CSL Replicas - Reliable?

Mrbodger said:
£1400 to £1600 plus refurb plus possibly new tyres in the not too distant future. I paid £1100 with new PSS's.
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You've merely postulated that they'd need a refurb and new tyres to justify your point.

I'd say £1100-1200 is closer to the mark with needing a refurb.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/321320515622?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

Here's an example of some that sold just 2 weeks ago. Decent tread left on decent tyres (Michelin Cups), but needing a refurb. £1225 + £250 refurb = £1475

If your patient, it's not that unrealistic. £1100 with new PSS' is also incredible value considering PSS' are ~£750 you got the reps for £350 delivered?

Most reps are £500-600, so £1250-1350 would be a more achievable price on average.
 
GP06Roadster said:
Can you actually get genuine CSLs with the CORRECT offset for non M cars?

I bought reps recently from BM Autosport, they know their stuff and the offsets are really spot on for regular Zeds. They cost £1200 with new Falken 453 all round which I was pretty happy with.

I agree on an ///M car you probably would want to go genuine as they are a direct fit, for non ///M I'd say reps are just fine.

Ps they certainly didn't seem any heavier than my 224's or MV2's
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You're right, genuine CSLs will not fit non-M cars. In which case, reps are your only option
 
Is "postulated" a real word?

Not sure what you're getting at. I'm just going by my experience when I was looking at genuine vs reps. I don't doubt genuine is the better way to go in terms of quality and resale but I couldn't justify the cost. Perhaps I could have waited and got a better deal but I didn't want too.
 
Mrbodger said:
Is "postulated" a real word?
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....yes, past tense of "postulate", meaning to make an assumption as a basis / reasoning for an argument.

Mrbodger said:
Not sure what you're getting at. I'm just going by my experience when I was looking at genuine vs reps. I don't doubt genuine is the better way to go in terms of quality and resale but I couldn't justify the cost. Perhaps I could have waited and got a better deal but I didn't want too.
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Ok, we're going in circles now. I demonstrated that you can get genuine CSLs, with decent tyres for the £1500 mark (supporting TomScotts £850 for rims estimate), which is only a couple of hundred ££'s more than reps. That's what I was "getting at".

But, you pay your money and take your choice. Each to their own etc. Personally, I believe that if you have an ///M it makes financial sense to hold out for a set of genuine CSLs.
 
I have to say there is a huge amount of snobbery around this whole "genuine v replica " debate :(
In all honesty for 99% of drivers a set of rep,s will service you just as well as the OEM alloys will when driven as 99% of us do , general everyday usage at everyday speeds on roads that can be pretty rough at times .
As for the other 1% ? Proof is in the pudding there , , , Adamski with a buckled genuine CSL :wink: My son only a matter of weeks ago buckled 2 of his genuine BBS Golf Gti alloys hitting a channel dug in the road at 30 mph :cry: It happen,s & for the most part would not have mattered if he,d been on rep,s , they may even have toughed it out over the more delicate real item,s ? No-one can say for sure as there are so many internet stories of disaster with both styles of wheel,s
As for the weight debate ? LOL , you could alter your car,s weight more by running it with a full tank of fuel :roll:
In summary we would all prefer the elitism of saying "yeah , i have genuine item,s " but in reality are they any better ?
As said you pay your money & take your choice but no one can say for sure if the higher price get,s you any better product when it comes to dealing with the potholes our roads throw up :thumbsup:
 
You can fit CSLs to a normal zed, but you'd need to roll the rear arches to accommodate the rim and probably run a fair bit of camber.

I'd go for genuine, mostly to reduce unsprung weight. That, and they're allegedly better quality.

Each to their own though.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Cracking a wheel is probably more down to our poor roads, and possibly down to lack of concentration on the drivers part rather than the quality of the alloys. Hit a big hole at 40+ your very lucky in anything to get away with no damage.

It's not snobbery, it more down to keeping the car OEM and how it was designed to be. Basically why buy a high performance car and put knock offs on it... That's my opinion. If you have a non m it's fair as the offsets aren't perfect.
 
StevenH72, I thank you for your demonstration but at the time I was buying I couldn't find any genuines for the price and I didn't want to wait any longer. The available CSL's cost more and most had crap tyres or nearly no tread.

