Independence Day
- Thread starter David-H
- Start date
Some thoughts on the referendum.
1. The vast majority of England (and Wales) voted decisively for Leave. Just about the only places that didn't were London and a few other isolated places like Bristol, Cambridge, and Oxford. Every single Government Region in England & Wales voted to Leave, except London. Now I'm in the fortunate position that I spend a lot of time in London, travelling all over the city, including its most far flung corners. I know it very well for a provincial. I know it's consumers very well because I get paid to know where they live, where they work, how they like to spend their leisure time, where they shop, what they want, before they do. They aren't going to like this, but they are totally out of touch - London is a global city, attracts government investment in spades, has full employment and is a magnet for impoverished youth from the rest of the EU who can't find work at home because the EU has fucked their economies up. There is no downside to the EU for the average metropolitan professional in London so it isn't surprising they voted to Remain. But you need to pull your heads out of your arses and travel outside the London bubble a bit more to some of the other regions in the U.K. to understand why your compatriots voted so differently to you. The U.K. economy is massively imbalanced towards London. Government policy has consistently encouraged it with massive infrastructure projects that allow more and more people to be ferried in to the capital. Sucking more life out of the rest of the U.K. It's time we rebalanced the economy a little and allowed the rest of the U.K. to share some of the economic growth you've taken for granted. It's time you saw first hand why people feel short-changed by the EU. Last time I checked, London accounted for about 14% of the U.K. population and between 20-25% of GDP. So, even with the imbalance, 75% of the wealth of this country isn't created in London and 86% of the population don't live there.
2. If I hear one more word about "how my kids future has been ruined"....what a load of crap. You should screen shot your status and relook at it in 10 years and you'll flagellate yourself for being so pathetic. This is a global economy now not a European one. Our trade with the EU has been in steady decline for years and will continue that way. The majority of the countries in the EU have stagnant economies with low/no growth and yet you want to bind yourself to them like someone refusing to jump off a sinking ship into a lifeboat? It's only been 24 hours and yet countries are already queuing up to talk about bilateral trade agreements with us and Germany is openly talking about granting us "associate partnership" status with all 27 EU nations.
3. Second referendums - Come on, do me a favour. Just accept the result and get on with life. I've never voted for a Labour government yet but I've not demanded a new election when they are elected to govern me with less than 40% of the votes cast and as low as 30% of the votes from the eligible electorate. This is a democracy and we've voted out. There will not be a second referendum. You had a chance to make the case and you lost in a fair contest.
4. The age question - it's true young people voted in and the over 40's voted out. Is that a big surprise? I'm trying not to sound patronising but when you've had longer to experience the full range of 'benefits' of being in the EU you'll probably join the ranks of the Brexiteers. It's no coincidence that those with the most experience of the EU are consistently the strongest advocates to leave it. If the young were really that bothered then more than 36% of them would've got off their arse and exercised their democratic right. No vote no right to comment.
5. There has been a lot of name-calling. Leave voters have been castigated as xenophobes, racists, and God-knows-what- else's. Over 17m people voted out. They will all have their reasons for doing so. Every English region remember voted out (apart from London). Areas of wealth AND poverty voted out. Voters from across the political spectrum voted out. For many, like me, it will be nothing to do with immigration so quit claiming you know why we voted as we did.
6. The biggest shame is that now we have voted out, the EU member nations are openly talking about how they need to radically reform the EU. It's a pity that was never on the table before but it's typical of the institution. It's dying, in 10 years it may not even exist at all. It's biggest issue is, that it's central aim of being a European Superstate, is something only its Executive want. None of the member states want that. Yet none have the power to stop the bus without getting off.
7. Isolationist - The U.K., far from being isolationist, is actually doing what it's always done - leading Europe - towards a new way of trading together, defending one another, helping one another and reaching out to the whole world, not hiding away in our European club. We are, and always will be, a major European player, regardless of whether we are in or out the EU. We are also renowned for being the greatest travellers and explorers in the world. That won't change, we'll just look beyond Brussels and Frankfurt for a change.
1. The vast majority of England (and Wales) voted decisively for Leave. Just about the only places that didn't were London and a few other isolated places like Bristol, Cambridge, and Oxford. Every single Government Region in England & Wales voted to Leave, except London. Now I'm in the fortunate position that I spend a lot of time in London, travelling all over the city, including its most far flung corners. I know it very well for a provincial. I know it's consumers very well because I get paid to know where they live, where they work, how they like to spend their leisure time, where they shop, what they want, before they do. They aren't going to like this, but they are totally out of touch - London is a global city, attracts government investment in spades, has full employment and is a magnet for impoverished youth from the rest of the EU who can't find work at home because the EU has fucked their economies up. There is no downside to the EU for the average metropolitan professional in London so it isn't surprising they voted to Remain. But you need to pull your heads out of your arses and travel outside the London bubble a bit more to some of the other regions in the U.K. to understand why your compatriots voted so differently to you. The U.K. economy is massively imbalanced towards London. Government policy has consistently encouraged it with massive infrastructure projects that allow more and more people to be ferried in to the capital. Sucking more life out of the rest of the U.K. It's time we rebalanced the economy a little and allowed the rest of the U.K. to share some of the economic growth you've taken for granted. It's time you saw first hand why people feel short-changed by the EU. Last time I checked, London accounted for about 14% of the U.K. population and between 20-25% of GDP. So, even with the imbalance, 75% of the wealth of this country isn't created in London and 86% of the population don't live there.
