Talk to me about mileage

For me the problem with mileage is not due to perceived engine deterioration - I bought three Citroën diesels in the 90s with three years/90000 miles on the clock. All were fine as they had hacked up motorways and were construction company fleet cars until I got rid at 125000 as the next I’ve came available. It’s to do with overall wear and tear. It’s inevitable that higher mileage will have more stone chips and worn seats etc. and I like a nice presenting car. Obviously a low mileage car that is owned by someone who uses it for tiny mileages and finds it difficult to see/get in and out will be toast as well. My first car was my granny’s 17000 miles escort. It should have been perfect. It wasn’t!!
 
Spriteracer said:
I'm firmly in the "let someone else take the biggest hit financially" camp. Passed my test in 1973 and have never bought a new car. Value for money is so much greater with good quality second hand bought carefully. I always expect to have to add a bit after the purchase, but nothing near the cost to a new one. As a couple of examples, I bought a 3 or 4 year old 2006 535d touring with 60k miles on it. Paid about £17k. Original cost was north of 45k. Had to spend about £2k on it on tyres etc. initially but it was like a new car afterwards. Then just servicing and the odd bush etc onwards. I part-exed it for the Volvo XC70 and got £6k back from a Volvo dealer with with 200k+ miles on it. Much the same with a 530d touring before the 535. Currently a 2017 Audi A6 allroad. Bought at 68k miles for £18k. Again drives like new once a few teething issues sorted. Plan to keep it until either it or I wear out ! I can't see us ever having a current generation ipad on wheels. My personal pinion, but I think the current touch screen idea is a step backwards in safety as you can't operate controls without looking at them.
Click to expand...
There's something about taking delivery of a new motor though, new car smell and all that.

Reminds me of that Top Gear episode where they each bought an old 3 series and had the interiors tested for bacteria etc and I think faecal matter appeared on the list. After that it was always a new motor 🙂

Tim.
 
I've stripped down a number of engines over the years ( and watched loads of Youtube videos of people doing the same). Unless its suffered some kind of catastrophic failure which is usually related to abuse I've never seen any appreciable wear on anything that wasn't a consumable (apart from big end bearings on quite a number of BMW engines!!). As long as its not smoking then mileage isn't a consideration for me in relation to the engine.
The quality of plating, surface finishing and modern oil is such that engines just do not wear out these days.
What is a consideration are the chassis parts, especially if its got Gucci suspension like some marques of Mercedes where a new strut for each corner can cost over well £1k - old expensive cars still have expensive running costs even if they are cheap to buy.
 
Z4MAD said:
Pondrew, it would be interesting were this thread to be placed on the Ferrarichat Forum and then wait for the fallout. Mileage is everything on Ferrari's. But the reality is that many owners are fearful of incurring mileage such that their machines are used very little,... all much like having a beautiful mistress with whom you refrain from having intercourse with such that you then experience the vicarious pleasure of saving her for her next conquest.

For myself, and in days now past, mileage was absolutely crucial because higher mileage impacted the machines longevity. Not so for modern machines which seemingly have an indefinite life,... that is until the electronics create gremlins, or perhaps the gremlins may be pre-engineered to fail at a certain mileage or/and time.

The metallurgy of new motor cars is of such great integrity and this factor conjoined to the new lubricants does create the huge potential for great longevity. It is said that the majority of wear in an engine is created when the engine is started from cold such that at this point and until the whole engine is properly warmed throughout its structure such that the myriad disparate coefficients of expansion of the extensive variety of materials is at their optimum working temperature prior to easing the engine into its higher band of revolutions. This requires judicious use of the machine for the first fifteen miles or so and not just when the engine thermometer reads 'normal'. Essentially, it is harsh and injudicious usage that holds the potential for problems in the long term.

All the herebefore written notwithstanding, a well maintained and properly cared for motor car has a 'look' to it which radiates this most important factor to any prospective purchaser that has an eye for detail. So yes, low mileage can be an extremely important factor, but it in the light of the overall purchasing equation and when examining all pertinent factors, a really nice high mileage motor car may frequently hold the potential of providing a most blissful and ongoing aspect of nirvana.
Click to expand...
There's a Ferrari 308 currently for sale in the uk with 270k miles on it

They are asking £80k for it which is on par for low mile examples

The high miler looks in very good condition and has had a lot of money spent on it

What would you rather have a car that's been driven and used and maintained or one that has sat unused for years and perhaps only sporadic servicing?
 
