It can't be very low a temperature for diesel, because when I was growing up in the frozen North of Scotland, buses and lorries used to get freezing diesel fairly regularly in winter.
No school bus
No school bus
Z4 + Snow
- Thread starter frankiefish
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Wondermike said:It can't be very low a temperature for diesel, because when I was growing up in the frozen North of Scotland, buses and lorries used to get freezing diesel fairly regularly in winter.
No school bus
Ha... I remember those days! Pesky additives...
Answer from the web:
"Like most fuels, diesel is a mix of hydrocarbons, and the components have different freezing points. For Number 2 diesel, as the ambient temperatures drop toward 32 degrees F (0 degrees C), it begins to cloud, due to the paraffin in the fuel solidifying. As the temperatures drop below 32 F, the molecules combine into solids, large enough to be stopped by the filter. This is known as the gel point, and generally occurs about 15 degrees F (-9.5 degrees C) below the cloud point.
This wax then forms a coating on the filter which results in a loss of engine power. The same thing happens on starting an engine when the temperature is below freezing. The filter becomes almost instantly coated with wax - usually, enough fuel gets through to allow the engine to idle, but not attain operating RPM. There are two common ways to overcome this: one is a diesel additive, the other is a fuel heater.
In Alaska and other colder climates, lorries are running regularly at minus 51 degrees or lower so as you see it depends on additives and heating but to freeze as in turning solid you would need laboratory conditions as nature cannot go cold enough to freeze to a low enough temperature."
bulldog5046
Member
diesel turns into a gel at about -9.5C
the climate wont get cold enough it freeze petrol, i dont know the exact point but its stupidly cold.
EDIT: if you using homemade bio-diesel then it freezes much quicker.
the climate wont get cold enough it freeze petrol, i dont know the exact point but its stupidly cold.
EDIT: if you using homemade bio-diesel then it freezes much quicker.
mcbeee said:
Good post too. To add some science...Freezing of Gasoline (Petrol)
Fuels like gasoline are really a cocktail of hydrocarbons. Thicker, oil-like stuff at room temperature with some thinner ones, and also aromatics that are gaseous at room temperature. So by freezing, you mean, when does it turn solid? The heavier hydrocarbons will start to solidify sooner than the aromatics.
The flash point of gasoline is about -97F, meaning that it will still burn at 97 degrees below zero. Most labs won't even have the ability to chill a sample down that far to find out! Even the -97F mark is going to vary, based on the additives in the sample.
Of course, if there is any water mixed in with the fuel, it can still freeze at around 32F, but that may depend on if there are any alcohols mixed with the sample. Methyl alcohol is a common additive you can buy to help keep water in your gas tank from freezing at low temperatures.
The thicker, heavier hydrocarbons, like paraffin will become solid at atmospheric temperatures. Some of the aromatics won't turn solid until -200F to -300F. Not something you'll see outside of a lab.
Have noticed a lot of new potholes appearing in and around Durham,quite a few of them on the roads that i use regularly,So not only spring damage but also wheel damage.If they have'nt got the money to repair the roads whats the chances of claiming from them when the car is damaged due to poor road condition.The Moo said:
EdButler said:
But the Italian police didn't stop you for speeding, their roads were wide and empty and had excellent quality tarmac on them and at no point, when entering a major city, did you have to pay an additional charge to enter a congestion zone!
I do generally agree, our road tax is quite low compared to the toll fee's across Europe - the issue is that you can choose to use the toll roads in Europe or you can use the other A-Roads instead. Both of which are of a much higher quality than the roads in the UK.
Redzedfour said:
It'll come out of a different budget pot and so it's likely you'll be able to make a claim. I've been told in the past that the councils put aside a pot each year for people making damage claims and will raise or lower the size of the pot depending on the state of the roads and how much they're allocating to the road maintenance that year.
It must work out a lot cheaper to pay out claims on the small number of people who bother to claim than it does to spend hundreds of thousands (if not millions) on maintaining the roads. I guess that will depend heavily on your local council and how they've allocated their budget, however.
mcbeee said:
That's been the interesting thing about this snow - it seems to be the dry stuff, very nice crisp powdery snow which (would be ideal for snowboarding on) is staying for a while and becoming compacted. I've never seen snow like it in the UK before.
Tommorrow (after a week of hibernation) I'm going to dig the Z4 out again. I'm missing my bum warmers and I'm missing my comfy seats and 10 speaker audio. The trudge to work has lost it's novelty appeal now!
Siftah said:Redzedfour said:
It'll come out of a different budget pot and so it's likely you'll be able to make a claim. I've been told in the past that the councils put aside a pot each year for people making damage claims and will raise or lower the size of the pot depending on the state of the roads and how much they're allocating to the road maintenance that year.
It must work out a lot cheaper to pay out claims on the small number of people who bother to claim than it does to spend hundreds of thousands (if not millions) on maintaining the roads. I guess that will depend heavily on your local council and how they've allocated their budget, however.
