Android head unit upgrade options for Top hifi

[Mangozac]

My Z4M has Professional Nav and DSP Professional HiFi (options S609A and S677A) but seeing the awesome Android touchscreen units mates are fitting into their E46s is making me really jealous, so I'm looking into how I can upgrade. Let's be honest: the Nav system is pretty dated and useless. Also, my crappy old ULF module has stopped working and I'd like A2DP Bluetooth as well anyway.

My plan is to fabricate a custom housing to mount a 7" Android head unit in place of the Nav screen. This leaves me with three options for wiring the speakers:

Option 1: Connect the line outs from the Android head unit to the Z4 amp.
I'd leave the Nav head unit in place in the dash but disconnected so it's simply a placeholder. I'm led to believe that the mid-range amp works with this arrangement, as it simply needs the "stereo on" signal line to be activated in order to switch on (a signal that the Android head unit is able to provide). From what I've read though it seems that the top hifi amp won't work unless it's getting the right k-bus commands, so this option may not be possible.

Option 2: Connect the line outs from the Android head unit to the Z4 amp. Stimulate amp with BMW head unit.
If the top HiFi amp will only work with a BMW head unit connected then this could be arranged. Have the BMW head unit sending the amp on signal and k bus commands to the amp but have the line audio signals coming from the Android head unit. Only downside is the need to have both head units switched on to get audio.

Option 3: Connect the Android head unit line outs to the BMW head unit aux in.
I have a spare prefacelift BMW business CD that I could swap out the BMW nav head unit with. This way all of the radio and CD functions could be retained and provided by a stock system. If I wanted to use the Android system (which would be most of the time) I would select the aux input on the BMW head unit. This assumes that the top HiFi amp will work with the BMW business CD head unit.

Can anybody shed some light onto the signal requirements of the Top HiFi amp? Does it need more than just the amp on signal? Would the BMW business CD work with it?

 

[Mangozac]

OK, since nobody seems to be able to answer this one I did some tests today to figure it out.

The Top Hifi amplifier will work with a standard BMW Business CD head unit, with the only caveat that the EQ settings are no longer adjustable. Only bass and treble can be adjusted (and I'm not even sure if those adjustments are being made by the head unit or the amp).

I tried the amp with the k-bus disconnected and unfortunately it will not work. It needs the correct k-bus signal to operate.

Strangely, with the BMW Business CD head unit I was getting no sound if I had the Dension USB interface selected as the source. I'll have to investigate further to figure out why, but it doing things in the planned manner it should be OK.

 

[Magicarcher]

I would be interested in knowing the unit you are considering. The android units from the far east are not generally very well regarded for sound quality.

 

[Mangozac]

I would be interested in knowing the unit you are considering. The android units from the far east are not generally very well regarded for sound quality.

A friend who is quite picky regarding sound quality has an Eonon unit fitted in his E46 and he's very happy with the sound. The fit is stock looking on the E46 specific units and it's completely compatible with the steering wheel controls

 

[thecremeegg]

If you can get a template sorted I'll happily purchase from you! I really want to upgrade my nav screen too but I'm too incompetent when it comes to electrics!
Intrigued to see how you get on!

 

[markalp]

My Z4M has Professional Nav and DSP Professional HiFi (options S609A and S677A) but seeing the awesome Android touchscreen units mates are fitting into their E46s is making me really jealous, so I'm looking into how I can upgrade. Let's be honest: the Nav system is pretty dated and useless. Also, my crappy old ULF module has stopped working and I'd like A2DP Bluetooth as well anyway.

My plan is to fabricate a custom housing to mount a 7" Android head unit in place of the Nav screen. This leaves me with three options for wiring the speakers:

Option 1: Connect the line outs from the Android head unit to the Z4 amp.
I'd leave the Nav head unit in place in the dash but disconnected so it's simply a placeholder. I'm led to believe that the mid-range amp works with this arrangement, as it simply needs the "stereo on" signal line to be activated in order to switch on (a signal that the Android head unit is able to provide). From what I've read though it seems that the top hifi amp won't work unless it's getting the right k-bus commands, so this option may not be possible.

Option 2: Connect the line outs from the Android head unit to the Z4 amp. Stimulate amp with BMW head unit.
If the top HiFi amp will only work with a BMW head unit connected then this could be arranged. Have the BMW head unit sending the amp on signal and k bus commands to the amp but have the line audio signals coming from the Android head unit. Only downside is the need to have both head units switched on to get audio.

Option 3: Connect the Android head unit line outs to the BMW head unit aux in.
I have a spare prefacelift BMW business CD that I could swap out the BMW nav head unit with. This way all of the radio and CD functions could be retained and provided by a stock system. If I wanted to use the Android system (which would be most of the time) I would select the aux input on the BMW head unit. This assumes that the top HiFi amp will work with the BMW business CD head unit.

Can anybody shed some light onto the signal requirements of the Top HiFi amp? Does it need more than just the amp on signal? Would the BMW business CD work with it?

