Your specialist subject: The life and times of the BMW CIC unit in E89s

[B21]

The CIC unit..part of the iDrive system is the brains of the system whose trademark folding screen presesnts the data..the screen is just a screen, all the smarts happen in the big box, out of sight, the 'radio' you can see is the top part of the unit, like an iceberg most of it is hidden.

In E89s its the optiion 609A Navigation System Professional.

Inside the box there is an AM/FM tuner, optionally a DAB tuner, various interfaces to the rest of the car, the PDC system and the various audio related pre-amp for either the 676 Hi-FI off board amp or the 677 Top-Fi DSP/amp..both of which are in the boot.

The CIC communicates with the 676 amp via normal analogue wires, the 677 it speaks to it on a fibre optic ring called MOST.

Both versions have MOST o talk to the MULF /ULF /combox and things like an external CD if it had one.

The box with different face plates was fitted to most BMWs between 2008 ish and 2016 ish..

There's a hard drive in there which stores the maps, the Gracenote music database and optionally some music you choose to store on it.

I've written this note as my unit started to die..first of all, very occasionally, it would, after a damp / cold night outside, shut down 5 minutes or so after starting the car, then go into a cycle of rebooting after 5-10 minutes, run for 90 seconds, then shutdown,,,then repeat until after about an hour or so it would just run.

I had various pet theories about it..damp causing issues with fibre optic cables, laterly failing hard disc.

I cloned the hard disc onto a solid state drive and thought I had cured it...sadly a few days ago during my winter upgrade program the system started doing this process of rebooting endlessly..with no constant running..for the few seonds it was running the maps were much faster due to the SSD.

So I looked at options...

A new unit is £3,700..a BMW supplied exchange unit was around £1,800 ish plus a £2k deposit.

I looked at other options.

I decided to get a 2015 20i E89 write off one..plugged it in..good news..AM/FM/DAB/USB support all worked ..bad news no NAV and no sound..

In some ways not surprsing as it came from a 676 optioncar..you could see that in the tone controls as there was no entry for the equaliser.

The unit needs to be coded..BMW charge an extortionate fee..looked at Indys..selected a Polish guy to do it remotely.

For whatever reason, and we spent some time, he couldn't access the unit via ISTA/P..

Compunding this is the ID4 Motion digital cluster which doesn't play well and the Match 10 DSP amp with lots of MOST stuff..heh ho..

So now resigned to send both units off..one to be repaired, the other to be coded to the car.

Romamia or Poland are my options..

 

[buzyg]

A somber tail. Hope you can get it done without breaking the bank.

Been said many times. The electronics in modern cars is designed for Oem control and profits. Most of it is useless wallpaper wrt value/function Small indies can't hope to keep up with the corporate tech. Not a lot us mortals can do but pay. Needs the law to be changed to stop it. IMHO

 

[B21]

The failure rate on these is nowhere as bad as many N54 engine / DCT gearbox / E89 roof issues but they do occur..

The cost to repair was breath taking..

Unfortunately it’s deeply integrated into the car ..so it’s difficult to ignore ..

 

[RobbiZ4]

Are you sure it is the CIC unit that is failing?

Years ago I/we started replacing the HDD's with SDD's. Many, many of the SSD and IDE adapter combinations failed right at startup or randomly later after the first few successful boots.

Only 2 or 3 stable combinations were found:

Welches Dateisystem hat die interne Festplatte?

200 € aufwärts. Die billigen Transcend sind alle gebraucht aus Fernost. Danke nein. Ich hatte mir eine Original Toshiba HDD besorgt, angeblich neu. Beim ersten Auslesen alles ok, dann das Image draufgespielt. Dann hatte die Platte plötzlich über 13.000 Betriebsstunden. Die Platte liegt trotzdem...

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The complete thread:

Welches Dateisystem hat die interne Festplatte?

Moin, kann mir jemand sagen welches Dateisystem die interne Festplatte hat? Hinterund ist dass ich mehr Speicherplatz für meine Musik benötige. Das Spiegeln auf eine größere Platte hat schon geklappt, jedoch kann ich nicht die Musikpartition mit dem nicht zugewiesenen Speicherplatz erweitern...

www-zroadster-com.translate.goog

 

[B21]

Are you sure it is the CIC unit that is failing?

Years ago I/we started replacing the HDD's with SDD's. Many, many of the SDD and IDE adapter combinations failed right at startup or randomly later after the first few successful boots.

