Self employed help from government
- Thread starter 1000rr
- Start date
For those who qualify for this scheme share your thoughts , i'm one & can't quite believe how they are setting this scheme up .
I filled in the first stage online Friday with Ni & UTR numbers , pinged up "YES you are eligible to claim your universal credit grant " from the 13th May , i only took a month out so in my mind a month is all i should claim for but when i clicked on "how we will work out your grant" it became clear that won't be a option .
Now at this point i'm thinking the government is either playing this very clever or very stupid , i'm still not sure on that :wink:
What it said was at the next stage they will have worked out what 80% of my profit equates to based on my last 3 years returns & this sum will be paid in 1 payment to cover a 3 month period
so effectively if i claimed id receive 3 times the figure i would have asked for ( approx £6k as opposed to £2k so not insignificant sums )
In the smaller print it also stated " to make the claim you will need to prove your business has been adversely affected by Covid-19 " :? so here's the clever or dumb part :wink: have they trumpeted the scheme at the beginning knowing at the end not everyone eligible will claim or are they simplifying things as they haven't the staff or systems to offer bespoke claims ? .
Perhaps i'm a fortunate ( or foolish) one here , after being self employed 30yrs i learnt early on to have at least a years money put by for worse case scenarios so i have sufficient savings to pay myself therefore technically my business has not been directly affected .
Lastly & obviously i agree with this part they state that the following years accounts the payment will need to be declared as income & therefore have tax & ni taken .
So i won't be continuing any further in my claim for any "grant" which is a little annoying as its clear the bad bit going forward is that rates of tax & ni for the self employed will be rising to cover these "grants" yet not everyone will have enjoyed the good bit
.
I filled in the first stage online Friday with Ni & UTR numbers , pinged up "YES you are eligible to claim your universal credit grant " from the 13th May , i only took a month out so in my mind a month is all i should claim for but when i clicked on "how we will work out your grant" it became clear that won't be a option .
Now at this point i'm thinking the government is either playing this very clever or very stupid , i'm still not sure on that :wink:
What it said was at the next stage they will have worked out what 80% of my profit equates to based on my last 3 years returns & this sum will be paid in 1 payment to cover a 3 month period
so effectively if i claimed id receive 3 times the figure i would have asked for ( approx £6k as opposed to £2k so not insignificant sums ) In the smaller print it also stated " to make the claim you will need to prove your business has been adversely affected by Covid-19 " :? so here's the clever or dumb part :wink: have they trumpeted the scheme at the beginning knowing at the end not everyone eligible will claim or are they simplifying things as they haven't the staff or systems to offer bespoke claims ? .
Perhaps i'm a fortunate ( or foolish) one here , after being self employed 30yrs i learnt early on to have at least a years money put by for worse case scenarios so i have sufficient savings to pay myself therefore technically my business has not been directly affected .
Lastly & obviously i agree with this part they state that the following years accounts the payment will need to be declared as income & therefore have tax & ni taken .
So i won't be continuing any further in my claim for any "grant" which is a little annoying as its clear the bad bit going forward is that rates of tax & ni for the self employed will be rising to cover these "grants" yet not everyone will have enjoyed the good bit
.1000rr said:
Call me a cynic but as its being done through the universal credit system i have a suspicion it could be "means tested" at the next stage in the process , how would i prove my business has been affected ?
I'm a sub contractor , i only lost a months income & had funds to support myself so if it does go down the means tested route i'l not be eligible .
Will have to see how it goes , i have colleagues who are lined up ready to press the buttons on the 13th May so i'l watch & wait .
I'm in the same situation as you and put my details in and I can start my claim from the 15th May. For me being a self employed joiner it's been hard for me to get materials, I can't just go and select timber and suchlike. Kitchen and bathroom supplies closed for a while making it hard work, also my customers don't want me in their houses and to be fair I don't want to be going here there and everywhere to limit my chances of contracting Covid 19. Luckily I like you don't spend all I earn and can support my lifestyle for a good while on savings. So despite me surviving I will be putting my claim in to use it as and earning as if I had been able to work.mr wilks said:For those who qualify for this scheme share your thoughts , i'm one & can't quite believe how they are setting this scheme up .