Have been thinking about this for a while, my option would be "Option 3" so you have all the basic functions taken care of with OEM equipment.

As for android head unit, myself I am thinking about using an android develoment board, paired with a suitible sunlight readable screen.

 

[AC5L4T3R]

What awesome Android head unit's are you talking about specifically?

 

[markplant]

One way to go might be, swap your head unit for the with built in display this makes radio an cd still as factory, you will need a Bluetooth adapter that plugs in , in place of the CD changer this will get the audio from your android into the factory head unit and the amp, then gut the nav screen and fit a tablet, but leave the control side of the nav screen to handle the motorisation, there's a Sony Xperia that fits perfectly

 

[markplant]

Some more pics

 

[Mangozac]

Nice work, Markplant!

The way I see it, there's a lot of work going down the modified tablet route, in addition to the cost of sourcing another Z4 display unit to modify. I think modifying an android head unit will be easier and electrically it's just plug and play. I see zero point I having the display flip up too

If you can get a template sorted I'll happily purchase from you! I really want to upgrade my nav screen too but I'm too incompetent when it comes to electrics!
Intrigued to see how you get on!

I'd likely have to make a fibreglass mukd for the housing, so I would be able to produce more of them.

Have been thinking about this for a while, my option would be "Option 3" so you have all the basic functions taken care of with OEM equipment.

As for android head unit, myself I am thinking about using an android develoment board, paired with a suitible sunlight readable screen.

My only concern with option 3 is of audio quality going in through the aux input. A better option could be to use the CD changer inputs...

 

[markalp]

Nice work, Markplant!

The way I see it, there's a lot of work going down the modified tablet route, in addition to the cost of sourcing another Z4 display unit to modify. I think modifying an android head unit will be easier and electrically it's just plug and play. I see zero point I having the display flip up too

If you can get a template sorted I'll happily purchase from you! I really want to upgrade my nav screen too but I'm too incompetent when it comes to electrics!
Intrigued to see how you get on!

I'd likely have to make a fibreglass mukd for the housing, so I would be able to produce more of them.

Have been thinking about this for a while, my option would be "Option 3" so you have all the basic functions taken care of with OEM equipment.

As for android head unit, myself I am thinking about using an android develoment board, paired with a suitible sunlight readable screen.

My only concern with option 3 is of audio quality going in through the aux input. A better option could be to use the CD changer inputs...

From my tests on the Aux In, the sound quality varies with whatever you are hooking up to it, for example something like an S9 connected directly 3.5 out -> 3.5 aux in will give a very good sound and at decent volume.

With Bluetooth audio receivers the quality varies from acceptable to stupidly bad, for ecample the "Anker SoundSync Drive Bluetooth car handsfree receiver" is so low that even when bluetooth volume is at max, you also have to have the head unit volume maxed out to get any sort of volume out of the thing. However the "FIREFLY: World's Smallest Bluetooth Receiver w/ 3.5mm AUX for Wireless Clear Audio Quality Music Streaming" has a good sound and you only have to increase the volume slightly overe where you would have it when listening to radio.

The absolute best sound out of Aux in was when i attached my old "Sound Blaster E5" to my phone then plugged that into Aux In, to my ears the sound was CD quality, and the volume is adjustable to whatever you want it to be.

some links

Sound Blaster
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Creative-E...id=1524694691&sr=1-1&keywords=soundblaster+e5

Firefly
https://www.amazon.co.uk/FIREFLY-Sm...e=UTF8&qid=1524694459&sr=1-1&keywords=firefly

Anker
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0177T3OEU/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1


If (When) I deceide to upgrade the Nav Screen with an android device, it will probably be with a phablet something like the Lenovo Phab 2 Smartphone (not available anymore I think) hooked up to an external headphone amp, fed into the aux in, with external media controls placed somewhere.

Just put a "Flic Button" in my car to control the media on my phone while driving. https://flic.io/

 

[markalp]

One way to go might be, swap your head unit for the with built in display this makes radio an cd still as factory, you will need a Bluetooth adapter that plugs in , in place of the CD changer this will get the audio from your android into the factory head unit and the amp, then gut the nav screen and fit a tablet, but leave the control side of the nav screen to handle the motorisation, there's a Sony Xperia that fits perfectly20150502_140032.jpg

Mark, what sony phone is that?

 

[Mangozac]

If (When) I deceide to upgrade the Nav Screen with an android device, it will probably be with a phablet something like the Lenovo Phab 2 Smartphone (not available anymore I think) hooked up to an external headphone amp, fed into the aux in, with external media controls placed somewhere.

Just put a "Flic Button" in my car to control the media on my phone while driving. https://flic.io/

You can get USB->i-bus interfaces which would allow integration of the steering wheel controls.

