Mac v Windows

[road warrior]

iPhone/iPad/ iMac integrate very well. Ie photo on one appears on other etc. You’ll have to forgive my ignorance here but does it work like that on Windows now?

time has past and now we have electricity too.. google is your friend, log on to your google account and all your photo are in the cloud and can be read by anything ! who knew eh ?
human nature is the clue here - we like what we understand and are familiar with - i mean.. all that money and the bastards only give you one mouse button ??
but slightly seriously.. neither camp has a clue what the other side has and is comfortable with what they have and know.
Although I understand some years ago apple made their over priced boxes windows compatible in an effort to get some people to buy them..

 

[road warrior]

btw, when i was VERY young and starting out, i did contemplate being an apple engineer as i reasoned there was more money in it - Kalamazoo completely ignored macs and as i lived in the backwater town of Birmingham nobody saw fit to bother with apple and so.

 

[ronk]

I get the distinct impression you don’t like Apple

I only changed when had problems with the Bluetooth connection dropping on a previous Z4 using a Samsung handset. The service manager at the BMW dealership told me that they didn’t have any troubles with IPhones - the migration from Android and Pc started then.

When I asked someone why I should use Apple they said “They just work” I’ve yet to prove them wrong.

 

[Tinker15]

iPhone/iPad/ iMac integrate very well. Ie photo on one appears on other etc. You’ll have to forgive my ignorance here but does it work like that on Windows now?

No they do not. And as the ever hilarious road warrior points out you have to use Google.

 

[road warrior]

nah im play devils advocate as usual Ronk, if they were priced to match i would have one, but here is the thing.. the original argument was " they are made for media/ graphics ect. but it was hype than and its hype now. nothing apple has produced has ever actually been better. when i was a dtp man i was sent to company to make a brochure for them on their machines. I was given a mac - the mac provided could not physically run its own mac software, and so after a week i went home and brought in my own computer - a windows pc
They just work.. another marketing thing. they worked because apple allowed nobody to write programs or or even open the case, and while millions of people wrote 1000's of programs for the ibm pc, nothing got close to dribbling amount of programs privided by apple approved sources. and what happened ? as above .. it would not run because it didntr have enough memory, unlike the ibm pc that would run it regardless and created virtual ram from the hard drive ( which apple would not allow ...)

i quote..
Jobs stated that because "customization really is mostly software now ... most of the options in other computers are in Mac", unlike the Apple II the Macintosh 128K did not need slots, which he described as costly and requiring larger size and more power.[15] It was not upgradable by the user and only Apple service centers were permitted to open the case.[16] All accessories were external, such as the MacCharlie that added IBM PC compatibility.[17] There was no provision for adding internal storage, more RAM or any upgrade cards, however some of the Macintosh engineers objected to Jobs's ideas and secretly developed workarounds for them. As an example, the Macintosh was supposed to have only 17 address lines on the motherboard, enough to support 128k of system RAM, but the design team added an additional two address lines without Jobs's knowledge, making it possible to expand the computer to 512k, although the actual act of upgrading system RAM was difficult and required piggybacking additional RAM chips overtop the onboard 4164 chips. In September 1984, after months of complaints over the Mac's inadequate RAM, Apple released an official 512k machine. Although this had always been planned from the beginning, Steve Jobs maintained if the user desired more RAM than the Mac 128 provided, he should simply pay extra money for a Mac 512 rather than upgrade the computer himself. When the Mac 512 was released, Apple rebranded the original model as "Macintosh 128k" and modified the motherboard to allow easier RAM upgrades. Improving on the hard-wired RAM thus required a motherboard replacement (which was priced similarly to a new computer), or a third-party chip replacement upgrade, which was not only expensive but would void Apple's warranty. The difficulty of fitting software into its limited free memory, coupled with the new interface and event driven programming model, discouraged software vendors from supporting it, leaving the 128K with a relatively small software library. Whereas the Macintosh Plus, and to a lesser extent the Macintosh 512K, are compatible with much later software, the 128K is limited to specially crafted programs. A stock Mac 128K with the original 64K ROM is neither compatible with Apple's external 800 KB drive with HFS nor with Apple's Hard Disk 20. A Mac 128K that has been upgraded with the newer 128K ROM (called a Macintosh 128Ke) can use internal and external 800 KB drives with HFS, as well as the HD20. Both can print on an AppleShare network, but neither can do file sharing because of their limited RAM.
and this was a full 5 YEARS after the ibm pc was invented and for sale in 1979 had upgradable slots for memory and expansion cards and hard drives. , and jobs thought 128 soldered onto the board would be sufficient.. nope..

