The jab ..

[Flyingfifer]

909 dead compared to 130,000+ for a bit of temporary inconvenience. I'm prepared to pay that price after seeing the mess Europe, the UK and the USA made of it. Keep on trolling though.

Very different countries/areas with very different population densities but realistically the biggest change would probably have been closing the border from the start which is something OZ 100% done right.

Maybe you'd have a different opinion if you were over 60 (and may be affected, as opposed to being effected).

I wouldn't expect the entire nation to stop their lives for the sake of me no BUT I would take the vaccine without a 2nd thought, mgrlane makes the point perfectly, if you were our age I'm sure your perspective would be different as well.

What do people hope to gain by coming to this forum perpetuating lies and misinformation about this virus? "only really effects the over 60's"
I am under 60, and my chances of dying from Covid-19 are 400 times more likely than someone aged 5-17 years. Let me say that again:
400 TIMES (source: CDC, feb 18, 2021). I'd rather not take those chances thanks, and am glad we had the loss of 'liberty & freedom' to bring about some control over the virus when we did. Happy to change my opinion if you could actually quote a single reliable source (ie, not another discredited Dr. with an anti-vax, conspiracy theory agenda), but I don't think that's likely.

Thank you for at least trying to answer with actual science,

mgrlane has already furnished you with the raw data (which was already available earlier in the thread) so you can ram your unfounded accusations of "perpetuating lies and misinformation" I will be amongst the most informed and researched people in this thread having spent considerable time actually looking at the data and reading some of the studies and research into the virus and vaccine, I don't however re-attach all the data to all my responses for the convenience of someone stumbling in and seizing on one isolated response. :roll:

You seem to believe that the vaccine prevents you from spreading the virus, that is not the case, you can still catch and carry the virus and as a result spread it, all this has already been covered (in just the last few pages) and as yet no one has provided any evidence that the vaccine prevents the spread.

Aren't they saying they are seeing alot more younger people with no underlying health issues secumbing to the new variants emerging in Europe. What I've been thinking all along with this virus is it's so unpredictable mutating away that's it's foolish to think you're totally immune because you fall into a younger age bracket.

I also think some people are just mad thinking they can forge ahead booking holidays abroad at the moment A great way of bringing some mutant variant back into the country that might make the current vaccine redundant.

Tim.

Here we go again with the enormous assumptions, I don't think I am totally immune and I don't think there is a single person here who does (with the exception of some people who have been vaccinated) to repeat for the ??th time, my position is based on a balance of risk based on the statistical risk to someone in my age bracket that catches the virus VS the entirely unknown possible long term risks of the vaccine along with the entirely unknown longevity of its effect.

Question Mr Fifer,

How have you been keeping yourself safe from Covid this last year - Have you been observing the rules like the rest of us? Are you working from home etc?

I initially took it very seriously (I had bought in bulk long shelf life foods rice, beans etc and already have MREs that I use when wild camping/hillwalking) in early January because I was watching the response in China and it looked unbelievably serious (squads of guys with guns in bio suits rounding people up, people being sealed inside buildings, drones spraying stuff in the streets etc, I tried to find the videos again but a lot of it appears to have been scrubbed from YouTube and the internet), any time I went shopping (which I reduced to only absolutely essentials) I had gloves on and then a mask when that was suggested, I treated any post like a biohazard and would immediately bin the envelopes and wash my hands after touching them. However as time went on and it became clear that this was no where near as bad as it appeared to be I have basically gone back to a normal life, I am working from home but that's because of my employer and I prefer it anyway rather than travelling. Still have half my rice left :roll:

As I have said all along my opinions and perspectives arent based on some loopy conspiracy I look at the facts and balance the risk.

 

[Deleted member 32480]

Still have half my rice left

I have 4 bags of Couscous left over from the 2nd week of march 2020 and some tinned beef that I can't bring myself to eat if you are up for a trade?

I wouldn't wish the meat on anyone but if you are happy to eat a McDonalds then it be reet for you.

 

[ronk]

So basically you are COVID free because of your isolation just like the rest of us?
Do you think there should have been an alternative regime for the 30’s ?

I still treat post, parcel deliveries, collected shopping as hazardous - I don’t see any problem with that. It’s not only about the safety of the individual

 

[Deleted member 32480]

I still treat post, parcel deliveries, collected shopping as hazardous - I don’t see any problem with that. It’s not only about the safety of the individual

When do you think you will stop doing this?

