Why is the coupe rated so highly ?

[srhutch]

The Coupe shell has about twice the rigidity of the Roadster, so it probably drives quite a lot better if you like to go fast - which I do. I've only ever test-driven an E85, and it was before I got my Coupe, so I can't really comment there though. The Coupe is also likely to be safer if you flip it - again giving it more value as a high performance / track car.

Most people couldn't tell the difference. It maybe twice as rigid, but the E85 isn't exactly a jelly. Don't forget it was built as a roadster in the first place and stiffer than a E46 M3, and folk don't seem to moan about that.

BMW E36 Z3 5,600

BMW E46 Convertible 10,500
BMW E46 Coupe (w/folding seats) 12,500
BMW E46 Sedan (w/folding seats) 13,000
BMW E46 Sedan (w/o folding seats) 18,000
BMW E46 Wagon (w/folding seats) 14,000

BMW E85 Z4 16,000
BMW E85 Z4 Coupe 32,000
BMW E85 Z4 M 16,000
BMW E85 Z4 M Coupe 32,000

http://youwheel.com/home/2016/06/20/car-body-torsional-rigidity-a-comprehensive-list/

 

[GuidoK]

You could even argue about how important torsional rigidity is on the handling of a car.
Look at something like a mazda mx5. A cars famed for its handling while having a much more compliant monocoque than the z4 roadster.
If you want excellent handling on the z4, its not the stiffness of the monocoque you have to worry about. Better focus on shocks, swaybars, bushings etc. (and the obvious LSD of course). Sadly there are hardly solutions to really tackle the suspension arms and other cast iron parts.
Because from the underside the z4 is basically just another e46.

 

[Mr Tidy]

One less thing to go wrong?

Roadster owners don’t need to worry about rusty tailgates

No, just drowned roof motors and scabby hoods.

 

[Steve84N]

Anyone who is serious about their MX5 strengthens the chassis, there's various ways but rails down the side is the most common. It makes a difference.

If you can't tell the difference between twice the stiffness when driving both Z4 versions then more fool you but the good thing is the roadster is 'stiff enough' to not be bad.

Personally I think roadsters only look good with the top down and windows open on the coupe delivered sufficient open air thrills for me. Both versions have good arses but the rear 3/4 of the coupe takes the win.

 

[GuidoK]

A z4 roadster is according to the numbers apparently also twice as stiff as an s2000, another car famed for its handling.
Another pointer that stiffness isnt all. The weakness of the z4 is in its suspension/undercarriage, not the body rigidity.
Stiffer anti rollbars, and a decent set of coilovers with linear springs transform the car. Especially on tight corners.

The coupe looks the part. Until the sun starts to shine of course. When the tops go down everyone wants to be in a roadster.
You buy a coupe for the looks. You buy a roadster to enjoy the sun.

 

[Steve84N]

The S2000 is famed for handling badly...

I don't think it's down to the chassis though, more the other components and how they were setup like you suggest.

However, the fact remains that a stiffer chassis is more desirable as a base to work from hence why manufacturers often increase it for their top performance models in a line.

 

[BMWZ4MC]

The S2000 is famed for handling badly...

I don't think it's down to the chassis though, more the other components and how they were setup like you suggest.

However, the fact remains that a stiffer chassis is more desirable as a base to work from hence why manufacturers often increase it for their top performance models in a line.

The S2000 suspension set up went through numerous iterations over its lifetime. The early versions were very snappy and had no driver’s aids beyond ABS. A combination of this, incompetent driving and a kick from the VTEC led to a reputation for difficult handling.
My 2003 S2000 (with standard suspension set up) handled like it was on rails. There was no understeer and the Torsen LSD was far more progressive at the limit than the LSD in my ///M. Deliberately kicking out the back end and controlling the consequent slide was a joy.
The only negative point I would make about the suspension is that mine was very crash on bad roads, comparable with my Zed on KW Clubsports.

 

[Rusky]

I loved the look of my e86 and agree that it is a car that will command a second glance for a long time to come. Having said that my e85 looks stunning with the roof down and with the hard top on looks like a different beast altogether.

 

[GuidoK]

The S2000 is famed for handling badly...

