Megane 3 RS calipers

[Argenta]

Let me rephrase my question - Is there a decent upgrade that doesn't require spacers?

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Anybody tried the Megane 3 RS Brembo-calipers?
Seems like great value and also very near OEM bias. Brackets readily available too.

My biggest concern is if they foul the oem wheels without spacers, like the 996-calipers…?

 

[Beedub]

they will likely foul the stock rim... dont be afraid of a spacer however... plenty of space for spacers unless your wheels is aggresive / track biased setup.

whats the piston diametre?

 

[TheDan]

Yep, exactly as Beedub said, you will almost definitely need spacers, but this isn't a problem.

For example, on my non-M I have the Megane 3 RS calipers with MV2s (style 135) and 12mm spacers which clear nicely giving around 2-3mm clearance (pretty standard tolerance). The MV2s are 8x18 ET47, but with 12mm spacers this brings my effective ET down to ET35. The Z4M (style 224) wheels are 8x18 ET42.

I don't know whether there are any hub/bearing offset/track width differences between the standard Z4 and the Z4M at the front. If there aren't any differences then an approx >7mm spacer would give you the same ET as me thereby likely clearing the Megane 3 RS calipers. Bear in mind this doesn't account for different internal spoke sweeps between the different wheel designs.

 

[Argenta]

Well if you don't care about your inner liners (or removed them) its a non-issue. Call me gay but I'd like to keep mine in working order
Std rims have 235/40-18 Nankang AR1 but the 19" CSL's rub slightly too, already.
I suppose I'll stick to the oem calipers for now (and renew pads much more often).

 

[Beedub]

Well if you don't care about your inner liners (or removed them) its a non-issue. Call me gay but I'd like to keep mine in working order
Std rims have 235/40-18 Nankang AR1 but the 19" CSL's rub slightly too, already.
I suppose I'll stick to the oem calipers for now (and renew pads much more often).

no issue with my liners, perfectly in place and untouched , its unacceptable to me for this to not be in place. ( this requires a track biased setup for no contact)

 

[Argenta]

Yeah I suppose with all else std they might not rub.
Now I run KWV3 (absolute tallest setting) and -2 deg camber upfront.

 

[Argenta]

Let me rephrase my question - Is there a decent upgrade that doesn't require spacers?

Cheers!

 

[TomK]

Let me rephrase my question - Is there a decent upgrade that doesn't require spacers?
Cheers!

AP5575 calipers work fine with oem 224s (I have tried them myself) - no spacer required. Good upgrade.
https://apracing.com/performance-upgrades/factory-big-brake-kits/bmw/z4-applications/z4m-coupe-front-6-piston-kit-cp5575-1010

 

[Beedub]

Let me rephrase my question - Is there a decent upgrade that doesn't require spacers?
Cheers!

AP5575 calipers work fine with oem 224s (I have tried them myself) - no spacer required. Good upgrade.
https://apracing.com/performance-upgrades/factory-big-brake-kits/bmw/z4-applications/z4m-coupe-front-6-piston-kit-cp5575-1010

APs are fantastic but.... theirs now an 8 month lead time and a full set costs nearly 5K today. still the best braking ive ever experienced.

 

[TomK]

Let me rephrase my question - Is there a decent upgrade that doesn't require spacers?
Cheers!

AP5575 calipers work fine with oem 224s (I have tried them myself) - no spacer required. Good upgrade.
https://apracing.com/performance-upgrades/factory-big-brake-kits/bmw/z4-applications/z4m-coupe-front-6-piston-kit-cp5575-1010

APs are fantastic but.... theirs now an 8 month lead time and a full set costs nearly 5K today. still the best braking ive ever experienced.

No need for the rears really at all, so let's call it 2.5k, a lot of which you will get back on resale should you choose, unlike some butchered other oem cheap brembos. Not sure on your lead time call, martin I imagine can sort these quite quickly.
They are pretty good but very old now(15 yr old design), the newer generation I have is a big step up.

If you hang around a 2nd hand set might crop up otherwise you're looking at
https://www.raceparts.biz/bmw-e46-m3-front-replacement-ap-racing-formula-brake-kit-html.html (but sec the z4m version (hat is slightly different)).

 

[Beedub]

Which caliper are you using Tom ? Any piccies ? I take it your not using the 5575 anymore .

 

[Ed Doe]

I believe Tom has the Malc Buck AP Kits which I think uses the Pro5000R caliper, and accept a wider disc than the 5575s, which is perfect because Malc can also supply 2nd hand (minimal use) ex-BTCC discs which suit the setup for a fraction of the cost of any discs worth using with the 5575s.

