EVO Review 3 and a half stars
- Thread starter Zeld4
- Start date
tomscott said:
That is a really good point that I hadn't considered before. I did see Woots' M140i thread recently and it occurred to me just how few new car purchase topics there are on here vs some other forums. Not that it's necessarily a bad thing, of course. The hobbyist/punching-above-your-weight culture is an honest and generous one.
I wonder if longer term reviews of the M40i will go the way of the current RS5? Not really the best at anything, but no real weaknesses either (unless you count the looks, which are subjective).
Nictrix said:
In my opinion, yes and no. I get what you mean but...
The increasing standardisation across cars (including sports cars) makes it harder to differentiate if you stick to the template, but also introduces opportunities to differentiate and excite if you are willing to disrupt. I think this is an opportunity potentially missed by BMW (though I agree with tomscott's points), especially given some of the expectations I think they were setting, but it is fixable in the face lift should they feel it relevant to do so.
In more detail...
STANDARDISATION AND OPPORTUNITY
I think there is an opportunity for someone to shake up or at least make an opportunity for themselves the 'sports car' market following the continued out-pouring of what I would consider similar and distinctly lacking cars as far as 'feel' and 'thrills' are concerned. I'm referring to turbo engines, auto boxes, electric steering, too much emphasis on comfort, lots of great tech inside. The market has become stagnant as the cars have become standardised, with personality diluted by the latest tech and 'appeal to everyone' philosophies. Lots of highly competent but generally unexciting cars.
We have seen similar stories higher up the 'food chain' and opportunities being taken. Eg Porsche taking on board the reaction to the 991.1 GT3 and making a killing post 911R with the 991.2 GT3 by offering a manual and the 'touring pack' cars. The GT4 was also an award-winning revelation. Back in our world - the M2 has been well received.
AN OPPORTUNITY MISSED BY BMW
My hope with the Z4/Supra was that they would challenge this a bit under the promise of being more driver focused. The Supra is yet to be properly assessed but we are getting informed views on the Z4. My interpretation is:
It had a great starting point given it has the (relatively) great turbo 6 vs. Porsche's now infamously charisma-lacking 4 pots.
The opportunity has been partly realised by what seems to be a fairly well sorted chassis, solid interior etc. and all round 'good car'.
However, it is let down - for me at least - by three big shortcomings that I had better expectations for following BMWs promise of more driver focus and the success of the M2:
- A lack of a manual box option: To sell to those who want it - a small but not insignificant group, and to show they are serious about it being a sports car (even to the auto-buyers) - a 'halo effect'. If they can put it in an M2/3/4 and other M Performance cars, why not here?
- Variable-ratio steering rack: Electric was to be expected, and they have been getting better (I think Henry Catchpole recently commented that the latest 911s feel nearly as good as the old hydraulics?), but the variable-ratio racks are known for a complete lack of feel/connection to the road.
- The questionable looks: Personally, I was excited by the concept, disappointed by the red plastic-look cars in the early showings, and now quickly warming to the matt-silver. I think there is still some promise and expect to be more impressed in person, although the size concerns me (as I recently found sitting in an R8, bigger can mean feeling less connected). However, my biggest frustrations are some of the big plastic holes that appear to have no point (especially at the rear - it looks like they are 'blanks', urgh). It's a long way from the authenticity of the Ms of old. But at least the exhausts are still somewhat real.
FIXABLE IN THE FACELIFT
I'm not an engineer or BMW accountant, but a manual box option doesn't seem too hard to do.
Likewise, an option for electric steering without the variable ratio and some more refinement could help and doesn't seem impossible.
I do think the 'DNA' underlying the design is fairly strong, if they can just fix some of the less desirable bits.
We won't get a N/A 6 engine, but BMWs turbo 6s are strong enough and better than what most competitors offer. Though getting nearer to 400bhp would be nice.
I assume an 'M' option won't happen. But it could give the whole range a lift and shift some units in its own right. It could be that the manual box and alternative steering rack are introduced in an M variant (much like the 06-08 M went back to hydraulic). Naturally an M engine would also be amazing. I would like to hope it could happen if it is easy to bring some of the M2 bits over. But it is looking unlikely.
However, this all may be a pointless exercise as far as BMW are concerned. As noted elsewhere - who are they selling to? It may be that the looks, engine(s), interior, badge and price point are more than enough to get some people into it as opposed to the more expensive Boxter and more boring (I think) SLC. But, I do think there is a market for a properly sorted sports cars at £50K, and BMW could do better with some tweaks. Of course as an MR owner I would say that!
As for me. As things stand I am getting warmer to it, but can't see myself leaving my MR for one. Maybe as I get older and prices come down it could happen. But I think I would be more likely to put the money into an R8, Vantage or similar above something like this. However, as tomscott noted - a lot of people like new!
Good post. I'd love to think the 'fixable in the facelift' stuff had even half a chance of happening but alas I just can't see it. Whatever we think, BMW obviously thought very long and very hard about what car they wanted to build here (including their own admission that they got the E89 wrong!) and this is the result. I guess only the sales figures (along with the inevitable creative PCP deals) will ultimately prove if they were right or not. It's sometimes easy to forget that most enthusiast car forum members don't think like 90% of public buyers.
ph001 said:
Thanks. And I completely agree.
It's easy to be a critic in an armchair and must be tough for the team at BMW to create, develop and deliver their products. All decisions (box, steering, looks) must have been very carefully made by a talented team. It probably comes back to us being the unusual 10% of the market. But hey, that's what the full-fat M is for right
On the plus side, should a new Z4M never arrive, there are still some great 'step up' cars for the enthusiasts. Just hard to find without spending a fairly large amount of money
Excited to see what the Supra can deliver. Fingers crossed for a manual option. I'm enthused by the design and could live with the steering rack being the only issue.
tomscott said:
Thanks Tom for the most reasoned response I have seen on this subject. It seems to me that some on this thread (and one in particular) have been determined to dislike the G29 come hell or high water. This presumably without ever seeing the car in the flesh never mind driving it. Deciding if a car is good or bad by reading the reviews of others seems a very poor way of making a decision.
I have read that most reviews for the e89 were poor but it doesn’t take long to find some that are not. This one https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cars/bmw/bmw-z4-review/ in the Telegraph is rather good. People buy sports cars for many reasons and I’ve enjoyed owning one for around 30 years. My last two were a TVR Chimaera 450 and a Morgan Plus 8. The e89 I have only owned a few weeks but I am enjoying the experience immensely. It is of course very different to my previous cars but no worse for that.
I’m sure BMW know their intended market and that the car will sell well for them despite the views of a few folk on a forum!