Not among track junkies and people who know how a car should handle.
It has a very refined suspension setup, it makes the z4 suspension setup (especially the rear) look like it comes of a tractor.
The z4 really benefits from a coilover setup with linear spings and stiffer anti rollbars (and rtab limiters) to keep the dynamics between body and suspension under control. And of course the missing lsd, something an s2000 has factory installed (and that goes for most of the mx5 versions too).
The z4 is basically an e46 where an s2000 (and mx5 too) are bespoke cars designed as sportscars. And it shows in the engineering.
A z4 has massive cast iron trailing arms. Have you ever weighed them? You'll get a hart attack if you see how much less unsprung mass an s2000 or mx5 has. The suspension arms, hubs, frames, diff housings etc on an s2000 or mx5 look like how for example lotus designs their cars, and is nothing like the sturdy and heavy bmw design which is (as far as the back axle goes) also specifically designed to understeer (for instance the design of the rtab's). Nice if you want to have a daily, but not what you want to have on a track. If you drive your car on the edge you can feel such differences.

 

[Mr Tidy]

If you ever get to drive an E type you'll be massively disappointed...it's a terrible car, with terrible build quality and no real memorable driving thrills. Some old cars are lovely to drive, but the e type definitely isn't one of them...!

Luckily I don't think I'll ever get the opportunity - they say you should never meet your heroes!

 

[NickDE]

The coupe is just drop dead gorgeous, especially from the back. And has all the N52 3 litre entertainment. When the weather is an issue for a coupe, then my E30 convertible comes out to outcool the E85's...

 

[MrPT]

A z4 has massive cast iron trailing arms. Have you ever weighed them?

They’re ballast. If the M didn’t have them it would just plough into the ground.

 

[Steve84N]

The S2000 is famed for handling badly...

Not among track junkies and people who know how a car should handle.
It has a very refined suspension setup, it makes the z4 suspension setup (especially the rear) look like it comes of a tractor.
The z4 really benefits from a coilover setup with linear spings and stiffer anti rollbars (and rtab limiters) to keep the dynamics between body and suspension under control. And of course the missing lsd, something an s2000 has factory installed (and that goes for most of the mx5 versions too).
The z4 is basically an e46 where an s2000 (and mx5 too) are bespoke cars designed as sportscars. And it shows in the engineering.
A z4 has massive cast iron trailing arms. Have you ever weighed them? You'll get a hart attack if you see how much less unsprung mass an s2000 or mx5 has. The suspension arms, hubs, frames, diff housings etc on an s2000 or mx5 look like how for example lotus designs their cars, and is nothing like the sturdy and heavy bmw design which is (as far as the back axle goes) also specifically designed to understeer (for instance the design of the rtab's). Nice if you want to have a daily, but not what you want to have on a track. If you drive your car on the edge you can feel such differences.

OK, so I'm curious why you chose the Z4 instead of the S2000?

 

[Mr Tidy]

The coupe is just drop dead gorgeous, especially from the back. And has all the N52 3 litre entertainment. When the weather is an issue for a coupe, then my E30 convertible comes out to outcool the E85's...

The weather has never been an issue for my E86 - isn't that what climate control is for? :lol:

 

[GuidoK]

OK, so I'm curious why you chose the Z4 instead of the S2000?

Because the z4 has a very nice torquey inline 6 which is very well tuneable and very very reliable
Because the z4 has a very nice interior with lots of leather (I have extended leather)(obviously you can have the s2000 also with leather seats, but there is a quality difference imho especially if you have extended leather (I have new england) with M seats)
Because the z4 has a good build in navi for that time (I have navi prof)
Because the z4 has a very good stereo setup compared to the s2000 (I have Hifi prof)
Because the z4 has a very spacious boot for this type of car
Because the z4 has a fully automatic electric roof (I have the xcarstyle roof module that allows open/close til 40mph and with keyfob)
To name a few
I also think the roof itself from the s2000 is inferior. I think thinner/less insulated, they still have a loose/seperate tarpaulin (is that the right word?) etc. However the roof itself looks better on the s2000 when its up (the shape that is), but you cant see that from the inside :wink: )
Its quality/construction wise more on par with the z3 roof (except for the glass rear window)

But I didnt buy it for its excellent handling. Its ok and far better than 'normal' cars, but not excellent. Imho the suspension is tuned to safe, predictable, reliable, but not necessarily fast and precise.

