet when challenged on the dubious information you post, you slide away and resort to tired old arguments and 'don't ask me, ask the government'.

Fact is you've changed nobodies minds on this and all you've done is reinforced your own beliefs and insecurities.

By the end of the summer, I'll be stood in a pub somewhere enjoying a pint in the certainty that I am 100% protected against against death and serious illness. You'll be proudly wearing your 'I refused the jab' t-shirt, still not knowing whether you are going to be seriously ill or worse, when you inevitably catch it ‐ and you will unless you hide away from society as it opens up and the rest of us get on with our lives.

You know when you have an odd symptom of something and look it up on Google and within 3 clicks you've self diagnosed that you've got 3 weeks to live? Well, you've had 12 months of tying yourself in knots over this. You and your bestie have lost the plot.

You'd have done better surfing porn in the last year - at least you would have got some pleasure out of it.

 

[Deleted member 32480]

immediately see something else that they believe entirely as gospel and 100% indisputable fact, because its on the news and the news wouldn't lie or misrepresent.

Here is a prime example:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/contact/ecu/chiles-on-friday-radio-5-live-1-january-2021

 

[Flyingfifer]

Time and again you've set yourselves up as paragons - researchers par excellence and yet when challenged on the dubious information you post, you slide away and resort to tired old arguments and 'don't ask me, ask the government'.

"Dubious information" fkin LOL , mate its a UK Government report, that's a report produced by and published by the UK Government... wtf do you want? Regardless the purpose of the report was explained to you as was the reason for tracking the data as well as answering your question about why certain things were on there. I mean ffs what more could we have possibly done!?

Fact is you've changed nobodies minds on this and all you've done is reinforced your own beliefs and insecurities.

Cant speak for mgrlane but I'm not trying to change anyone's mind :idunno: I want the vaccine to be safe and the more people that take it the more data there is for me to make the decision to take it, Ive also argued for certain demographics to take the thing (over 60s) which includes my own mother and father because statistically they are at risk of the virus. My only argument here is, you do you boo and let me make my own decision.

By the end of the summer, I'll be stood in a pub somewhere enjoying a pint in the certainty that I am 100% protected against against death and serious illness. You'll be proudly wearing your 'I refused the jab' t-shirt, still not knowing whether you are going to be seriously ill or worse, when you inevitably catch it ‐ and you will unless you hide away from society as it opens up and the rest of us get on with our lives.

"in the certainty that I am 100% protected against against death and serious illness" so the jab prevents all death and serious illness now?! Jeez they need to advertise that one more :roll:
Statistically I have a 98.8% chance of recovering and a roughly 95% chance of recovering within a couple of weeks... if you want to feel superior over a couple of % feel free!

You know when you have an odd symptom of something and look it up on Google and within 3 clicks you've self diagnosed that you've got 3 weeks to live? Well, you've had 12 months of tying yourself in knots over this. You and your bestie have lost the plot.

Never done that personally, I usually just go to the doctor :idunno:

I've had "12months of tying myself in knots over this" what are you talking about, Im going to assume you meant 12 weeks given thats how old the thread is.
Incidentally my position has more or less stayed the same, I support the vaccine, I want and hope the vaccine is a success but right now based on the data I have seen balancing my risk of COVID and "long COVID" vs the benefit of the vaccine (statistically negligible for my age group) and potential risks (unknown side effects, zero protection if those do appear) and its unknown efficacy duration.... I am happy to wait.

 

[z4pilot]

To paraphrase Piers Morgan 'I don't believe a word that comes out of either of your mouths'

Just be good enough to come back on here and post up when you've had the jab eh?

 

[Flyingfifer]

To paraphrase Piers Morgan 'I don't believe a word that comes out of either of your mouths'

Just be good enough to come back on here and post up when you've had the jab eh?

It really is quite sad when someone will come along, throw accusations, aspersions and grossly misinformed "opinions" around then when they are addressed in good faith they cower and run away back to their ignorance. No wonder the dark ages lasted so long. :roll:

 

[z4pilot]

I'm not biting mate - I think the majority recognise what I've said. You go back to listening to the sound of your own voice, convincing no-one but yourself and your acolyte. Save the faux outrage and pity for someone who cares.