The biggest problem with embedding a tablet is power - dashboard temperatures are going to destroy a Li+ battery pretty quickly. Dedicated Android head units have power supply properly sorted, so will send the device into deep sleep when ignition is off. This is very much a hardware function so is difficult to hack a tablet to do.

 

[markplant]

One way to go might be, swap your head unit for the with built in display this makes radio an cd still as factory, you will need a Bluetooth adapter that plugs in , in place of the CD changer this will get the audio from your android into the factory head unit and the amp, then gut the nav screen and fit a tablet, but leave the control side of the nav screen to handle the motorisation, there's a Sony Xperia that fits perfectly20150502_140032.jpg

Mark, what sony phone is that?

Sony Xperia ultra, I'm sure they did 2 , and the earlier one was better, but can't remember why, maybe a size issue

 

[markalp]

If (When) I deceide to upgrade the Nav Screen with an android device, it will probably be with a phablet something like the Lenovo Phab 2 Smartphone (not available anymore I think) hooked up to an external headphone amp, fed into the aux in, with external media controls placed somewhere.

Just put a "Flic Button" in my car to control the media on my phone while driving. https://flic.io/

You can get USB->i-bus interfaces which would allow integration of the steering wheel controls.

The biggest problem with embedding a tablet is power - dashboard temperatures are going to destroy a Li+ battery pretty quickly. Dedicated Android head units have power supply properly sorted, so will send the device into deep sleep when ignition is off. This is very much a hardware function so is difficult to hack a tablet to do.

If you do want an existing Android Head Unit, I can reccomend Joying https://www.joyingauto.com/

Used two of there Head Units in the past few years and they have worked well, also if Rambo (I know lol) is still there he will answer any questions you may have.

This could probably fit where the nav screen goes, and if you get a screen extension you can locate the electronic behind the dash somewhere.
https://www.joyingauto.com/joying-6...2gb-android-car-stereo-radio-replacement.html

Hmm this looks interesting I will have to measure from the bottom of the grill now to see how much room there is, could possible just replace the current radio :/ (damn you have now got me thinking)

https://www.joyingauto.com/joying-n...t-2gb-32gb-car-stereo-for-universal-cars.html

 

[Mangozac]

If you do want an existing Android Head Unit, I can reccomend Joying https://www.joyingauto.com/

Used two of there Head Units in the past few years and they have worked well, also if Rambo (I know lol) is still there he will answer any questions you may have.

This could probably fit where the nav screen goes, and if you get a screen extension you can locate the electronic behind the dash somewhere.
https://www.joyingauto.com/joying-6...2gb-android-car-stereo-radio-replacement.html

Hmm this looks interesting I will have to measure from the bottom of the grill now to see how much room there is, could possible just replace the current radio :/ (damn you have now got me thinking)

https://www.joyingauto.com/joying-n...t-2gb-32gb-car-stereo-for-universal-cars.html

I actually emailed Joying a week or two ago to ask about steering wheel functions and I had the most useless person responding. In the end the best I could tell was that, no, their head units do not support steering wheel controls without an external adaptor module.

I had been looking at the 7" version of that screen you linked to, with exactly what you describe in mind. While poking around in the dash I see that the air ducts take up a lot of space though, so the whole package would have to fit into the same footprint (both above and below the dashboard panel) as the existing CIC display unit. It's really hard to tell without actually buying the head unit and testing it out.

Do you really think a 6.2" screen is big enough?

No way I'm going to replace the standard head unit location with anything - not once have I seen such an install that looks good

 

[Mangozac]

Quick update: eBay had 10% off si after doing a few measurements I ordered the Joying 6.2" unit. The 7" display was going to take up too much of the forward visibility!



Now to fabricate a housing for it. I'm still deciding as to the best way to wire it in but I'm leaning towards going the Business CD aux input route.

 

[yyz_bobby]

Quick update: eBay had 10% off si after doing a few measurements I ordered the Joying 6.2" unit. The 7" display was going to take up too much of the forward visibility!

20180427_161356.jpg

Now to fabricate a housing for it. I'm still deciding as to the best way to wire it in but I'm leaning towards going the Business CD aux input route.

reviving an old post but any updated pics and how that works?

link to the original screen you bought?

 

[Mangozac]

reviving an old post but any updated pics and how that works?

link to the original screen you bought?

I ended up abandoning that approach and bought an E83 X3 head unit instead. The housing needed a lot of modification and functionally it leaves a bit to be desired still but on the plus side it does mostly integrate with the car's electronics (steering wheel controls, dimming when headlights are on, etc).

 

[yyz_bobby]

reviving an old post but any updated pics and how that works?

link to the original screen you bought?

I ended up abandoning that approach and bought an E83 X3 head unit instead. The housing needed a lot of modification and functionally it leaves a bit to be desired still but on the plus side it does mostly integrate with the car's electronics (steering wheel controls, dimming when headlights are on, etc).
[/quote]

Any reason why you decided on the top head unit? Was it the AVIN one from the states?

I went and purchased a joying unit, waiting for it to arrive.