What has to happen for you to be "normal".

 

[ronk]

Still have half my rice left

I have 4 bags of Couscous left over from the 2nd week of march 2020 and some tinned beef that I can't bring myself to eat if you are up for a trade?

I wouldn't wish the meat on anyone but if you are happy to eat a McDonalds then it be reet for you.

I remember the shelves being emptied by panic buyers!

 

[Flyingfifer]

Still have half my rice left

I have 4 bags of Couscous left over from the 2nd week of march 2020 and some tinned beef that I can't bring myself to eat if you are up for a trade?

I wouldn't wish the meat on anyone but if you are happy to eat a McDonalds then it be reet for you.

I actually got some couscous as well hahaha, I actually cant remember the last time I had a McDs, was hilarious watching all the people queueing up for it when it opened

 

[ronk]

I still treat post, parcel deliveries, collected shopping as hazardous - I don’t see any problem with that. It’s not only about the safety of the individual

When do you think you will stop doing this?

What has to happen for you to be "normal".

I really don’t know and I dare say nobody else does with any certainty- but does it matter?
Costs little or nothing to wash your hands

Basic hygiene - I once saw an on duty Tesco Employee come from the Bog and not wash his hands - I informed the Store Manager

Covid might go away but dirty bastards will be here for ever!

 

[Flyingfifer]

So basically you are COVID free because of your isolation just like the rest of us?
Do you think there should have been an alternative regime for the 30’s ?

I still treat post, parcel deliveries, collected shopping as hazardous - I don’t see any problem with that. It’s not only about the safety of the individual

Not really, again only at the very very beginning I took it extremely seriously but when the reality of the threat was revealed I went back to normal...... while I of course entirely complied with the legal requirements placed upon us including definitely NOT meeting with friends and family on regular basis :?

My take on it fairly quickly was that the people at risk (over 60s and underlying conditions) should be protected but that the rest of us should really be cracking on while taking reasonable precautions (masks, social distancing etc)

I am no where near as cautious of the mail/packages but I do still wash my hands, mostly because the local RM sorting office and nearby Amazon warehouse have been sources of outbreaks.

I remember the shelves being emptied by panic buyers!

Me too, by the time that started I already had everything I needed several weeks previous (with the exception of 9000 bog rolls :roll: )

 

[Flyingfifer]

I still treat post, parcel deliveries, collected shopping as hazardous - I don’t see any problem with that. It’s not only about the safety of the individual

When do you think you will stop doing this?

What has to happen for you to be "normal".

I really don’t know and I dare say nobody else does with any certainty- but does it matter?
Costs little or nothing to wash your hands

Basic hygiene - I once saw an on duty Tesco Employee come from the Bog and not wash his hands - I informed the Store Manager

Covid might go away but dirty bastards will be here for ever!

tbh this is just sensible especially given Ron's... advanced maturity :wink:
Like you say its a very small change in the grand scheme of things

 

[Nanu]

We could all be vaccinated but why would you want to spend a couple of grand on a holiday where you still have to wear masks in that heat. Not my idea of fun so I will wait till my Xmas / New Year hols.

 

[Nanu]

Had my jab yesterday... wasn’t on the list, but phoned the qwak to see when I can have it....she said I could have it next day. Only pushed it as I want to go abroad on hols...

Had Covid in Jan, no symptoms.

Had the jab yesterday, feels like I’ve been hit by a bus today and high temps all through the night.. Apparently, if you’ve had Covid, then having the vaccine will have side effects, immune system kicking in straight away. That’s according to NHS wife and NHS friends.

Oxford AstraZeneca.

The wife and I have both had Covid the wife being quite ill in bed for 4 days and I only lost taste and smell. Both had the Oxford jab with no side effects except a sore arm.

 

[ronk]

We could all be vaccinated but why would you want to spend a couple of grand on a holiday where you still have to wear masks in that heat. Not my idea of fun so I will wait till my Xmas / New Year hols.

I had planned on our usual Germany trip and DFDS are urging us to book using the deposit from 2020 but Germany is looking like it’s vaccination plan us not working!
Looks like holiday U.K. this year - not what I wanted but better than last year!