For clarity I have the 5575 kit on the front of mine - so far I've managed to heat-crack a set of Performance Friction discs (about 850 a pair), and the cheap pair or Relyand Motorsport discs I replaced them with (390 a pair) are already showing signs of heat cracks after 2 trackdays...

I don't know if I'm maybe a bit harder than most on the brakes (I don't think I am?!), but I completely get why Tom (who does a lot more trackdays than I do right now) has upgraded to the Malc kit!

 

[TomK]

yeah exactly, I was sick of cracking £700 discs. They were lasting less than a year, cracked AP, PF & Reyland. Not the calipers fault mind, more a problem of heat management and 32mm discs. The pro 5000R in this application use 368 x 36mm discs which are holding up well so far, I also have a good cooling solution for them (andre's on here). https://apracing.com/race-car/brake-calipers/pro-5000-r-range

Anyway, back on topic, are there any other bbk kits that fit the OEM wheel without spacer? I don't think so other than AP5575?

 

[Beedub]

yeah exactly, I was sick of cracking £700 discs. They were lasting less than a year, cracked AP, PF & Reyland. Not the calipers fault mind, more a problem of heat management and 32mm discs. The pro 5000R in this application use 368 x 36mm discs which are holding up well so far, I also have a good cooling solution for them (andre's on here). https://apracing.com/race-car/brake-calipers/pro-5000-r-range
Photo 25-01-2021, 12 28 30.jpg
Anyway, back on topic, are there any other bbk kits that fit the OEM wheel without spacer? I don't think so other than AP5575?

Utter porn and yes i am aware that running these really hard the rotors struggle..... the that 4mm should make a huge difference to heat management.... if you dont mind me asking was the kit plug and play and how much did it set you back, 4 pots ?

i don't believe any other kits fits without spacers.

 

[TomK]

if you dont mind me asking was the kit plug and play and how much did it set you back, 4 pots ?

They are 6 pot. I think around £2.3k or so but that was with 2 pairs of pads, 2 pairs of discs and 3 sets of bobbins. Bolted right up. The big win with this stuff is that you are using ex BTCC pads and discs (they are obliged to be thrown away after every race meeting by each team) and they are then sold on. So £100 for a set of used once AP discs that retail about £900, and £80 or so for project mu pads that retail well over £300.

 

[Ed Doe]

if you dont mind me asking was the kit plug and play and how much did it set you back, 4 pots ?

They are 6 pot. I think around £2.3k or so but that was with 2 pairs of pads, 2 pairs of discs and 3 sets of bobbins. Bolted right up. The big win with this stuff is that you are using ex BTCC pads and discs (they are obliged to be thrown away after every race meeting by each team) and they are then sold on. So £100 for a set of used once AP discs that retail about £900, and £80 or so for project mu pads that retail well over £300.

Did you ever try those Raybestos ST45s Malc was doing? I've got a set in the garage waiting to go on ahead of the next trackday I do. Heard good things, but wondered what your experience was vs project mu / others?

 

[TomK]

Did you ever try those Raybestos ST45s Malc was doing? I've got a set in the garage waiting to go on ahead of the next trackday I do. Heard good things, but wondered what your experience was vs project mu / others?

I haven't, been happy with the mu tbh. There was some discussion on that fb group comparing them I seem to remember, not much between them :?

 

[Ed Doe]

Did you ever try those Raybestos ST45s Malc was doing? I've got a set in the garage waiting to go on ahead of the next trackday I do. Heard good things, but wondered what your experience was vs project mu / others?

I haven't, been happy with the mu tbh. There was some discussion on that fb group comparing them I seem to remember, not much between them :?

Ah that's a shame - what was it about them you haven't been happy with?
I guess I'll prepare to be disappointed with the st45s if they're similar :lol:

 

[TomK]

Did you ever try those Raybestos ST45s Malc was doing? I've got a set in the garage waiting to go on ahead of the next trackday I do. Heard good things, but wondered what your experience was vs project mu / others?

I haven't, been happy with the mu tbh. There was some discussion on that fb group comparing them I seem to remember, not much between them :?

Ah that's a shame - what was it about them you haven't been happy with?
I guess I'll prepare to be disappointed with the st45s if they're similar :lol:

Sorry, I meant I haven't tried the st45, I've been happy with the project mu!

 

[Ed Doe]

Sorry, I meant I haven't tried the st45, I've been happy with the project mu!

:lol: ah ok - I mean the ST45s appear to be the ones used by the BTCC boys so I'd hope they're pretty good! Looking on the Raybestos website they're fecking expensive new too, so one would hope they'd stand up to some decent abuse!!

If you're interested I'll let you know once I've put them through a trackday. Hoping for another trip to Donington around April-time next year.