Ukraine - What are putins reasons.
- Thread starter ronk
- Start date
Nothing can justify what is happening now, ever - Putin uses NATO or the West as an excuse to force Russia to abide by his dictatorship, NATO has never threatened Russia in any way, yes it has expanded as old iron curtain countries apply to join as they do not want to be taken over by Russia again - they have had a taste of freedom now.
Did we support a coup or did the Ukrainians vote out the old president and are they attacking the Russian speaking population in the East or are they defending themselves from the Russian backed separatists - I don't know?
Are they trying to wage war in Crimea after Russia annexed it - I don't see much evidence of it or are we now saying that the West are controlling the media like Moscow and keeping that from us?
I have travelled to Russian on business 20 times and many people hate Putin but love Russia, no different to many countries and their population.
I do not profess to know anything but this war cannot be justified by anyone while they continually bomb civilians killing children many of whom are Russian or speak Russian
Did we support a coup or did the Ukrainians vote out the old president and are they attacking the Russian speaking population in the East or are they defending themselves from the Russian backed separatists - I don't know?
Are they trying to wage war in Crimea after Russia annexed it - I don't see much evidence of it or are we now saying that the West are controlling the media like Moscow and keeping that from us?
I have travelled to Russian on business 20 times and many people hate Putin but love Russia, no different to many countries and their population.
I do not profess to know anything but this war cannot be justified by anyone while they continually bomb civilians killing children many of whom are Russian or speak Russian
The fact that Putin is killing innocent civilians including children regardless of his political fears etc is enough for me. I think the fact the population are fleeing in potential millions says it all as they don't wish to live under Russian rule.
Looking forward to seeing him in the dock and being tried, that's if he doesn't put a gun to his head first.
Tim.
Looking forward to seeing him in the dock and being tried, that's if he doesn't put a gun to his head first.
Tim.
The argument that Putin does not want NATO on it's borders as a threat does not wash. Most of his western border is with a NATO country. If he takes over Ukraine he will actually increase the number of NATO members on his borders.
If as some hav suggested it's all about protection of Russians in the East of Ukraine then if or when he takes over the country he will stop his military ambitions, but I doubt he will stop at Ukraine.
If as some hav suggested it's all about protection of Russians in the East of Ukraine then if or when he takes over the country he will stop his military ambitions, but I doubt he will stop at Ukraine.
Nanu said:
His actions will increase Nato membership - Finland (on his border) and Sweden not reduce it.
He already has control of the two new republics in East Ukraine so why has he not stopped, he wants a puppet government in there.
Scottish Borders
I'm not interested in another covid style ping pong debate especially with a couple of the Covid protagonists. ALthough in their style they will ping back. However on this post this is the end of my comments.
The view that some propose that Ukraine brought it on themselves, either as part of a chain of events and/or as part of the West's geo-political blunders is a point of view..
What I would point out is, as someone who has followed politics in quite a bit of detail for at least the last 30 years AND being born of both Ukraininan and Estonian descent are the following observations.
What has happened since the fall of the USSR is that each physically west facing ex USSR state and each USSR former satellite state, has of their own accord wanted to embrace almost all western geo/eco political entities be that NATO, EU, EASA etc.
Why?
All these states had been under USSR control for at least 45 years, some over 80 years. None of these states wanted to embrace a political system that echoed the Soviet system.
All these nation states have their own, unique heritage and cultures. For example the three little Baltic states, Lativa, Lithunania and Estonia from a UK perspective look like 3 counties, they are as different as Wales, Scotland and Ireland..actually more so especially in language.
The concept of a greater Russian empire fills all of these nation states with dread.
They all know that only by being in collective military /eco collectives do they have any chance of holding of the Russian Bear.
It is true that in response to these 'occupations' the swing to restoring their national identities has been zealous and some would argue over zealous.
You thereby come to the chicken and the egg.
Stalin used social engineering on a grand scale to forcibly move huge numbers of people from one state to another, especially Russians, the idea being that uprisings would be more difficult with a dilution of national identity.
So in every ex USSR state there is a considerable number of Russians.
Its true that policies from these new goverments have at times been assertive, emphasising the national language as an example or insisting on only passport, no dual nationals.
The issue that all these states realised, well before Putin and now exploited by Putin was that Russia has long asserted that wherever there are Russians they can use any means that they deem fit to 'protect them'
So we saw in Georgia this being used in 2008, it was only when Bush said that he would use cruise missiles against Russian troops that a hasty setllement was reached, Russia having annexed xome lands from Georgia.
