Upgrading Z4 E89s with the 677 Hi-Fi/DSP option

[B21]

E89s were fitted with 3 different audio systems.

The basic stereo system driving 4 mid range speakers and 2 woofers

The 676 Hi-Fi system with a separate amp connected via conventional analog copper cables to the head unit, driving 11 speakers through a 7 channel amp with 5 mid range speakers , 2 tweeters, 2 woofers and 2 sub woofers

The 677 Top-Fi/DSP system with a separate amp connected via a digitally encoded optical link driving 14 speakers through 8 channels, with 6 mid range speakers, 4 tweeters, 2 woofers and 2 sub woofers.



I previously updated my 20i MSport that had the 676 system using the Audiotec Fischer Match 7 amp/DSP with Eton mid range / tweeters, Audison sub woofers driven by an Alpine Class D amp and 2 Rockford Fosgate woofers.

When I bought my 35is it was pretty ‘fully loaded’ with the 677 Top-Fi system amongst many expensive add ons.

Like many things on the 35is it might have been great in its day but the audio system when fed with the same high quality digital feeds was very disappointing compared to the outgoing Match 7 system I had lovingly created in the 20i MSport.

https://www.audiotec-fischer.de/en/match/amplifiers/up-7bmw

As a temporary measure I swapped the mid range units out for the Eton BMW OE upgrades. This brought an immediate improvement.

Next was my plan to move the Match 7 system from my 20i to the 35is.

Unfortunately it turns out that it’s effectively a no no on several counts,

The wiring harness is completely different as are the connectors.

The biggest issue is the the 677 head unit outputs it’s audio feed to the main amp via a fibre optic link called MOST.

This link uses a proprietary protocol rendering it uncommunicative with ‘normal’ systems.

End of a great idea…

Then I noticed that Audiotec Fischer has in the intervening time has created a box (Helix) that inputs the MOST link and outputs a TOSLINK which is an industry standard interface often found in higher end audio domestic audio systems.

https://www.audiotec-fischer.de/en/helix/accessories/sdmi25

So it looked like I could use this box of tricks as a bridge.

However the cone and harness were going to require major butchering.

So in the end I rolled over and bought another new product from these guys, the Match 10 DSP which is effectively a bigger brother to the Match 7 with 10 physical channels plus 1 output fir driving another amp versus 7 physical channels plus q output for another amp.

https://www.audiotec-fischer.de/en/match/amplifiers/up-10dsp

There were a myriad of other upgrades and features in the DSP domain…if you are interested best to read the blurb, if your definition of good audio is nice clear sound coming from a few speakers then it’s probably not for you.

It’s going to take probably a week for me to fit the new system, fortunately I’ve found a barn nearby which after Christmas I can use to swap out the rest of the system from the 20i and revert it largely to original spec and then take the subwoofers across to the 35is and then sell the Match 7 whilst fitting all the existing and fresh parts to the 35is.

 

[B21]

Folks often ask if the speaker specs change from each audio system..

Here for reference is a 676 mid range speaker, a 677 mid range speaker and an Eton B100Xn mid range with co-axial tweeter as comparisons..if size of magnet was an issue then the Eton wins..

 

[mcbutler]

I hardly ever use the audio on my 35, the engine sounds way too good to mask....
Whats the total cost of all this chum?

 

[B21]

U*

I hardly ever use the audio on my 35, the engine sounds way too good to mask....
Whats the total cost of all this chum?

Different strokes / different folks…

Never been a great lover of what I would call average exhaust notes..needs to be an AMG on full chat or a V10 working hard or maybe an in-line 4 winding up past 12,000..

The 35is exhaust can be quite droning at times …will have to see (today) how the de-cat affects the tone..

Back to this audio project..

I carry a jukebox of 5,000 albums around 6,700 tracks all encoded in high quality formats..

I play music (when I’m on my own) constantly..

I reckon it’s going to be around £2k ish plus my time and effort by the time it’s done..

 

[mcbutler]

U*

I hardly ever use the audio on my 35, the engine sounds way too good to mask....
Whats the total cost of all this chum?

Different strokes / different folks…

Never been a great lover of what I would call average exhaust notes..needs to be an AMG on full chat or a V10 working hard or maybe an in-line 4 winding up past 12,000..

The 35is exhaust can be quite droning at times …will have to see (today) how the de-cat affects the tone..

Back to this audio project..

I carry a jukebox of 5,000 albums around 6,700 tracks all encoded in high quality formats..

I play music (when I’m on my own) constantly..

I reckon it’s going to be around £2k ish plus my time and effort by the time it’s done..