 

[road warrior]

iPhone/iPad/ iMac integrate very well. Ie photo on one appears on other etc. You’ll have to forgive my ignorance here but does it work like that on Windows now?

No they do not. And as the ever hilarious road warrior points out you have to use Google.

is it me ? or do you think tink dont like me

 

[road warrior]

look tink, this is light hearted banter, nobody is trying to convince anybody to do anything, now you can take it for what is is, which is light hearted banter, or you can get your panties in a knot, its up to you.

 

[ronk]

Since my 100% migration to Apple I’ve never seen the Blue Screen of Death!
I don’t miss that.

 

[sp3ctre]

Road Warrior, it seems like you're the one getting wound up with your "lighthearted banter". Not quite sure what the point of the history of computers copy/paste was either.

I have used a lot of computers, HP/Dell/Microsoft... none of them "feel" as nice to use as my Mac. Some of that is the fit/finish (sure, there have been problems with specific models) and some of it is the OS. Point is, it's nice kit, it works well for me... yes it's expensive, but so are some cars, Vouis Vuitton luggage, Breitling/Rolex watches...

 

[road warrior]

Since my 100% migration to Apple I’ve never seen the Blue Screen of Death!
I don’t miss that.

HAHAHA
YEA, thats past into folk law now not seen that since windows 3.1
you have just sent cold shudders down my spine now - as an engineer @ jaguar i remember the first time some wag created the blue screen of death as a screen saver.. that was just evil !"

 

[road warrior]

Road Warrior, it seems like you're the one getting wound up with your "lighthearted banter". Not quite sure what the point of the history of computers copy/paste was either.

I have used a lot of computers, HP/Dell/Microsoft... none of them "feel" as nice to use as my Mac. Some of that is the fit/finish (sure, there have been problems with specific models) and some of it is the OS. Point is, it's nice kit, it works well for me... yes it's expensive, but so are some cars, Vouis Vuitton luggage, Breitling/Rolex watches...

if thats what you think i will stop. I spent a large part of life around computers in a professional capacity and so i care, but im not wound up, i was enjoying the banter, but i have noticed, its always the apple folk who throw their teddies out of the pram, always getting upset and justifying the apple. so lets be clear - i dont give a monkeys what you own - it doesent matter.. are we going to have a" my car is better than your car " spat anytime soon ?

 

[sp3ctre]

YEA, thats past into folk law now not seen that since windows 3.1

I see it all the time in Windows 7... on all sorts of kit. Sure, not as often as in older versions, but still there.

 

[road warrior]

YEA, thats past into folk law now not seen that since windows 3.1

I see it all the time in Windows 7... on all sorts of kit. Sure, not as often as in older versions, but still there.

where do you see it ? in what capacity ?

 

[sp3ctre]

where do you see it ? in what capacity ?

I spend a lot of time in and around lots of businesses. Mostly it is laptops that I see it in. My own corporate laptop has done it once (something to do with power management I think). Corporate laptops spend a lot of time being docked/undocked, slung in bags etc, so hardly surprising they get in a pickle occasionally.

 

[BeeEmm]

road warrior, don't copy/paste from USA Literature they spell words incorrectly. Programme is not program, centre is not center, tyre is not tire.

Fuddy Duddy

 

[road warrior]

road warrior, don't copy/paste from USA Literature they spell words incorrectly. Programme is not program, centre is not center, tyre is not tire.

Fuddy Duddy

haha - i humble in your presence Sir - my apologies - but it was after all an american writeup about an American product.

 

[mmm-five]

If we're going down memory lane...

At about 18, I started programming COBOL on IBM System 36 and then AS400. Finally went to PCs with no hard drive, twin floppy drives and 640k memory limited by the processor design.

Couldn't get a proper job programming (due to age bias, as I was told quite bluntly that as I was under 25 I wasn't seen as mature enough for the job), so I went to the temping agencies and looked for data entry/typing jobs as I could do 80wpm.

The first job they sent me to was to support a Project Management team at AP Precision Hydraulics (the company that makes AP brakes, suspension for aeroplanes, etc.).