In terms of Putin and his modus operandi
Lets covertly support any local agitators, grievenances valid or not.
When the nation state 'suppresses' these people, then escalate by more covert operations including false flag, then send Russain troops in etc
To come back to is Putin 'mad'
He was a sociopath, he's now a psychopath with a narcissic view of himself as part of the Russian state..he is the state and the state is him.
That's someone with mental issues. Witness his deliberate release of a large dog with Angela Merkel who had issues stemming from childhood, his satisfaction in operations in Syria, Checyna, Georgia, the number of actual and attempted assassinations of anyone who even ridiculed him, without posing any direct threat.
The view that some propose that Ukraine brought it on themselves, either as part of a chain of events and/or as part of the West's geo-political blunders is a point of view..
What I would point out is, as someone who has followed politics in quite a bit of detail for at least the last 30 years AND being born of both Ukraininan and Estonian descent are the following observations.
What has happened since the fall of the USSR is that each physically west facing ex USSR state and each USSR former satellite state, has of their own accord wanted to embrace almost all western geo/eco political entities be that NATO, EU, EASA etc.
Why?
All these states had been under USSR control for at least 45 years, some over 80 years. None of these states wanted to embrace a political system that echoed the Soviet system.
All these nation states have their own, unique heritage and cultures. For example the three little Baltic states, Lativa, Lithunania and Estonia from a UK perspective look like 3 counties, they are as different as Wales, Scotland and Ireland..actually more so especially in language.
The concept of a greater Russian empire fills all of these nation states with dread.
They all know that only by being in collective military /eco collectives do they have any chance of holding of the Russian Bear.
It is true that in response to these 'occupations' the swing to restoring their national identities has been zealous and some would argue over zealous.
You thereby come to the chicken and the egg.
Stalin used social engineering on a grand scale to forcibly move huge numbers of people from one state to another, especially Russians, the idea being that uprisings would be more difficult with a dilution of national identity.
So in every ex USSR state there is a considerable number of Russians.
Its true that policies from these new goverments have at times been assertive, emphasising the national language as an example or insisting on only passport, no dual nationals.
The issue that all these states realised, well before Putin and now exploited by Putin was that Russia has long asserted that wherever there are Russians they can use any means that they deem fit to 'protect them'
So we saw in Georgia this being used in 2008, it was only when Bush said that he would use cruise missiles against Russian troops that a hasty setllement was reached, Russia having annexed xome lands from Georgia.
In terms of Putin and his modus operandi
Lets covertly support any local agitators, grievenances valid or not.
When the nation state 'suppresses' these people, then escalate by more covert operations including false flag, then send Russain troops in etc
To come back to is Putin 'mad'
He was a sociopath, he's now a psychopath with a narcissic view of himself as part of the Russian state..he is the state and the state is him.
That's someone with mental issues. Witness his deliberate release of a large dog with Angela Merkel who had issues stemming from childhood, his satisfaction in operations in Syria, Checyna, Georgia, the number of actual and attempted assassinations of anyone who even ridiculed him, without posing any direct threat.
Attachments
Interesting read Peter,
He is defo a psychopath, (i speak with knowledge ,as we have one that joined our family, and have witnessed the harm they are capable of without any emotion or care for others )which makes the whole situation so scary .
I only hope one of his inner circle take him out .
I hope your family continue to be safe .
M
He is defo a psychopath, (i speak with knowledge ,as we have one that joined our family, and have witnessed the harm they are capable of without any emotion or care for others )which makes the whole situation so scary .
I only hope one of his inner circle take him out .
I hope your family continue to be safe .
M
Devon
I would ignore the klepto analysts
As was shown on the great Covid debates folks can find the evidence to support their theories
Those analysts who are close to Russian affairs have been warning their masters for a long time
Spending money on defence is never popular and Merkel’s legacy is worth about as much as a rouble
Like others before him it was only a matter of when not if
As was shown on the great Covid debates folks can find the evidence to support their theories
Those analysts who are close to Russian affairs have been warning their masters for a long time
Spending money on defence is never popular and Merkel’s legacy is worth about as much as a rouble
Like others before him it was only a matter of when not if
Damn must be embarrassing when you promote people that are wearing Nazi symbols
Soldiers just walking around openly wearing the "Black Sun" on their uniforms, videos of them dipping their bullets in pig fat for the benefit of any Muslims they may shoot.