Despite my car has a lot of tuning, its not a pure track car. I use my car also to go on holidays into the alps for some sporty mountain pass driving.
So having some comfort and practicability is nice (those things I mentioned make it a more complete car)
For that its also nice to have a lot of torque down low, something the s2000 foremost misses.
The z4 a car that's still quite a nice/luxurious place to be in (way beoynd an s2000), practical as far as roadsters go (for instance the bootspace is about twice as big as the s2000's), good strong engine and not too heavy.
But most of my mods have been to the suspension/undercarriage. I think thats the part of the car thats mostly lagging behind its competitors s2000 and boxster (maybe if I bought an s2000 the type of mods I'd be doing would be different)

And the BMW diy scene is very big. All parts diagrams, electric diagrams, official workshop manuals, official workshop software etc is easily available. I dont know how that is with honda but with bmw its one of the most comprehensive and availabe around imho.

 

[Steve84N]

All true.

It's a shame BMW don't venture much beyond the parts bin to make their sportier models but I guess they're mass market so they do what's most profitable.

I have to admit the test drive I had in an S2000 many years ago I was shocked how loud it was inside on the motorway.

 

[elevensies]

always had to be the coupe for me, and always will be, its the classic lines above all else, theses few cars on the road now that have this, in fact the new amg merc coupe thing is very very close
https://car-images.bauersecure.com/pagefiles/33047/mercamg-002.jpg

 

[R60BBA]

In terms of value for money it’s one of the best BMW’s out there imo.

 

[tomscott]

Have to be honest never really been a great fan of the look of the roadster but I do like them. I think the reason is that the coupe exsists and is just such a gorgeous looking car. When I was looking I didnt consider the roady at all. The coupe has all the right curves in all the right places. Nothing on the road in general motoring comes close.

There are some odd little quirks to the roady that were improved in the coupe too, sound deadening for one the roadys doors feel like paper compared (not sure if BMW improved this later on the facelift). The key hole on the boot is also a strange one. The rear of the coupe looks so much better and the continuation of the lines works so well on the coupe. The lines from the bonnet roof and then down to the CF spoiler if the car has it, same with the lines that go up and over the rear fenders. The roadster doesnt have the same look because it has no roof and boot line to meet it. It may have been designed as a Roadster but the coupe seems a more complete design in my eyes.

BMW Z4M Coupe with CSL wheels by Tom Scott, on Flickr

Z4-forum Cumbria National Meet 2013 49 by Tom Scott, on Flickr

In terms of the drive, the roadster wins in quite a few areas, first the aural experience. The coupe is so muted the exhaust and induction noise is really tame whereas in the roadster you get all the noise and the S54 is actually a really good sounding engine. The coupe owners only get to hear this if they are outside and heard someone else driving it past.

When I was photographing mine back in the day I had my dad driving it and I was hanging out the back of a mini photographing it. It sounded so good and was surprised at how loud the induction was. Suppose you would only hear it in that situation.

BMW Z4M Coupe, Silver Grey, CSL wheels by Tom Scott, on Flickr

So really its a mixed bag. I think the main thing to take away is that this was a low volume car and bmw actually gave us the option.

Modern cars are becoming so boring and the samey and everyone seems to cling to the best these days so the road is full of mundane cars because thats what sells. The days of cars like the Z4M is over.

TBH I would happily have either, its getting to the point now where the positives of the coupe are outweighed because of its price VS the roadster the Coupe is certainly not worth 25-50% more than a roady at this point unless your looking at it as an investment opportunity or just really really want one, when it was 5-10% that was worth it. Plus ive had a coupe and wouldn't mind the open top experience theres something thrilling about it. In the short time I owned a boxster S I loved the top down experience somehow you feel more connected to what your doing instead of being cocooned.

The good thing is that neither are overly expensive. I just wonder when the point will be when it becomes worth it for a lot of people apart from a select few.

Look at Mecedes 190sl used to be able to pick them up for like 25k now they are selling for over 200k. Same with 964s 993s bound to happen to the coupe. Good under 100k Z3M S54s are up to 60k. More than they were new.

Its inevitable, time to buy one is now they will be at 30k before you know it. Doug de Muro has already predicted Good E39 M5s E46 M3 CS etc will double in price in the next 5 years. 40-60k for them.

 

[TomK]

In terms of the drive, the roadster wins in quite a few areas, first the oral experience.

I didn't know roadster owners were fond of eating their car?
Strange bunch