 

[Deleted member 32480]

Cant speak for mgrlane but I'm not trying to change anyone's mind

You speak for me with that point. I don't want to change anyone's mind- I want people to have the jab- I convinced my mother to have it when she was not going to have it (so I have defiantly have my pro-vax stripes).

I just want to be able to chat about the reasons why I don't feel it's right for me (at this moment in time) without being shat on. Not after convincing anyone to not have it.

I do find it amazing when you share data to back up your thoughts and no one shares any alternative data or talks about it other than aggressively shooting you down (pilot link for you there).

Look dudes. It's pretty much over now. It probably will spike back again when winter flu season kicks back in but next year it's not going to matter if you have had or not had the vaccine- it will all be over.

Then we can go back to arguing over how the e86 is the ultimate Z and nothing else in the range compares.

 

[Deleted member 32480]

I'm not biting mate - I think the majority recognise what I've said. You go back to listening to the sound of your own voice, convincing no-one but yourself and your acolyte. Save the faux outrage and pity for someone who cares.

Come on- lets play nice.

 

[Flyingfifer]

Then we can go back to arguing over how the e86 is the ultimate Z and nothing else in the range compares.

I mean this is something that is simply a fact and anyone that disagrees is just an anti-roofer

 

[Argyll Andy]

anyone that disagrees is just an anti-roofer

Anti-roofer and proud

I’m sure there’s a joke in there somewhere about roofs and pricks given this is the jag thead :wink:

 

[Flyingfifer]

Anti-roofer and proud

I’m sure there’s a joke in there somewhere about roofs and pricks given this is the jag thead :wink:

Youre like a half anti-roofer you have a solid roof because deep down you know the truth but you cling to the convertible life and are pro taking pricks which is also part of convertible life

 

[Argyll Andy]

Anti-roofer and proud

I’m sure there’s a joke in there somewhere about roofs and pricks given this is the jag thead :wink:

Youre like a half anti-roofer you have a solid roof because deep down you know the truth but you cling to the convertible life and are pro taking pricks which is also part of convertible life

I have a solid roof because that’s what BMW put on their convertible model of that time, if it’d been a soft top so be it :idunno:

As for you casting aspersions on convertible owners you can :rcard: off

 

[TitanTim]

From where I'm sitting in the UK, some 30 million have received the 1st vaccine dose and some 2.1 million have received second dose, looks like the chain for the all important hospital admissions have fallen considerably along with deaths which have plummeted. Fantastic the vaccine is doing it's job now and people have seen the sense the accept it which will hopefully completely lift the lockdown in the near future. Further booster vaccines planned for the Autumn, all positive stuff and thank God it's all been accomplished in super quick time with brilliant minds behind it all.

Let's hope the rest of the world catches up and we have ignored the vaccine doom mongers over the past 12 months.

Tim.

 

[Deleted member 32480]

From where I'm sitting in the UK, some 30 million have received the 1st vaccine dose and some 2.1 million have received second dose, looks like the chain for the all important hospital admissions have fallen considerably along with deaths which have plummeted.

It's amazing. To think that most of the vaccinated haven't even had their second jab and we are where we are it's great!

It's like I said to you Tim 90% of the deaths are coming from the over 60's and the pre-existing conditions. Fully vaccinate them and we have won.

Also to note- one for you "anti-stater's" who think that everyone is the same risk:

Patrick Vallance just said that a vaccinated 64 year old is as likely to end up in hospital with coronavirus as an unvaccinated 34 year old.

 

[TitanTim]

From where I'm sitting in the UK, some 30 million have received the 1st vaccine dose and some 2.1 million have received second dose, looks like the chain for the all important hospital admissions have fallen considerably along with deaths which have plummeted.

It's amazing. To think that most of the vaccinated haven't even had their second jab and we are where we are it's great!

It's like I said to you Tim 90% of the deaths are coming from the over 60's and the pre-existing conditions. Fully vaccinate them and we have won.

Also to note- one for you "anti-stater's" who think that everyone is the same risk:

Patrick Vallance just said that a vaccinated 64 year old is as likely to end up in hospital with coronavirus as an unvaccinated 34 year old.

Let's hope then increased hospitalisation of younger age groups in Europe is just a blip, maybe once these countries catch up hospitalisations will be reduced as here

Tim.