Sorry to hear you are getting death threats, thats terrible and no one deserves to be on the receiving end of that sort of behaviour. However you were a bit FULL ON and as I have already said previously, do it really matter if there are 2 EVENTS ON RUNNING AT THE SAME TIME. People can surely choose which one they want to attend as you don't have exclusive RIGHTS.
2015 NATIONAL Z4-FORUM MEET,3rd,4th,5th JULY
- Thread starter craig3.2
- Start date
BrianD said:
No, Brian it doesn't really, as long as they are not in the same area, and if on the same weekend it limits it for those wanting to attend both...that's all. AND I was a bit pd off, as me and John put ALOT of effort into this every year, and the op of the other meet only pm'd me this week, a few days apart....so not much time to reply, and then, despite several other forum members politely pointing out the National is on this same w/end every year(bar last yr due only to the tdf), the op went ahead anyway, so obviously not too bothered about dates clashing in the first place.
Anyway, can't be arsed with this crap......me and sammyz have ran this and other meets(Sammyz's Wales meets) for years now, and I think posting END Feb/EARLY March is plenty notice.
This nonsense is starting to take the shine of the meets already :thumbsdown:
craig3.2 said:
I can understand what you are saying, it just seems those who want to attend the National ALSO want to attend the other event as well, greedy buggers
Its all down to choices, the forum is here for everyone, so I don't have an issue with both going ahead or is the forum now run by dictators, I HOPE NOT
Well, don't want to be adding too serious a note to this fall out but it is against the law to cause alarm, distress and harassment by such messages - let alone 'death threats'. It's all a bit OTT and illegal.
Never known such a response on this forum and not really what any of us want to experience. Moderators?
I enjoy posting on the Facebook pages of UK and Z4 Owners and was really keen to attend the Facebook meet and try out the Snake Pass and Cat and Fiddle - not so certain I'd want to be meeting with a group that responds like this though . . . . .
what's going on??!!
Never known such a response on this forum and not really what any of us want to experience. Moderators?
I enjoy posting on the Facebook pages of UK and Z4 Owners and was really keen to attend the Facebook meet and try out the Snake Pass and Cat and Fiddle - not so certain I'd want to be meeting with a group that responds like this though . . . . .
what's going on??!!
I am totally with you Paul re death threats and harassment, Police job for the death threats.
The forum is about people freely expressing their views and understanding other members needs and seeing their view points. Like most forums it can take time for all parties to finally reach a compromise.
The forum is about people freely expressing their views and understanding other members needs and seeing their view points. Like most forums it can take time for all parties to finally reach a compromise.
By the seaside...
I'm shocked to hear that people are taking things that seriously - it's only a meet FFS. Either turn up or not, it's their choice. If I were you I'd report them, either to the mods or the plod, people can't go around with that sort of attitude - debate, or even argument, is one thing but people need to get perspective on things. And, just so people don't think I'm biased, my remark about perspective includes you Craig as your initial response was, IMO, a bit over the top (although perhaps not in Scotland :wink: )craig3.2 said:
I've said in other posts that, if you really want to 'reserve' dates for the National you should post things about it well in advance - and I mean put up placeholders with dates for 2016 & 2017 now! You can't expect people to assume that because you've organised it on previous years it's going to continue - you've said yourself that you've been tempted to defect to the P-car camp (I believe it was an 'Atlas Grey 911 c4-s with Porsche red calipers') and if that happened between Nationals how would anyone know that you're now more involved with P-car events (ZermattV has admitted this is the way he's going)
It's disappointing that it's taken something like this to bring it to a head but perhaps it's just a way of letting you know that, if you're going to continue planning a national meet, you can't expect people to 'know' that it's going to happen. The forum membership is constantly changing and if we want new members to be active in arranging meets & events there needs to be a proactive approach amongst the established membership to let them know about 'regular' events and it may take the assistance of Jim and the other mods to make this happen - someone suggested a forum event calender which sounds like a good idea to me but would need admin assistance to create and maintain
All the best
Perry
I've posted part of this on the 2014 string but want to bring it to this part of the forum as I'm concerned that unless we have someone else prepared to step up and organise the National I wouldn't be surprised if certain folk walked away from it in disgust. . .
As someone who has attended and enjoyed the last two Nationals I'm concerned about the nature of some of the responses to Craig's comments and I want to offer an alternative view.
Last year Steph and I organised a lot of runs in the North East and we hadn't thought about the conflicts this might create on the forum. We went ahead without that in mind. I learned later that it effected other people's planned and intended runs and was disappointed as I could have sorted that out easily - had I thought ahead. So when I read through Craig's response to this conflicting meet I was laughing and seeing it as another example of relative newbies doing the same. For me it was a given that, once the person who had posted an alternative meet on the same weekend was made aware, then the National would go ahead as it always has (bar the alternate weekend last year, due to La Tour) and the other event would be rescheduled - for me it was a given.