Fair comment - never been a music buff, i tend to hear one song that i really like that can be from absolutely any genre (excepting the really terrible RAP/Grime etc) and listen to it over and over again. My 19yr old daughters the same, except she sings it at the same time, full volume. Getting a bit weary of "THIS GIRL IS ON FIRE" LOL.
£2k is cheaper than i thought, be good to see a simplified list of your components - supplier - price etc when you are done

 

[SSF]

I would be curious how much weight the sound system adds to the car. I have the 28i version, which I chose in part because of lower weight and better weight distribution. Now I suppose the distribution might have something to gain from all the components of the audio system (that can be placed in different places to optimize it), but the overall added weight can't really improve the car's driving. Any idea how much each version (basic, 676 and 677) weighs?

 

[Ed.Straker]

I would be curious how much weight the sound system adds to the car. I have the 28i version, which I chose in part because of lower weight and better weight distribution. Now I suppose the distribution might have something to gain from all the components of the audio system (that can be placed in different places to optimize it), but the overall added weight can't really improve the car's driving. Any idea how much each version (basic, 676 and 677) weighs?

SSF, not sure if this is a genuine question, laudable as mass reduction and weight optimisation is?

With a 1,500 kg empty weight, if you do the maths, changing a few speakers and amplifier parts will, at worst, add say 5 kgs.

Given the speaker and amplifier locations stay the same the change to balance will be negligible?

I would suggest for the average first world person losing some weight would have a much greater effect and be of great benefit to all.

 

[mr.tourette]

I would be curious how much weight the sound system adds to the car. I have the 28i version, which I chose in part because of lower weight and better weight distribution. Now I suppose the distribution might have something to gain from all the components of the audio system (that can be placed in different places to optimize it), but the overall added weight can't really improve the car's driving. Any idea how much each version (basic, 676 and 677) weighs?

SSF, not sure if this is a genuine question, laudable as mass reduction and weight optimisation is?

With a 1,500 kg empty weight, if you do the maths, changing a few speakers and amplifier parts will, at worst, add say 5 kgs.

Given the speaker and amplifier locations stay the same the change to balance will be negligible?

I would suggest for the average first world person losing some weight would have a much greater effect and be of great benefit to all.

probably a bit more given the 4 4 inch speakers add about a kilo each alone and 1.5 on the footwells each which i noted from my 6 speaker conversion..probably more like around 15-20 kilos all told with Pete's conversion..still not a great deal though in the grand scheme of things and not something thats going to have any real world effect on handling

 

[Marcoose]

Ya’ll caint bee seerius.

The bazillion-watt speakers will project low frequency waves about two car lengths in front of the car. That will cancel the supersonic boom created by the Frankensteined 999-1/2 BHP yellow mellow machine, which in turn will open a riff in the time space continuum, throwing the car into the next county. That and the hole in OP’s wallet offset any weight gain.

Do I really need to explain everything here?

 

[SSF]

I meant how much weight the whole audio systems add, not the upgrade (the upgrade is clearly negligible, of course). The 14 speakers + the amp, the wiring, etc - I was wondering how much that weighs and how it compares to the very basic version. Consider it just my curiosity, I was in no way criticizing your upgrade or desire for better sound; it's your car, you know better what you want from it.

I have driven "bare" cars, like the Alfa 4C, and, even though it is really light and fast, I do enjoy a comfortable care much more (outside of the track at least).

 

[B21]

So here is the weighing schedule

Mid range 676 speaker 166g, 677 mid range 206g, Eton mid range 421g

Woofer 676 speaker 811g, Rockford Fosgate Woofer 2350g

676 Amp 848g 677 class Audiotec Fischer 10 DSP with cables, boxes and adapters 2239g

676 class subwoofer approx 800g , Audison subwoofer 1,219 g

So a 6 speaker basic system would weigh around 4* 150g + 2* 800g = 2.2kg use that as ref centre of gravity

676 system would weigh 5* 166g + 2*811 + 2*800 + 848 = 4.9 kg

677 system would weigh 6* 166g +2*1000 + 2 *1000 + 1000 = 6kg

B21 pangalatic gargle blaster 6*421 + 2*2350+ 2*1219 + 2239 = 11.9kg

So 10kg heavier than a 6 potter and 5 kg heavier than the outgoing system

( I ignored tweeters as de minimis)

Cabling is there in all versions so whether you use it or not its there..

So Commander Ed Straker was about correct..

COG will stay broadly the same, within rounding errors when the 1,500 kg mass is taken into account..

Didn't factor power drain at full volume..the new system is rated at around 1 KW RMS...

 

[SSF]

Weighing every component is a lot more than I expected! Thanks a lot for the effort and resulting info, it is indeed comparable with losing some weight (when you have any extra) and generally negligible.

 

[B21]

Weighing every component is a lot more than I expected! Thanks a lot for the effort and resulting info, it is indeed comparable with losing some weight (when you have any extra) and generally negligible.

I could lose enough weight to have 6 of these babies running in parallel!!

 

[SSF]

I could lose enough weight to have 6 of these babies running in parallel!!

With a little adjustment of direction and synchronization, you might not even need an engine with 6 of these

 

[B21]

Slowly working my way through the Pandora's Box of unintended consequences..