I filled in the first stage online Friday with Ni & UTR numbers , pinged up "YES you are eligible to claim your universal credit grant " from the 13th May , i only took a month out so in my mind a month is all i should claim for but when i clicked on "how we will work out your grant" it became clear that won't be a option .
Now at this point i'm thinking the government is either playing this very clever or very stupid , i'm still not sure on that :wink:
What it said was at the next stage they will have worked out what 80% of my profit equates to based on my last 3 years returns & this sum will be paid in 1 payment to cover a 3 month period
In the smaller print it also stated " to make the claim you will need to prove your business has been adversely affected by Covid-19 " :? so here's the clever or dumb part :wink: have they trumpeted the scheme at the beginning knowing at the end not everyone eligible will claim or are they simplifying things as they haven't the staff or systems to offer bespoke claims ? .
Perhaps i'm a fortunate ( or foolish) one here , after being self employed 30yrs i learnt early on to have at least a years money put by for worse case scenarios so i have sufficient savings to pay myself therefore technically my business has not been directly affected .
Lastly & obviously i agree with this part they state that the following years accounts the payment will need to be declared as income & therefore have tax & ni taken .
So i won't be continuing any further in my claim for any "grant" which is a little annoying as its clear the bad bit going forward is that rates of tax & ni for the self employed will be rising to cover these "grants" yet not everyone will have enjoyed the good bit
The only thing thats confusing me is that your not making your claim, it would be just like earning say more money on a few jobs so we just pay the extra tax & ni. Am I right in thinking that you won't make your claim because it will affect the Tax rate increase which will be inevitable for them to get some of this money back ? I believe that Taxes will increase for everyone in the next budget.
mr wilks said:
I was led to believe by Martin Lewis that the self employed could still work if possible and make the full claim at the same time. It was to supplement your wages in case you was affected and could or could not work still.
Jollyjoiner said:
I get all that but ultimately id be receiving circa £6k for what feels like i don't need & shouldn't be taking when i'm only down a months pay .
Concerned down the line if asked that i would struggle to prove how my business has been adversely affected over the CV period as although income for 4 weeks was zero i had funds to draw on .
Predominantly my work is sub contract to a large company , invoiced weekly , paid weekly i could have worked the whole time but when Boris made the big statement on the 23rd it sounded like the whole country was required to stay home where possible so i did that for 4 weeks before returning to site where i've been the last 3 weeks .
mr wilks said:
I commend your honesty then sir.
mr wilks said:
It’s not means tested... our account said it’s available for everyone that has tax returns for previous years. It’s all on file what you’ve paid in taxes and the only thing they asssk is that you’ll be trading next year. We have business savings, and that has kept us going the past 3 months, paid mortgages and running of our business property. The business savings we had have already been taxed on in Jan, so that was previous earnings, not earnings that have been lost since.
My thoughts for what they are worth is to take the money.
I am a sole trader in the building trade and have not worked since we were asked to "stay home and save lives" as I believe it is the right thing to do.
I immediately cancelled a number of jobs and a few cancelled on me, I am fortunate enough to be able to support myself through this period and have thought about not claiming the allowance. However, its not just about the loss of earnings over the past couple of months as I can deal with that. It is about the rest of the year, I think for me personally the rest of the year will be a bit of a write off as I think many people are going to be reluctant to want trades people coming into there homes. I think every trades person is going to take a big hit this year, so if Rishi is happy to give me a few quid to ease that I will take it.
With regards my business being affected, most builders merchants have been closed and the producer of the main product I use stopped manufacturing. So pretty stuffed really.
I was also under the impression that when the announcement was first made they stated you could continue working and claim the grant.