2. If I hear one more word about "how my kids future has been ruined"....what a load of crap. You should screen shot your status and relook at it in 10 years and you'll flagellate yourself for being so pathetic. This is a global economy now not a European one. Our trade with the EU has been in steady decline for years and will continue that way. The majority of the countries in the EU have stagnant economies with low/no growth and yet you want to bind yourself to them like someone refusing to jump off a sinking ship into a lifeboat? It's only been 24 hours and yet countries are already queuing up to talk about bilateral trade agreements with us and Germany is openly talking about granting us "associate partnership" status with all 27 EU nations.
3. Second referendums - Come on, do me a favour. Just accept the result and get on with life. I've never voted for a Labour government yet but I've not demanded a new election when they are elected to govern me with less than 40% of the votes cast and as low as 30% of the votes from the eligible electorate. This is a democracy and we've voted out. There will not be a second referendum. You had a chance to make the case and you lost in a fair contest.
4. The age question - it's true young people voted in and the over 40's voted out. Is that a big surprise? I'm trying not to sound patronising but when you've had longer to experience the full range of 'benefits' of being in the EU you'll probably join the ranks of the Brexiteers. It's no coincidence that those with the most experience of the EU are consistently the strongest advocates to leave it. If the young were really that bothered then more than 36% of them would've got off their arse and exercised their democratic right. No vote no right to comment.
5. There has been a lot of name-calling. Leave voters have been castigated as xenophobes, racists, and God-knows-what- else's. Over 17m people voted out. They will all have their reasons for doing so. Every English region remember voted out (apart from London). Areas of wealth AND poverty voted out. Voters from across the political spectrum voted out. For many, like me, it will be nothing to do with immigration so quit claiming you know why we voted as we did.
6. The biggest shame is that now we have voted out, the EU member nations are openly talking about how they need to radically reform the EU. It's a pity that was never on the table before but it's typical of the institution. It's dying, in 10 years it may not even exist at all. It's biggest issue is, that it's central aim of being a European Superstate, is something only its Executive want. None of the member states want that. Yet none have the power to stop the bus without getting off.
7. Isolationist - The U.K., far from being isolationist, is actually doing what it's always done - leading Europe - towards a new way of trading together, defending one another, helping one another and reaching out to the whole world, not hiding away in our European club. We are, and always will be, a major European player, regardless of whether we are in or out the EU. We are also renowned for being the greatest travellers and explorers in the world. That won't change, we'll just look beyond Brussels and Frankfurt for a change.
Apparently, there's a petition for a "we want another vote / referendum" that has 2.3 million votes! Why can't the people who have raised this petition accept that they lost? For God's sake let's accept the outcome of a democratic vote and get on with it!
What the original govnor said above. Most sense i have seen written on the Internet in the last 48 hrs. I don't do facebook for the very reason of what it has promoted since the referendum result was announced but i have been shown and its mostly vile. What happened to respect your elders? You dont have to agree with them but abuse like this is unacceptable. I know plenty of well educated well off people who voted out. They are not old, stupid, racist or poor people that the media seems to portray.
99ron said:
Yep much sense & wisdom written from Og & hard to disagree with any of it
One thing that I don't totally get though is where the supposed age divide comes in ? I really haven't seen that at all :?
I.m 48 but currently work with a predominantly under 30 workforce of 10/12 & approaching the vote day I was under no illusion they were all voting out ( of the ones who were bothering but none wanted to stay in )
My son is a 24 yr old plumber looking to buy his first home , he voted out & applaud him for having the conviction to vote when I did not ( own circumstances I felt i could not win or lose with in or out )
My parents are in their 70,s , both hardened tories who voted out , they cared so much they arranged postal votes as they were on holiday on vote day
What ive taken from the whole debate is the spectrum of outers covers all ages & political followings which in a way is quite refreshing but in another the fact that half the folks who voted aren't happy is a concern for future generations
We are a island nation but we are entrepreneurial & we will survive & succeed as always , I see no doom or gloom , only opportunity
Toe-side said:AlienZed said:We're off on our annual euro cruze, wonder if the French will actually check our passports this time, or maybe slap a tariff on us .
M
Are you putting a UK badge on the car??
I would hang on before deciding on UK or GB it might have to be ENG after Ulster and Scotland go !
By the seaside...
North West Surrey
99ron said:
I agree.....am getting fed up kept being told Scotland voted to stay.....38% voted Leave....and talking to friends,work colleagues,tc.,many voted to Stay due to uncertainty for the future if we left,but don't want to vote Leave in case it all goes to pot in Scotland if we did,not because they are all in love with the EU state,Merkell and co telling us what to do,but the fear of the unkwown.
As posted elsewhere,i hope this doesn't now bring another Indy vote