Secondly, from what I've seen at 2 Nationals I can vouch for the fact that Craig takes on an enormous responsibility for the National being a success every year - posting and organising the event, booking campsites and liaising with members over pitches, collecting monies and paying deposits, organising the hotel's Friday meal, liaising and planning of the routes with sammyz, contacting all members to coordinate attendances each day and checking that everyone is ok at the campsite and on the runs. On the Saturday he collects money from all participants for the evening BBQ, then sets out to go and buy everything needed, brings it back and we have a terrific (and reasonably costed) social night. then there's the raffle - heaven knows how Craig gets all the stuff in his Zed - last year he tried to cut down the number of prizes - there were still a dozen or more! So he's around everyone selling raffle tickets through the weekend and then does a draw where nearly everyone gets to be a winner, the first year we attended he wrote up the event and had photos and multipage reports printed in 2 national magazines and so it goes on. . . .year after year.
Craig has a genuine commitment and drive to see all these things through (some other folk do help him out) - in the main he's been the driving force behind this 'National' Z4 Forum Event year after year. He and John received a present as a formal thank you from the forum last year for their efforts over the years and it was very well deserved.
There's little wonder he's a bit sensitive over the National!
For myself and for many, I would say, this is a special Forum event - THE National Z4 Forum event that Craig has been prepared to take responsibility for and see through to completion and success year after year. It's understandable then, if his reaction is one of frustration and (what I took to be) light-hearted annoyance (he even posted lol on his original post). I can see how some folk would see the capitals as aggressive and un-necessary but to me it was a frustration born out of much effort and commitment to this special event year after year tempered with a laugh at the end (hence the lol) and remember, his efforts on our behalf!
Special events such as the National do not happen easily - they take a committed and single minded approach and having organised quite a few hoons now (including our Northumberland Castles and Coast which had 17 Zeds) I feel it's easy to under-estimate what's needed to make such an event (A full weekend remember and there were 34 Zeds in 2013) successful.
We are very lucky to have people such as Craig and Sammyz, prepared to offer such efforts so we can experience this special National event. I don't want to lose it and the date has been set for years (last year being an exception) and should be recognised as a special event in the forum year. For these reasons, for me it takes precedence over any other event and I can understand completely Craig's passion and initial irritation. (and he does use a lot of capitals!)
As a guy that sets up runs in the North East - I don't mind going to the trouble and effort of putting the runs together and leading them on the day but if folk started demanding that I publicised dates and broadcast my intentions I'd tell them to go take a jump and organise the runs themselves. . . .that's the nature of this forum it's not a car club or professional set up - it's people coming together to enjoy the ownership and use of the Zed.
Those of us that attend the National know when it's on each year - it's a given.
I wanted to support Craig's (and others') efforts (for all I can understand his response was ill judged with folk who don't know him) and wanted to state this before he takes off and tells us all where to shove it - which I'd also, sadly, understand. . . . .
Don't feel like adding my usual driving and thumbs up sign off - I'm just disappointed by this whole thing. . . . .
As someone who has attended and enjoyed the last two Nationals I'm concerned about the nature of some of the responses to Craig's comments and I want to offer an alternative view.
Last year Steph and I organised a lot of runs in the North East and we hadn't thought about the conflicts this might create on the forum. We went ahead without that in mind. I learned later that it effected other people's planned and intended runs and was disappointed as I could have sorted that out easily - had I thought ahead. So when I read through Craig's response to this conflicting meet I was laughing and seeing it as another example of relative newbies doing the same. For me it was a given that, once the person who had posted an alternative meet on the same weekend was made aware, then the National would go ahead as it always has (bar the alternate weekend last year, due to La Tour) and the other event would be rescheduled - for me it was a given.
Secondly, from what I've seen at 2 Nationals I can vouch for the fact that Craig takes on an enormous responsibility for the National being a success every year - posting and organising the event, booking campsites and liaising with members over pitches, collecting monies and paying deposits, organising the hotel's Friday meal, liaising and planning of the routes with sammyz, contacting all members to coordinate attendances each day and checking that everyone is ok at the campsite and on the runs. On the Saturday he collects money from all participants for the evening BBQ, then sets out to go and buy everything needed, brings it back and we have a terrific (and reasonably costed) social night. then there's the raffle - heaven knows how Craig gets all the stuff in his Zed - last year he tried to cut down the number of prizes - there were still a dozen or more! So he's around everyone selling raffle tickets through the weekend and then does a draw where nearly everyone gets to be a winner, the first year we attended he wrote up the event and had photos and multipage reports printed in 2 national magazines and so it goes on. . . .year after year.
Craig has a genuine commitment and drive to see all these things through (some other folk do help him out) - in the main he's been the driving force behind this 'National' Z4 Forum Event year after year. He and John received a present as a formal thank you from the forum last year for their efforts over the years and it was very well deserved.
There's little wonder he's a bit sensitive over the National!
For myself and for many, I would say, this is a special Forum event - THE National Z4 Forum event that Craig has been prepared to take responsibility for and see through to completion and success year after year. It's understandable then, if his reaction is one of frustration and (what I took to be) light-hearted annoyance (he even posted lol on his original post). I can see how some folk would see the capitals as aggressive and un-necessary but to me it was a frustration born out of much effort and commitment to this special event year after year tempered with a laugh at the end (hence the lol) and remember, his efforts on our behalf!