We are going round in circles and we'll just have to disagree.

Ps, thanks for clearing up the "postulation" point, I'm going to try and use it in conversation to impress people.
 
mr wilks said:
I have to say there is a huge amount of snobbery around this whole "genuine v replica " debate :(
In all honesty for 99% of drivers a set of rep,s will service you just as well as the OEM alloys will when driven as 99% of us do , general everyday usage at everyday speeds on roads that can be pretty rough at times .
As for the other 1% ? Proof is in the pudding there , , , Adamski with a buckled genuine CSL :wink: My son only a matter of weeks ago buckled 2 of his genuine BBS Golf Gti alloys hitting a channel dug in the road at 30 mph :cry: It happen,s & for the most part would not have mattered if he,d been on rep,s , they may even have toughed it out over the more delicate real item,s ? No-one can say for sure as there are so many internet stories of disaster with both styles of wheel,s
As for the weight debate ? LOL , you could alter your car,s weight more by running it with a full tank of fuel :roll:
In summary we would all prefer the elitism of saying "yeah , i have genuine item,s " but in reality are they any better ?
As said you pay your money & take your choice but no one can say for sure if the higher price get,s you any better product when it comes to dealing with the potholes our roads throw up :thumbsup:
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very fair point, when you consider costs there probably isn't masses in it, I think the 'postulation' that a refurb will be required on second hand wheels is a reasonable one, after all, a mint set will fetch top dollar.

all in all, I've better things to spend my cash on, but, as others have said, each to their own!
 
Posting on an enthusiast's forum will naturally result in enthusiast opinions!

In relation to the original question, I think it would be difficult to argue that OEM CSLs are any more reliable than a decent set of reps bought from a reputable source.

I think its worth pointing out that we are comparing the price of brand new reps/tyres against used OEM/tyres and there is something to be said for the piece of mind that 'buying new' gives you with wheels of this nature.

Reps/PSS = one phone call, £1200, choice of colour/finish and delivery within a few days
'v'
OEM/? = weeks (months) of searching, checking authenticity, condition, £1500 + potential refurb, undisclosed damage/repairs etc etc.
'v'
New OEMs (if you can get a dealer to supply them) + PSS and you are talking £2500. Double the cost of reps.

I would never look down on a fellow ///M because it has reps, I think the only people looking out for this sort of thing on other peoples cars are the OEM owners…Possibly justifying their lighter wheels and lighter wallets with delusions of superiority! Purists would argue that 224ms are the only wheel you should be running as neither "OEM" CSLs or reps were original to the E85/86.
 
hah some interesting opinions in this one. Obviously to certain people it matters a lot, if it matters to you - go for it, i'd of thought it would to me if i had been buying them myself, but i happen to have reps now and couldnt give a flying *** - i personally think mine look better than a lot of the OEM ones i've seen, but only because of the colour combo rather than the design (they're identical). But then .. it is my car, so it's probably good that i like it.


I guess i'll bite...

Tomscott - I'd say this is my favourite: " Probably because people that own the real ones treat them with the upmost care."

Implying that someone who doesn't have "real" CSL's wont treat them with as much respect as someone who does.. get off your hobby horse lol. It may not be snobbery to you - but it comes across to me, and apparently others very much so. I'm glad you care about your car - but you've said the "if its an M it needs to be OEM" line so many times now its like you're trying to justify your purchase to yourself rather than assist the OP with his question.

The original question was whether CSL Reps are reliable, as the OP can't justify spending OEM money - IMO the answer is a yes.
 
A lot of people keep referring to the weight, I weighed the reps I had previously as i was curious and the front come in at 25.4lb and the rears 26.4lb. When compared to the genuine article this is roughly 2.5lbs per wheel or just a smidgen over 1kg in new money. Don't forget that tyres weight fluctuate by manufacturer also. So choosing a heavy tyre would negate the benefits.