The figures I heard middle last year stated that the Government spent more on compensation than on repairing potholes (something like £52M on compensation, £48M on pothole repair).
We subsidise the road costs by about 10x what is spent back on road transport infrastructure.
That said, I'm sure certain collection systems are inefficient. Ie, Road Fund License is expensive to operate, and brings in very little. I bet it costs £50 per car to admin the tax for it!
I don't think we should pay more, or have good roads for what we pay, I just think we have a government that see's transport by road as a 'bad' thing, so they can then charge taxes on it easily and stealthily.
If they flat rated income and profit, when their tax take went up it would be very clear by viewing one single figure. It would also be HUGELY more efficient to collect tax that way, and offer less avoidance or evasion of taxes.
Hey ho... while people don't care about who they elect to represent them, then they will carry on getting away with their cretinous policies and taxes.
Dave
That said, I'm sure certain collection systems are inefficient. Ie, Road Fund License is expensive to operate, and brings in very little. I bet it costs £50 per car to admin the tax for it!
I don't think we should pay more, or have good roads for what we pay, I just think we have a government that see's transport by road as a 'bad' thing, so they can then charge taxes on it easily and stealthily.
If they flat rated income and profit, when their tax take went up it would be very clear by viewing one single figure. It would also be HUGELY more efficient to collect tax that way, and offer less avoidance or evasion of taxes.
Hey ho... while people don't care about who they elect to represent them, then they will carry on getting away with their cretinous policies and taxes.
Dave
We subsidise the road costs by about 10x what is spent back on road transport infrastructure.
That said, I'm sure certain collection systems are inefficient. Ie, Road Fund License is expensive to operate, and brings in very little. I bet it costs £50 per car to admin the tax for it!
I don't think we should pay more, or have good roads for what we pay, I just think we have a government that see's transport by road as a 'bad' thing, so they can then charge taxes on it easily and stealthily.
If they flat rated income and profit, when their tax take went up it would be very clear by viewing one single figure. It would also be HUGELY more efficient to collect tax that way, and offer less avoidance or evasion of taxes.
Hey ho... while people don't care about who they elect to represent them, then they will carry on getting away with their cretinous policies and taxes.
Dave
That said, I'm sure certain collection systems are inefficient. Ie, Road Fund License is expensive to operate, and brings in very little. I bet it costs £50 per car to admin the tax for it!
I don't think we should pay more, or have good roads for what we pay, I just think we have a government that see's transport by road as a 'bad' thing, so they can then charge taxes on it easily and stealthily.
If they flat rated income and profit, when their tax take went up it would be very clear by viewing one single figure. It would also be HUGELY more efficient to collect tax that way, and offer less avoidance or evasion of taxes.
Hey ho... while people don't care about who they elect to represent them, then they will carry on getting away with their cretinous policies and taxes.
Dave
We subsidise the road costs by about 10x what is spent back on road transport infrastructure.
That said, I'm sure certain collection systems are inefficient. Ie, Road Fund License is expensive to operate, and brings in very little. I bet it costs £50 per car to admin the tax for it!
I don't think we should pay more, or have good roads for what we pay, I just think we have a government that see's transport by road as a 'bad' thing, so they can then charge taxes on it easily and stealthily.
If they flat rated income and profit, when their tax take went up it would be very clear by viewing one single figure. It would also be HUGELY more efficient to collect tax that way, and offer less avoidance or evasion of taxes.
Hey ho... while people don't care about who they elect to represent them, then they will carry on getting away with their cretinous policies and taxes.
Dave
That said, I'm sure certain collection systems are inefficient. Ie, Road Fund License is expensive to operate, and brings in very little. I bet it costs £50 per car to admin the tax for it!
I don't think we should pay more, or have good roads for what we pay, I just think we have a government that see's transport by road as a 'bad' thing, so they can then charge taxes on it easily and stealthily.
If they flat rated income and profit, when their tax take went up it would be very clear by viewing one single figure. It would also be HUGELY more efficient to collect tax that way, and offer less avoidance or evasion of taxes.
Hey ho... while people don't care about who they elect to represent them, then they will carry on getting away with their cretinous policies and taxes.
Dave
PawnSacrifice said:
Cheers for the answer - my Dad's Passat won't start and it seems like this is the cause. Anyone know what can be done if this happens? When the weather warms will the fuel just return to normal consistancy and the filter become unblocked?
Used the great tip from here about getting more weight over the rear wheels - took an old alloy and someone sitting in the boot to get out the drive
Soft top: - does anyone have guidance / experience about how to deal with the snow that turned/turning to ice on the Z4 roof? I didn't want to damage the cloth by clearing the snow. However, the snow is turning to ice: will the water repellant properties be affected? Roof life? My car is in the drive, so is exposed to elements. Have not been driving it, so there is now a layer of hard snow (turning to ice) on the roof.
daveg said:
Oakandacorns - have a look for roof care / treatments on here... most of us use AG. GAZA62 has tried a few others - when it comes to detailing he knows what he's talking about! As do others, but his posts spring to mind.