 

[Pondy]

I initially took it very seriously (I had bought in bulk long shelf life foods rice, beans etc and already have MREs that I use when wild camping/hillwalking) in early January because I was watching the response in China and it looked unbelievably serious (squads of guys with guns in bio suits rounding people up, people being sealed inside buildings, drones spraying stuff in the streets etc, I tried to find the videos again but a lot of it appears to have been scrubbed from YouTube and the internet), any time I went shopping (which I reduced to only absolutely essentials) I had gloves on and then a mask when that was suggested, I treated any post like a biohazard and would immediately bin the envelopes and wash my hands after touching them. However as time went on and it became clear that this was no where near as bad as it appeared to be I have basically gone back to a normal life, I am working from home but that's because of my employer and I prefer it anyway rather than travelling. Still have half my rice left

That statement says an awful lot to me about your attitude and why you (and certain other people on here) continually harp on for multiple pages how you are right and we (the masses) are wrong:

It sounds very much like "I was scared initially but then I didn't die; and still haven't therefore I'm alright Jack and can't see what all the fuss is about".

If you "youngsters" are statistically so low down on the list of having complications with Covid, surely you would also be way down the list of having complications with the vaccine as you are so fit and strong; so what's the problem with having it; apart from the "human rights, freedom of expression, you are just sheep" argument?

 

[Flyingfifer]

I initially took it very seriously (I had bought in bulk long shelf life foods rice, beans etc and already have MREs that I use when wild camping/hillwalking) in early January because I was watching the response in China and it looked unbelievably serious (squads of guys with guns in bio suits rounding people up, people being sealed inside buildings, drones spraying stuff in the streets etc, I tried to find the videos again but a lot of it appears to have been scrubbed from YouTube and the internet), any time I went shopping (which I reduced to only absolutely essentials) I had gloves on and then a mask when that was suggested, I treated any post like a biohazard and would immediately bin the envelopes and wash my hands after touching them. However as time went on and it became clear that this was no where near as bad as it appeared to be I have basically gone back to a normal life, I am working from home but that's because of my employer and I prefer it anyway rather than travelling. Still have half my rice left

That statement says an awful lot to me about your attitude and why you (and certain other people on here) continually harp on for multiple pages how you are right and we (the masses) are wrong:

It sounds very much like "I was scared initially but then I didn't die; and still haven't therefore I'm alright Jack and can't see what all the fuss is about".

If you "youngsters" are statistically so low down on the list of having complications with Covid, surely you would also be way down the list of having complications with the vaccine as you are so fit and strong; so what's the problem with having it; apart from the "human rights, freedom of expression, you are just sheep" argument?

Um.. what are you talking about? I havent said anyone is wrong for getting the vaccine nor have I tried to convince anyone not to get the vaccine, in reality I have been defending my position that it's not for me but I 100% support anyone that wants it. The entire premise of your response is based on a fundamental misconception.

I was concerned originally, I was watching the footage coming out of China (the footage that was being ignored by the MSM at the time) and as I have already stated saw squads of guys in bio suits with guns rounding people up, whole apartment complexes being sealed from the outside by government agents, drones spraying the streets with unknown chemicals, people dropping (apparently) dead on the side of the street.... I was watching all this in January before it was even a thing here hence why I was prepared way before the masses, if that's some thing you want to attack me for go ahead :idunno:

Obviously as time went on the reality was significantly less severe than that with a very limited segment of the population facing a significant risk of death.

Your comment about Vaccine side effects is asinine.
To repeat, yet again, for the ??th time, we know for a fact that the virus has a very low risk for the young, we have absolutely no idea whatsoever what, if any or how severe any side effects of the vaccine might be.

There is an active shooter, you're in a safe room, you have a 98.8% chance of surviving, but you need to stay where you are and not escape or you can take a chance and run for the door, that will get you to safety from this shooter but the risks are completely unknown and there may be another shooter outside.... what do you do?

 

[Deleted member 32480]

I think you are p1ssing into the wind here FF.

 

[Flyingfifer]

I think you are p1ssing into the wind here FF.

I'm a glutton for punishment

 

[Pondy]

There is an active shooter, you're in a safe room, you have a 98.8% chance of surviving, but you need to stay where you are and not escape or you can take a chance and run for the door, that will get you to safety from this shooter but the risks are completely unknown and there may be another shooter outside.... what do you do?

I presume that is some analogy from a video game, or film (movie)?