In all honesty on the road there is not much difference in feel, there is an improvement, albeit a small one, when on track.
 
jimmybell said:
Tomscott - I'd say this is my favourite: " Probably because people that own the real ones treat them with the upmost care." Implying that someone who doesn't have "real" CSL's wont treat them with as much respect as someone who does.. get off your hobby horse lol. It may not be snobbery to you - but it comes across to me, and apparently others very much so. I'm glad you care about your car - but you've said the "if its an M it needs to be OEM" line so many times now its like you're trying to justify your purchase to yourselfyes.
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What BS

Basically people who buy real OEM CSL treat them with care because they are expensive and want to sell them on after selling the car... Thats what I meant. Because Reps aren't worth as much second hand it may not matter as much. And the fact why there are so few cracking issues that come up on the forum with CSLs mean either they are strong or owners take care of them.

Im here to give my opinion and thats what I've given if you want to take it as an insult because you have reps then fair enough, then so be it. It wasn't a personal insult. I don't have to justify my purchase as said I got mine in total for £1600 which is £100 more than quoted for the reps.... Hence my argument genuine in my case was better value.

Take it how you want.
 
I get why people buy CSL's but they worsen the handling and ride quality which is presumably why BMW fitted the car with 224's. The only reason to fit them is aesthetic. The weight saving argument is a load of bollocks. After all this is a road car and driving to Tesco the unsprung weight reduction won't matter a lot. Ok, I know, I'm exaggerating but you get my point.

But as nice as they look I'm getting terribly bored by them at the moment.

On Tom's car I think his 224's looked awesome and a bit different.

I think those VMR's (is that the correct name for the wheel dubsed has fitted?) look a lot better. A lot more original too.
 
The Guvnors right if you really are concerned about the affects of wheel weight 18s are the way to go.

I am considering a move away from CSLs as my track wheel to set of 18 inch Apex Arc 8s. Lighter than CSLs and the 224s and look pretty tasty too:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/apexraceparts/sets/72157625965668652/detail/

Not to mention more tyre choice at lower prices for 18s
 
I think it depends on the sus set up. With the H&Rs on my car the 224s dont feel night and day in comparison. They are only slightly more forgiving im guessing because of the tyre profiles 224s 245 240 vs 235 230. But on the standard sus I would agree.

I like the CSLs as up where I am Ive never seen another Z4M with CSLs in fact ive only seen 2 Z4Ms up here apart from the national meet. They are common on the forum... because its a forum. Even at the meets (including Silverstone classics 2 years in a row, mine was one of only a few there with real CSLs) I have barely seen any real CSLs mostly reps and like I said you can spot them a mile away, especially when people buy single dish rears.

I went down to preston to look at a C4S last weekend and they had an imola red Z4M coupe had black reps with a single dish on the rear looked awful, ruined the car.

I know its different in the south. But again its my opinion...

The VMRs are reps. Dub had Morr wheels which are forged and are very very expensive.
 
DONDP said:
The Guvnors right if you really are concerned about the affects of wheel weight 18s are the way to go.

I am considering a move away from CSLs as my track wheel to set of 18 inch Apex Arc 8s. Lighter than CSLs and the 224s and look pretty tasty too:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/apexraceparts/sets/72157625965668652/detail/

Not to mention more tyre choice at lower prices for 18s
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I have a set of Apex wheels. I wanted the ARc 8 but they don't have the clearance for the AP calipers so went for EC-7.

Very nice wheels and pretty light, but slightly inconvenient to get in the UK.

Also agree 18s are much cheaper for track rubber. And tyres generally of course.
 
DONDP said:
The Guvnors right if you really are concerned about the affects of wheel weight 18s are the way to go.

I am considering a move away from CSLs as my track wheel to set of 18 inch Apex Arc 8s. Lighter than CSLs and the 224s and look pretty tasty too:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/apexraceparts/sets/72157625965668652/detail/

Not to mention more tyre choice at lower prices for 18s
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They are very very nice, that dark red ///MC looks the bees knees on those 18"s :thumbsup:
 
ive ran CSLs for many many years and they are a strong wheel, they a flow form construction wheel which gives them a similar strength to a fully forged wheel... now i was using my CSLs on the track with sticky tyres and i wanted no doubt at all their would be a problem, and i can honestly say after years of hard use not to mention my APs getting the spokes that hot i couldnt touch them they never ever let me down..... great wheel, great looking, still one of bmws best designs however any wheel that uses a thin profile tyre will be more susceptible to buckles i guess....

would i use a rep on my car .... NO.... wouldn't dream of it... just piece of mind for how i use my car and its intended build! if it was a pure street run about... yeah i would tbh...
 
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