Only 2 or 3 stable combinations were found:

Welches Dateisystem hat die interne Festplatte?

Moin, kann mir jemand sagen welches Dateisystem die interne Festplatte hat? Hinterund ist dass ich mehr Speicherplatz für meine Musik benötige. Das Spiegeln auf eine größere Platte hat schon geklappt, jedoch kann ich nicht die Musikpartition mit dem nicht zugewiesenen Speicherplatz erweitern...

www-zroadster-com.translate.goog

It's better to read backwards from the end as it's a long story

Yup I'm sure..the failures started over a year ago when the unit was stock..the SSD was only fitted a few weeks ago while the car was down for work..what I did see (after I removed one isolating jumper on the SSD :headbang: :headbang: :headbang: )..was that map work was much faster (for the 90 sesonds the unit would stay up for)..

So for sure the SSD works and works well..but the fault in the CIC unit in this case is not HDD/SSd related..sadly.

Seems like a very common problem across CCC and CICs..liike most thinsg there are different causal factors..HDD was stated,,but in this case not for me..I'll ask the tech guy when he gets it for an update..

 

[Deepseaskateboard]

There is a guy in Wakefield who can code these to the car. I think he charges about £150 ish. Ask AnubisZed!

He has something on ebay I think.

 

[RobbiZ4]

Seems like a very common problem across CCC and CICs.

Interesting, as I didn't see any similiar descriptions in the ZRoadster.com forum the last 7 years.

Btw, since every SSD requires an additional IDE controller, the speed cannot increase too much compared to the original hard drive.

 

[B21]

Seems like a very common problem across CCC and CICs.

Interesting, as I didn't see any similiar descriptions in the ZRoadster.com forum the last 7 years.

Btw, as any SSD requires an addition IDE interface controller, the speed can't rise up too much coimpared to the initial HDD.

If you Goggle CIC units rebooting you'll find a sad community of those..

Any data chain is only as fast as the slowest link..but the SDD does improve searach and pan over the HDD..until I get the CIC unit and give it a try who knows..but for the 90 seconds I did try it, it seemed much crisper on those actions..

 

[B21]

There is a guy in Wakefield who can code these to the car. I think he charges about £150 ish. Ask AnubisZed!

He has something on ebay I think.

Yes quite a few people do remote programing which since I'm now in a rush to get the car on the road for the 'season' :driving: :driving: :driving: was my desire..but as you saw we had issues with remote access..then I might as well get the old unit fixed..which narrows down the list..so I'll get both done at the same time..thats then another redundant piece of h/w I won't use again! :tumbleweed:

 

[RobbiZ4]

If you Goggle CIC units rebooting you'll find a sad community of those..

Maybe.
But as the E89s tend to be used less frequently in most cases, the failures don't seem to be quite so common in our vehicles.
I really didn't see any similiar case in our forum. Good luck to find a cheaper solution as a new box.

 

[RobbiZ4]

...another redundant piece of h/w I won't use again! :tumbleweed:

Well, like my DVB-T TV receiver in the E89.

 

[B21]

If you Goggle CIC units rebooting you'll find a sad community of those..

Maybe.
But as the E89s tend to be used less frequently in most cases, the failures don't seem to be quite so common in our vehicles.
I really didn't see any similiar case in our forum. Good luck to find a cheaper solution as a new box.

For sure its nowhere as common on E89s..unlike roofs, and on N54 versions, adaptive dampers, injectors, turbos, wastegates, coils, HPFPs, DCTs :tumbleweed:

 

[AnubisZed]

The other quite common issue with these CIC units (E89 E81 E87 E88 E90 E91 E92 E70 E71, all basically the same internals) is the loss of satellite signal, thus your screen ends up showing you somewhere in the North Sea etc. Upon checking (in the Service Menu) you'll find that you can still see something like 14 satillites but no GPS fix. This is a common fault across various models, you cna try different antennas but it wont change, it's the receiver on the PCB within the unit. Alas not a cheap fix...... shame really as this has happened to mine :headbang:

 

[B21]

The other quite common issue with these CIC units (E89 E81 E87 E88 E90 E91 E92 E70 E71, all basically the same internals) is the loss of satellite signal, thus your screen ends up showing you somewhere in the North Sea etc. Upon checking (in the Service Menu) you'll find that you can still see something like 14 satillites but no GPS fix. This is a common fault across various models, you cna try different antennas but it wont change, it's the receiver on the PCB within the unit. Alas not a cheap fix...... shame really as this has happened to mine :headbang:

Fortunately mine wasn't afflicted by that..slight diversion related to that..the Mini was tuned by the guys in Sunderland..their rolling road poinst to the sea..after the tune the Mini was well into the Norh Sea..I guess the dead reckoning part was working...