I don't play video games; I have a life, or would if everybody got the vaccine so we could get back to it

I still don't quite comprehend your attitude of "I don't want the vaccine because there has not been enough research on it, or real world data". If that's the case, you either want the rest of us oldies to be Guinea Pigs for you, or you are happy for the rest of us to take our chances. Again, any of the above come down to a selfish attitude. This is the ONLY time in your, or my, lifetime when it is not about YOU, or ME, it is about US as a whole. I Will get my vaccine to help YOU and US, not me.

It does make me smile how everyone seems to be an instant expert on Viral medicine in the last year. I didn't realise that Googling information gives you more knowledge than a lifetime in medicine.

Do you not see that by so vehemently defending your "right" not to take the vaccine, you are actively (whether consciously or not) trying to put other's off it? Your constant use of the abbreviation MSM (which I presume means Main Stream Media) does make you sound like a conspiracy theorist, sorry, but it does. IF you don't believe the MSM, is there a "fringe" media that you do believe, or are you just using your wealth of knowledge in medicine to come to your own conclusions?

The irony is that no matter how much you defend your right; if 95% of the adult population take the vaccine, you will inevitably be marginalised. 95% cannot be wrong; it's just the way it works (whether they are or not). And you will probably end up lying to people that you have had the vaccine or they will avoid you like the plague (or the Covid).

 

[Flyingfifer]

There is an active shooter, you're in a safe room, you have a 98.8% chance of surviving, but you need to stay where you are and not escape or you can take a chance and run for the door, that will get you to safety from this shooter but the risks are completely unknown and there may be another shooter outside.... what do you do?

I presume that is some analogy from a video game, or film (movie)?

I don't play video games; I have a life, or would if everybody got the vaccine so we could get back to it

I still don't quite comprehend your attitude of "I don't want the vaccine because there has not been enough research on it, or real world data". If that's the case, you either want the rest of us oldies to be Guinea Pigs for you, or you are happy for the rest of us to take our chances. Again, any of the above come down to a selfish attitude. This is the ONLY time in your, or my, lifetime when it is not about YOU, or ME, it is about US as a whole. I Will get my vaccine to help YOU and US, not me.

It does make me smile how everyone seems to be an instant expert on Viral medicine in the last year. I didn't realise that Googling information gives you more knowledge than a lifetime in medicine.

Do you not see that by so vehemently defending your "right" not to take the vaccine, you are actively (whether consciously or not) trying to put other's off it? Your constant use of the abbreviation MSM (which I presume means Main Stream Media) does make you sound like a conspiracy theorist, sorry, but it does. IF you don't believe the MSM, is there a "fringe" media that you do believe, or are you just using your wealth of knowledge in medicine to come to your own conclusions?

The irony is that no matter how much you defend your right; if 95% of the adult population take the vaccine, you will inevitably be marginalised. 95% cannot be wrong; it's just the way it works (whether they are or not). And you will probably end up lying to people that you have had the vaccine or they will avoid you like the plague (or the Covid).

It was an attempt to simplify the concept for you into one you might have understood.... apparently it was fruitless.

At this stage your are either wilfully misunderstanding or are actually incapable of understanding. It really isn't a difficult concept. I 100% support your right to have the vaccine, I will probably take the vaccine eventually, I wont take the vaccine right now. Not rocket science :idunno:

"95% cannot be wrong"
Are you sure about that?
North Korea
Nazi Germany
Is that really a hill you want to die on?

While we are casting sweeping judgements on eachother, you're assumption and endorsement that people will be marginalised says a lot about you're own morality and ethical outlook :thumbsdown:

 

[Pondy]

It was an attempt to simplify the concept for you into one you might have understood.... apparently it was fruitless.

I'm not playing anymore as you seem incapable of not resorting to personal insults. It's happened twice now, that's twice too many.

I know I will be in your thoughts on Saturday at 11.00 when I have my jab. Thanks in advance and wish me luck

 

[Deleted member 32480]

The irony is that no matter how much you defend your right; if 95% of the adult population take the vaccine, you will inevitably be marginalised. 95% cannot be wrong; it's just the way it works (whether they are or not). And you will probably end up lying to people that you have had the

You do know that there were officially 17 recorded deaths in the UK yesterday of people that tested positive positive within 28 days of having a covid test?

You also know that no one under 50 that isn't in the vulnerable groups has been vaccinated right?

I have the figures for the hospital deaths which slightly differ but can you guess how many of those people (that died within 28 days of having a covid test) were under the age of 40?

I can give you a hint. It starts with a zero and the number is one digit long.