G
I am a sole trader in the building trade and have not worked since we were asked to "stay home and save lives" as I believe it is the right thing to do.
I immediately cancelled a number of jobs and a few cancelled on me, I am fortunate enough to be able to support myself through this period and have thought about not claiming the allowance. However, its not just about the loss of earnings over the past couple of months as I can deal with that. It is about the rest of the year, I think for me personally the rest of the year will be a bit of a write off as I think many people are going to be reluctant to want trades people coming into there homes. I think every trades person is going to take a big hit this year, so if Rishi is happy to give me a few quid to ease that I will take it.
With regards my business being affected, most builders merchants have been closed and the producer of the main product I use stopped manufacturing. So pretty stuffed really.
I was also under the impression that when the announcement was first made they stated you could continue working and claim the grant.
G
GM1 said:
So your'e a plasterer
£ for 1lb multi finish will be worth more than flour shortly 
Good point RE the year ahead , the company ive subbed for over 4 years now have always had more work than men but talking to the directors last week whilst their clients want us back on the current jobs to see them completed fastforward 3-4 months that could well be when the situation goes downhill for many in the trade .
I'l take a week or 2 to ponder & see how the next stage is formulated , 30+ yrs as a subby to suddenly have lump sums thrown at you from the government just has my radar beeping :wink:
Strangely enough, I have not been able to get any trades people to respond to my calls, emails or anything even though the work is nowhere near the house which is what I put in my quote requests. I cannot understand that most don't even bother to reply what so ever. I will however never contact them again in the future either.
With regards to the "free" money - in the letter from my accountant there was quite a bit of a warning in there that HMRC will be very vigorous in their checks after the event (i.e. next year), and you can almost count on an inspection of all your books. I have taken insurance out against an HMRC inspection to cover accounting fees as one thing is for sure - they will be absolutely awful next year.
With regards to the "free" money - in the letter from my accountant there was quite a bit of a warning in there that HMRC will be very vigorous in their checks after the event (i.e. next year), and you can almost count on an inspection of all your books. I have taken insurance out against an HMRC inspection to cover accounting fees as one thing is for sure - they will be absolutely awful next year.
Wouldn’t be surprised if VAT went up to 25% and NI contributions as well as income tax higher...
They’ve got to get it back somehow.
We had a bathroom scheduled to be fitted in April. The contractor cancelled due to his wife having health issues, and has taken 3 months off to shield her. Another mate, who’s a plasterer, had to cancel work due to not getting materials.. and 3 other mates have lost work as clients don’t want them in their houses.... so yes, they have all been affected by Covid.... so should be due lost earnings. There’s many that have been put on furlough ( our other two members of staff have, and we are making the additional 20% top up) and are getting paid 80% for 3 mths to stay at home, watch telly and not struggle.
Thousands who have paid into the system with Self Employment haven’t had this luxury, unless they have premises and qualify for a grant... so they should be entitled to what everyone else is entitled to.
The caveat is, if the Self Employed haven’t been honest with their books over the years, or spent as they earned they get a fraction of what they believe they should get.... caveat emptor.
Remember, the 80% is taxable and capped at just over £2k a mth. A lot are getting a lot less than a true 80%....
The true cost of the handouts will be felt for years to come.
They’ve got to get it back somehow.
We had a bathroom scheduled to be fitted in April. The contractor cancelled due to his wife having health issues, and has taken 3 months off to shield her. Another mate, who’s a plasterer, had to cancel work due to not getting materials.. and 3 other mates have lost work as clients don’t want them in their houses.... so yes, they have all been affected by Covid.... so should be due lost earnings. There’s many that have been put on furlough ( our other two members of staff have, and we are making the additional 20% top up) and are getting paid 80% for 3 mths to stay at home, watch telly and not struggle.
Thousands who have paid into the system with Self Employment haven’t had this luxury, unless they have premises and qualify for a grant... so they should be entitled to what everyone else is entitled to.