Got there on my first morning as was sat behind a 12"x18" beige box with a screen in the middle...that was my first introduction to Macs (a Mac SE). When I asked why they were using that instead of a PC, I was told it was because there was no suitable windowing environment available for PCs and the software for doing DTP was crap.

They were EXPENSIVE though - about £4000 back then for a (with the 4mb of RAM, optional FPU, and 20mb HD).

So I was left to my own devices, and after a day I'd learnt to use DTP, word processing and spreadsheet programmes (at that time, I believe it was Aldus Persuasion, Aldus Pagemaker, Informix Wingz, and Microsoft Word). We couldn't use Powerpoint as it didn't exist, Excel would only allow about 100 rows/columns (Wingz was only limited by the amount of memory).

Until that day, I'd used DOS based programmes (WordStar, Supercalc) but everything on the Mac opened up quicker, required no typing to launch/save/close/etc. as you could use the mouse for these (or still use keyboard shortcuts). These DTP programmes were not even produced for DOS as the time. Even things like putting diacritics above/below letters for foreign languages was simple on the Mac - you didn't have to remember hundreds of Alt-ASCII codes.

I've worked on IIvi, IIvx, Classic, LCII, LCII, Performa, Centris, Quadra, PowerMac, interspersed with months/years at clients who use Windows (usually on Dell & HP, or even Wyse terminals), and I've never once missed leaving the PC/Windows world and getting back to a client that uses MacOS.

Saying all that, I'd never buy a Mac laptop or MacMini as I don't think they're worth the money - and I'd need to ensure my client could provide me with a decent monitor on site (which rarely happens) - but I've been happy with the MacPro or iMacs I've bought (tended to be the top-of-the-line version each time so that I got as many years out of it as possible). My old 2008 MacPro workhorse is being used by my sister and running the latest-but-one operating system; and my niece is using my 2008 iMac. I've not had to fix/upgrade either computer since I handed them over.

I currently have a 21.5" 2012 iMac for 'mobile' working, and a 2017 27" 5k iMac for home. Both are dual boot between MacOS Mojave and Windows 10.

I do basically the same job now, and am operating system-agnostic (between MacOS and Windows), as I work with what the client requires. My 'toolkit' consists mainly of Photoshop, InDesign, Illustrator, Quark, Word, Excel, Powerpoint, Acrobat - and in the case of the Microsoft products, I prefer to use them on Windows as they're faster (wonder why!?) and have more features.

If I needed to run Windows only, then I can't see the point in even considering buying a Mac - especially if you're going to try to justify a £250 spend on a thin tin box that's using the cheapest version of any specific component the maker can find - it's like buying pattern parts from a motor factor or using premium fuel - yes, they'll do the same job to a point, but might not last the distance or give you all the benefit you expect - but the average 'Joe' may not even notice a difference.

I do think that a fair chunk of the price difference is down to Apple being greedy - but it still doesn't mean it's not a quality product.

I use a Logitech MX Master mouse BTW - the Apple ones are s**t!

 

[TitanTim]

Road Warrior, it seems like you're the one getting wound up with your "lighthearted banter". Not quite sure what the point of the history of computers copy/paste was either.

I have used a lot of computers, HP/Dell/Microsoft... none of them "feel" as nice to use as my Mac. Some of that is the fit/finish (sure, there have been problems with specific models) and some of it is the OS. Point is, it's nice kit, it works well for me... yes it's expensive, but so are some cars, Vouis Vuitton luggage, Breitling/Rolex watches...

Apple quality perception is good but an Apple MacBook Pro compared to a Dell XPS 15 4k touch screen is no where near worth hundreds up to 1k more, if people think it is they are seriously delusioned or have plenty of money to throw away.

Tim.

 

[sp3ctre]

Apple quality perception is good but an Apple MacBook Pro compared to a Dell XPS 15 4k touch screen is no where near worth hundreds up to 1k more, if people think it is they are seriously delusioned or have plenty of money to throw away.

Tim.

But it's not just that, as well as the quality I also get to use Mac OS rather than Windows, which I much prefer.

People who buy new Z4's have money to throw away
People who buy expensive watches have money to throw away
People who buy brand name luggage have money to throw away

Point being, it's not all about "value"... You like the Dell XPS, that's great... personally I am not a fan (and I hate touch screens)

 

[sp3ctre]

Also, you say it's not "worth" £1000 more... I am really happy working on my Macbook Pro. I would be less happy working in Windows. So surely it's subjective whether that is worth £1000 or not?