The issue with the 677 Top-Fi/HK/Logic 7 system is that the headunit talks to the amp via a digital link called MOST.

This link carries many different classes and types of data at the same time. It is not the same as an optical link (TOSLINK) such as found in home Hi-Fi

What needs to be extracted is the audio related data.

Enter the Audiotec Fischer SM125 MOST decoder..this baby sits on the MOST ring and sniffs for and decodes the audio signal and translates it into a 2 channel PCM aka CD type stereo signal which it sends via a TOSLINK to the DSP/amp.

Problem 1 is the headunit has 4 channels, front and rear left and right..the TOSLINK output is two stereo channels left and right.

Problem 2 is that its not clear what level of control the headunit will have on the DSP/amp via the MOST SMI25 bridge box. Will the tone controls work etc.

At this point I wish I hadn't started..but we soldier on. :thumbsdown:

Compared to the Match 7 DSP/amp which is a relativley easy fit for the 676 Hi-FI option, the new Match 10 DSP/amp has more DSP functions.

In the Match 7 I used a PC to do adjustments, clearly not something for on the hoof changes.

As such the old head unit would never control those anyway.

So Audiotec Fischer's solution is another (expensive) little box that is a UI/control that

Controls the overall volume
Changes basic tone control
Switches on/off various clever DSP tricks
Allows the subwoofers to be tweaked up and down independent of overall volume
Allows you to load different DSP/cabin profiles
etc etc etc

Laid out in the pictures is the baby SMI25 MOST box, the main 10 DSP/amp and the Director head unit for overall control.

Thanjfully AF provides a harness that hangs most of it together.

I jsut have to find power for the boxes, sort out the remote start, work out where to mount the boxes in the boot and the Director in the cabin and also handle the Z4 E89 specific issue of uniquely having both subwoofers AND woofers.

It does turn outon further research that there are other ways to crack this problem..although none are plug n play options.

You can buy MOST boxes that integrate decoding and control (so may address the head unit rear fader and other issues).

You can code the HU to behave like a 676 HU and then patch in your new wiring (maybe both sets are already there?) to a Match 7 type solution.

We carry on..the good news is that having the control unit in the car means that its easy to load different DSP profiles..so I can have the optimum ones for roof and windows down, roof and windows up and roof down, windows up!

 

[The.Analyst]

Would be interesting to see how easy it would be to switch the head unit to analogue outputs …the wiring harness must be audio specific at least in key places..if you could have switched the head unit then you could run the cables from the head to an analogue amp or your favourite DSP that would have been cheaper..but then a fair amount of connector butchery would be called for I suspect?

 

[Ed.Straker]

Ever thought about the ability to go back in time?

 

[B21]

Ever thought about the ability to go back in time?

Sadly Ed, the only way is forward..just got these babies in..

New uprated door speakers with very nice tweeters (didn't have the heart to strip them out of the old 20i)

New sub-woofers (2 ohm needed for new amp..old Alpine class D amp at 250 rms was driving 2 4 ohm in parallel, new amp has two 165w 2 ohm channels)

New woofers (OE ones are crap, and the 20i ones are expoxied in)

Enjoy..

 

[cwunch]

[ref]B21[/ref],
Hope everything is going well on your project.

Once, I have tested the 677 sound system of a 2010 model 35i, and very impressed with the power and acoustics of the original system. first, I would have tried to change the tweeters with some soft/silk ones, and then the mid drivers with a little more efficient and higher quality ones, thats it…


Unfortunately, Z4 that I bought came with the basic 6 speaker stereo (also, No sound over bluetooth)
16cm woofer? in the footwell, a 10cm mid-hi in the door and a speaker which sounds like a mushroom behind my left shoulder.

Could you please share your idea, about upgrading this system with the least amount of changes. I am not financially ready for a 16 unit system

If it is possible, I can even go with a 6 speaker stereo. Maybe a 3 way component? Or Bass/sub at footwells, mid-tweeter components in doors. (Rear speakers might even be cancelled, if we are not hearing rear pdc from them)

 

[B21]

There’s been a couple of people here who have upgraded their 6 speaker system,,,silver star and mr Tourette ..

So a summary is..

The 6 speaker system uses an internal amp to the head unit , unless it’s a N20 unit in which case the ASD provides the amp duties.

It has 4 channels.

Also the audio profile has a heavily slugged rear speaker feed which is why in part it sounds so shitty..

So the simple solution is an external amp ideally 6 channels or 4 channels with a passive crossover

2 front channels feed 2 door speakers via an external amp where some cheaper 100mm after market speakers will yield benefits either with coaxial tweeter or discrete tweeter and crossover on door tweeter grills.

2 channels feed external rear speakers or maybe you can get away with OE channels..

Then 2 bass speakers off the front channels via cross over if paired with door speakers..

Code the headunit to be flat rather than rear speaker cut off.

Like all theses things some people think that will be a major improvement for modest outlay..

You can pay more , whether you think it’s worth it obviously a personal view.