The caveat is, if the Self Employed haven’t been honest with their books over the years, or spent as they earned they get a fraction of what they believe they should get.... caveat emptor.
Remember, the 80% is taxable and capped at just over £2k a mth. A lot are getting a lot less than a true 80%....
The true cost of the handouts will be felt for years to come.
The real sh!tstorm is yet to come in my view , the furlough scheme is currently creating the illusion all is well but i know people from a wide variety of occupations already told that once the payments are taken away they won't have a job to return to , obviously some might get redundancy but not all .
Our local area of Pendle has a lot of spin off companies working within the aircraft industry as well as large companies like Rolls Royce , you really can't see these bounding back into action at anything like the rate they stopped , as for the high street / town centre shops
already struggling massively i suspect this will finish off a majority & along with that the businesses who operate within commercial property letting + maintenance this time next year our towns could well be unrecognisable .
Driving past the huge ott car dealerships ( LandRover-Jaguar / Porsche / BMW particularly spring to mind ) that have been springing up you have to wonder how they will generate enough to even cover overheads for the next 12 months & even the big hitting outlets like Bluewater & Trafford centre are reportedly staring down the barrel https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/feb/08/intu-unknown-retail-landlord-fundamental-threat
Fearful times ahead unless you are retired or civil servant
Our local area of Pendle has a lot of spin off companies working within the aircraft industry as well as large companies like Rolls Royce , you really can't see these bounding back into action at anything like the rate they stopped , as for the high street / town centre shops
already struggling massively i suspect this will finish off a majority & along with that the businesses who operate within commercial property letting + maintenance this time next year our towns could well be unrecognisable .Driving past the huge ott car dealerships ( LandRover-Jaguar / Porsche / BMW particularly spring to mind ) that have been springing up you have to wonder how they will generate enough to even cover overheads for the next 12 months & even the big hitting outlets like Bluewater & Trafford centre are reportedly staring down the barrel https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/feb/08/intu-unknown-retail-landlord-fundamental-threat
Fearful times ahead unless you are retired or civil servant
Agree Mr Wilks.
Also, staff holidays aren’t factored into furlough. Staff are entitled by law to certain amount of paid holidays. Staff on furlough have had 3 mths (minimum) at 80% and if and when they go back to work, are still entitled to full holidays. Another kick in the nuts for employers if they need to catch up with work, and the business running 100% to achieve it. People will take advantage, maybe self isolate for a further 14 days as a member of their family may have symptoms , take their holidays as it’s summer coming up and generally take the piss....
It will happen as they are allowed to by law and there’s nothing the employer can do about it...
Call me a cynic.... :?
Also, staff holidays aren’t factored into furlough. Staff are entitled by law to certain amount of paid holidays. Staff on furlough have had 3 mths (minimum) at 80% and if and when they go back to work, are still entitled to full holidays. Another kick in the nuts for employers if they need to catch up with work, and the business running 100% to achieve it. People will take advantage, maybe self isolate for a further 14 days as a member of their family may have symptoms , take their holidays as it’s summer coming up and generally take the piss....
It will happen as they are allowed to by law and there’s nothing the employer can do about it...
Call me a cynic.... :?
But at the same time, a whole new set of business opportunities pop up. Smaller, local shops will continue to flourish especially if at least a small set of people might remember who supplied them when the supermarkets were not working out. Certain companies have stepped up and gone online with their services which have enabled them with a jump which they would not have made for years otherwise.
With a bit of luck, airline tickets will go up significantly so that it is no longer cheaper to fly abroad compared to taking a train within the UK. If every ticket would go up by £100, a bailout fund would be soon repaid. Perhaps it is time that everything is not so easily accessible anymore.
With a bit of luck, airline tickets will go up significantly so that it is no longer cheaper to fly abroad compared to taking a train within the UK. If every ticket would go up by £100, a bailout fund would be soon repaid. Perhaps it is time that everything is not so easily accessible anymore.