Most buyers of really expensive cars seem to finance them in one way or another and then change them after a few years so its critical to keep the mileage down unless they are minted!
Harrys Garage did a video about it.
 
I look at this from a value perspective,
  • I change oil every 3000 miles, (Maybe excessive, i just don't drive a lot, once a year), engine is healthy at low cost
  • I have a hardtop so i can drive in winter and i can get sun on the good days of summer
  • Plenty of parts at good prices and lots of cars were sold so plenty of part for many years.
  • Everything that can happen has been documented so fixes exist.
  • Some aftermarket for visual side
  • The E85 looks unique, i can remove the badges and people will know its a Z4 and didnt cost me £120000+
  • Suspension is a bit stiff, but i do have coilovers
I enjoy driving it and i dont need 4m BHP to do so. 110k miles, If the M54 last up to the usual numbers, i will be driving in the great road in the sky before the car fails. £6000 for a car in good condition is a bargain, 150k or not, thinking of maintnance is more important, 150k car everthing that would fail has been fixed. Yes mine was £4000, but i had to do lots of fixes and a supercharger for a bit more fun, so worth at least £110000 :)
 
Another aspect on engine longevity is related to how much stress the engine is under, high compression, forced induction, maximum rpm etcetera affect engine stress. A 96L V16 Cummins diesel running continuously and producing 3200 bhp @ 1500 rpm versus a NA 890 cc twin producing 120 bhp @ 10,750 rpm, I think I can guess which one will last more hours
 
So true. There is a reason lots of trucks do over a million miles without having the engine apart at all. Essentially related to revs.
 
Bmwz4ruby said:
It’s an interesting topic and I’m firmly in the “I like high mileage cars and have never had a bad one”.

My 2006 E90 330d is now on 207,000 miles (108,000 with me personally). I have never done anything engine wise in 11 years other than change oil, filter and air filter every 10,000. In that time the engine hasn’t changed one bit and is as quiet and strong as ever (never had an engine management light come on either). I also had it mapped about 6 years back with zero negative consequences. Even the factory clutch and flywheel managed 165,000 and I could have put the original clutch plate back in but as I was doing the flywheel which was rattling I just did everything.

Body wise is got some battle scars but they are trivial and I still wash and polish it regularly. Drivers front wing has a very small amount of rust so I will swap it in the next couple of years for a correct colour item off a car being broken.

Everything else is wearing as expected of age and mileage. Everything works and it’s still a very quick and frugal car (650 miles to a tank is quite easy). It’s also still on the factory dpf and it has never given me any issues.

I have done loads of replacement parts over the years but nothing I wouldn’t have expected to do and because it’s never been to a garage (only for MOT’s) it has been very cheap to keep going. I have no intentions of getting rid for at least another 5 years and don’t foresee any need to because of a failure of something expensive.

I think cars changed massively around the mid 1990’s until mid 2010’s. This was peak car period for me. I don’t see anything newer that suits all my requirements and generally feel we are going backwards with cars today.
Click to expand...
That gives me hope eternal for my n57 330d e91. I change the oil around 10k and it’s just gone over 166k…
 
bigwinn said:
That gives me hope eternal for my n57 330d e91. I change the oil around 10k and it’s just gone over 166k…
Click to expand...
Mine is an M57 (the bullet proof one) as I’m sure you know, but I’m under the impression that the N57 is still a very solid engine and those regular oil changes will keep it sweet.
 
The mighty M57 in a Z4 (E85/E86) would be a lively drive, especially with a remap.

I thought the article started well, but soon made stuff up.
 
I am finding the comments regarding low mileage and lack of servicing very apt at the minute.
I am looking for a low mileage (I know!) Fiesta for my daughter. The Fiestas have the 1 litre ecoboost which have a 'wet cambelt'. According to everybody, it is imperative that the oil is changed regularly to prevent the belt disintegrating and bits clogging up the oil pump and lunching the engine. Oil in good condition is the key to preventing problems, apparently.