I'm hoping my London chappie comes good..he does FRMs MULFs etc too!

 

[john-e89]

Can you not get a 2nd hand 677 unit…?

 

[B21]

Can you not get a 2nd hand 677 unit…?

Not many 677s were ever fitted to E89s..so you need a written off E89 with a 677..most breakers in my recent bitter experience haven't a clue about the car and its sub systems..it also has to be DAB'd which I guess most 677 are..and even then cause the VIN is encoded i 4 places on the CIC that still needs to be coded to your VIN to allow maps to be used..so the simple answer is no!

 

[john-e89]

Can you not get a 2nd hand 677 unit…?

Not many 677s were ever fitted to E89s..so you need a written off E89 with a 677..most breakers in my recent bitter experience haven't a clue about the car and its sub systems..it also has to be DAB'd which I guess most 677 are..and even then cause the VIN is encoded i 4 places on the CIC that still needs to be coded to your VIN to allow maps to be used..so the simple answer is no!

Yep that’ll be why then…. :roll:

Purely out of curiosity, I’d be thinking of ripping the lot out and putting a stand-alone system in as the car is obvs a keeper. By pass all the issues, keep the new Idrive screen in, link up stand alone sat nav, etc, PDC anre retro fitted so not an issue, any reason you can’t do that..? I know you’re not going to but in theory..?

 

[B21]

If you accept a loss of automation then you can strip out / change quite a lot..

I never realised how complex these data buses are on the E89s..

It’s part legacy and part new technologies…with at least 4 different networks cross wired its complex..

But sure you can put a stand alone nav and audio system..

Of course then voice guidance, PDC etc has to be figured out / ignored …

With an auto again have to be careful with interfering with certain sensors etc ..

But yes it can be done ….

 

[AnubisZed]

Can you not get a 2nd hand 677 unit…?

Not many 677s were ever fitted to E89s..so you need a written off E89 with a 677..most breakers in my recent bitter experience haven't a clue about the car and its sub systems..it also has to be DAB'd which I guess most 677 are..and even then cause the VIN is encoded i 4 places on the CIC that still needs to be coded to your VIN to allow maps to be used..so the simple answer is no!

?? What? :?

609 - CIC
676 - Business sound system, speaker output to amplifier.
677 - Professional sound system with MOST fibre optic sound output.

The headunits are all the same. To change the system from 676 to 677 you simply remove 676 from the VO, and code the car accordingly. You then code 677 to the VO and code accordingly. Once this new code is then written to the CIC unit it then knows not to amplify the sound and, in so doing so, not to output via the wires but to instead to feed out via the fibre optic. It's a standard coding process that takes no more than about 10 minutes at most.
So, in short, it makes no difference where the headunit came from, as long as it has DAB, it'll code just the same.

 

[B21]

Can you not get a 2nd hand 677 unit…?

Not many 677s were ever fitted to E89s..so you need a written off E89 with a 677..most breakers in my recent bitter experience haven't a clue about the car and its sub systems..it also has to be DAB'd which I guess most 677 are..and even then cause the VIN is encoded i 4 places on the CIC that still needs to be coded to your VIN to allow maps to be used..so the simple answer is no!

?? What? :?

609 - CIC
676 - Business sound system, speaker output to amplifier.
677 - Professional sound system with MOST fibre optic sound output.

The headunits are all the same. To change the system from 676 to 677 you simply remove 676 from the VO, and code the car accordingly. You then code 677 to the VO and code accordingly. Once this new code is then written to the CIC unit it then knows not to amplify the sound and, in so doing so, not to output via the wires but to instead to feed out via the fibre optic. It's a standard coding process that takes no more than about 10 minutes at most.
So, in short, it makes no difference where the headunit came from, as long as it has DAB, it'll code just the same.

That’s the theory…did exactly that..when I tried to do so this weekend it said it had done it..but no audio..no cigar..

Maybe the Mr 12 Volt MMI or ID4Motion got in the way…even if had it still wouldn’t sat nav..we covered that earlier..