Special events such as the National do not happen easily - they take a committed and single minded approach and having organised quite a few hoons now (including our Northumberland Castles and Coast which had 17 Zeds) I feel it's easy to under-estimate what's needed to make such an event (A full weekend remember and there were 34 Zeds in 2013) successful.
We are very lucky to have people such as Craig and Sammyz, prepared to offer such efforts so we can experience this special National event. I don't want to lose it and the date has been set for years (last year being an exception) and should be recognised as a special event in the forum year. For these reasons, for me it takes precedence over any other event and I can understand completely Craig's passion and initial irritation. (and he does use a lot of capitals!)
As a guy that sets up runs in the North East - I don't mind going to the trouble and effort of putting the runs together and leading them on the day but if folk started demanding that I publicised dates and broadcast my intentions I'd tell them to go take a jump and organise the runs themselves. . . .that's the nature of this forum it's not a car club or professional set up - it's people coming together to enjoy the ownership and use of the Zed.
Those of us that attend the National know when it's on each year - it's a given.
I wanted to support Craig's (and others') efforts (for all I can understand his response was ill judged with folk who don't know him) and wanted to state this before he takes off and tells us all where to shove it - which I'd also, sadly, understand. . . . .
Don't feel like adding my usual driving and thumbs up sign off - I'm just disappointed by this whole thing. . . . .
Just to try and put an end to this, I pm'd those who were threatening me, and also Sarah, the op of the Snakes pass meet.
Also, first pm sent Monday, d one on Friday,27th Feb. which i replied to Friday/Sat.....
hopefully we can draw a line under this nonsense and get the Thread back on TOPIC
Also, first pm sent Monday, d one on Friday,27th Feb. which i replied to Friday/Sat.....
hopefully we can draw a line under this nonsense and get the Thread back on TOPIC
Also, thanks folks for the positive words, even the wee digs made me laugh .
Paul, cheers....but I am only part of the reason the National goes ahead every year.....without Johns Excellent Routes planning/scouting etc they wouldn't be as enjoyable.
Thanks where its due, John puts a lot of effort in too, which is always much appreciated
.Paul, cheers....but I am only part of the reason the National goes ahead every year.....without Johns Excellent Routes planning/scouting etc they wouldn't be as enjoyable.
Thanks where its due, John puts a lot of effort in too, which is always much appreciated
Excellent post Paul - the national is a pretty special event and I've been on quite a few crackers - i understand its not everyones cup of tea - but it is good to get together once a year at a location which is central for the whole of the UK - this might surprise some but this meet is still further away from me then it is for someone in central london.
Craig does a stirling job at this meet and spends weeks in the preparation for it - I think all of us in the Z4 Scotland side will remember the money he raised in 2013 going to cancer charities in memory of a member we lost that year Thanks Craig
Yes his posts were hot headed and to be frank ill considered - but this should be balanced with the fantastic work he does for the forum at this event .
Keep it up Craig ... - but i would start a 2016 National Place holder thread out now
- this might surprise some but this meet is still further away from me then it is for someone in central london.Craig does a stirling job at this meet and spends weeks in the preparation for it - I think all of us in the Z4 Scotland side will remember the money he raised in 2013 going to cancer charities in memory of a member we lost that year
Thanks Craig Yes his posts were hot headed and to be frank ill considered - but this should be balanced with the fantastic work he does for the forum at this event .
Keep it up Craig ...
- but i would start a 2016 National Place holder thread out now Glad you put the 'pleases' in Craig because in other respects your response reads as being unfriendly when the initial question was very friendly - I can now see the reason for the initial upset (especially for anyone that hasn't met, knows you or seen your posts on the forum). Nevertheless it doesn't merit the hassle that's come your way! I also believe that a few folk tried to highlight the conflicting dates later in any event. . .
Here's an idea (not mine),
As the date conflict came from two different groups, have them sign up for each meet only on their respective forum - i.e. Facebook for the Snake Pass/ Forum for the National.
Maybe that will help this year?
I'm off to bed - got a run on in the morning - first NE run of the season!
Here's an idea (not mine),
As the date conflict came from two different groups, have them sign up for each meet only on their respective forum - i.e. Facebook for the Snake Pass/ Forum for the National.
Maybe that will help this year?
I'm off to bed - got a run on in the morning - first NE run of the season!
After all this guff it makes me want to not bother Rob, and my posts weren't too bad, given the previously mentioned words and comments i said/others posted on it.
To quote a song "haters want to hate", ha-ha
Anyway, lets hope it all blows over soon mate.
Hows the Porsche?
To quote a song "haters want to hate", ha-ha
Anyway, lets hope it all blows over soon mate.
Hows the Porsche?
Hey craig put my name down for Saturday and Sunday probs stay in hotel
Chezsherman 2.0i sport sapphire black (craig)
Chezsherman 2.0i sport sapphire black (craig)