I cannot find a single Fiesta that has had Ford's schedule of servicing, purely down to low miles and the 'it's only done a few thousand in the last 2 years so why pay to have a service?' attitude.

This is probably a direct result of main dealers (and most garages) charging so much for a simple oil and filter change.
 
Pondrew said:
I am finding the comments regarding low mileage and lack of servicing very apt at the minute.
I am looking for a low mileage (I know!) Fiesta for my daughter. The Fiestas have the 1 litre ecoboost which have a 'wet cambelt'. According to everybody, it is imperative that the oil is changed regularly to prevent the belt disintegrating and bits clogging up the oil pump and lunching the engine. Oil in good condition is the key to preventing problems, apparently.

I cannot find a single Fiesta that has had Ford's schedule of servicing, purely down to low miles and the 'it's only done a few thousand in the last 2 years so why pay to have a service?' attitude.

This is probably a direct result of main dealers (and most garages) charging so much for a simple oil and filter change.
Click to expand...
Regular oil changes won't make a difference. The problem is the belt breaking down and blocking the oil pump strainer.

Buy a hybrid 1 litre ecoboost as they changed the belt to a chain. The hybrids started around 2020 in the fiesta.
 
Purely anecdotal but I’ve owned two ‘high’ miles cars, my last Z4 3.0 had 110k when I bought it and 125k when I sold it. Only needed a water pump during my ownership. The other was an old 200tdi disco with 197 and 217k miles respectively and needed nothing other than a service. By contrast my avatar toy needed £2500 spending on it at 4500 miles and 8 years. Cat, egr valve, coolant hoses, radiator and brakes. When I got it at 5k it still needed some bits and bobs ironing out. Now in my stewardship and doing 1500-2000 per annum it’s seeming to have fewer and fewer issues. (Fingers crossed)🤞
 
Pondrew said:
I am looking for a low mileage (I know!) Fiesta for my daughter. The Fiestas have the 1 litre ecoboost which have a 'wet cambelt'. According to everybody, it is imperative that the oil is changed regularly to prevent the belt disintegrating and bits clogging up the oil pump and lunching the engine. Oil in good condition is the key to preventing problems, apparently.
Click to expand...
I would never even consider buying an Ecoboom Ford regardless of mileage!

There aren't many garages that will replace the belts on them, and those that do tend to want over £1K for the job.

One of the benefits of having only had BMWs for over 20 years is that they have all had cam-chains. :D
 
Have you thought about an Abarth? So much nicer than a Ford and the belt change costs £400 including alternator belt and water pump.

Surprised about the lack of servicing though as most would have been bought with a service pack I would have thought.
 
Don't think you would go wrong with a Mazda 2 or a Hyundai i10 or i20 or any small Japanese/Korean motor.

I wouldn't touch a Ford with bargepole to be honest.

Tim.
 
Higher milage cars as has been said before can be well looked after or abused

I have just sold my 09 120d with 164,000 miles and it was tired but only ever let me down once with a broken front spring
Oil changed regular when I worked at a power station oil was free so changed every time we where in at a weekend so sometimes 6weeks but never more than 8,000 to 10,000 mile when I had to buy the oil
I changed all the suspension at around 90,000 and when I sold it it had a leaky rear shock so 80,000 from the shockers seams around the life cycle

I now have a 330d F31 X drive auto it is on 109,000 when I got it
First few years serviced by BMW at the long service intervals then every 10,000 ish miles between

It has a possible leaky shock
I have no evidence of the gearbox oil and filter being changed, so I have this to do along with the transfers box, front and rear diffs
I have priced the suspension and going to change all of that

It looks like it has a few new shiny bits fitted around the engine not look into what they are yet

The garage fitted new discs on the front as it had the wrong pads fitted and the discs where worn wrong

My Z4M was on 80,000ish when I got it and now on 113,00 (I think)

As some know it has had a lot of work done to it as I wanted it right and there was NO service history so all the known issues have been done my me

Race engines will be rebuilt after around 40 hours of racing

The gas turbines at the power station where rebuilt every 24,000 hours but you take off extra hours for cold starts full load trips etc

For me if the body work is good most other things can be sorted (mechanical engineer by trade) the bits that will fail is suspension and auxiliary parts like starter motor, alternator, water pump etc
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom