UK Budget

[Anonymous]

What about us wrinkly old pensioners!

Yes, I don't know how we will manage, Look's like I'll have to stop going to my 2nd home in the Lakes so much :lol:

are you an MP Kryton?

No, just a 65 year old trying to enjoy life

 

[JimmyPop]

one more, then I'll stop..promise..

Where can you hide a £20 note from an orthopaedic surgeon...... put it in the notes

Sorry, joining the thread late (damn on call!)

How many orthopods does it take to change a lightbulb?

Just one to write the letter to the medics - "Dear doctor, darkness. Query cause?"


What does a rhinoceros have in common with a private orthopaedic surgeon?

They're both thick-skinned, horny and charge a lot!

Sorry, couldn't resist

 

[IK.]

Does anyone know if the pay freeze for the NHS means we don't get our incremental as well, or is it just the inflationary rise we miss out on?

 

[pvr]

I know that the police is exempt as they had a 3 year deal, not aware of other areas.

 

[RX-78]

Bit confusing though, wasn't there the issue with GPs under labour tripling their salary and halving their workload (i.e. 9 - 5 only, no weekends etc)?

I assume you guys are not GPs then ...

We don't like talk about GPs! They negotiated their own contracts, effectively acting as small businesses with licences to manufacture Mercedes, golf clubs, and country houses!

Thats a bit unfair!

GPs did negotiate a good contract but prior to it they were doing far more work (many I know did 1 in 3 night 24 hours oncalls and sat morning surgery before this) then consultants who often had his senior registrar (again no longer exists) do most emergency work for him, effectively sitting at home. Even now I go in for 8am, work till 11:30, then home visits, then mountain of paper works at lunch break, followed by afternoon surgery, finishing around 6pm. That is if I'm not doing late evening surgery on top or if I'm the duty doctor (when I'll generally finish nearer 7pm). And yes, I often end up taking work home - dont forget most GPs manage their own surgery, so we have to look at non medical things like stuffing, expenditure, QOF/government targets, PCT issues, PBC budget, 5 year plans, accounts etc etc. And most of us do this in our private time (one afternoon/week for admin isn't enough time to address all the above). This amounts to well over 60 hours/week in actual work load, during which I get swarn, threatened, black mailed, and even got a knife pulled out once (I know of several GPs who were robbed during house visits).

I do know how secondary care work as I worked from 2000-2008 in hospital, and amount of work a junior doctor does is much less now then when I first qualified (around 70 hours/week!).

Also (almost all) GPs are small business - they have always been an independant contractors and hence they are subcontracting from NHS - a contract called GMS or PMS contract. Hence we are self employed (which in itself comes with whole host of stigma - try and get a mortgage/loan now as a selfemployed and you'll see!), and have to cover our own work load & insurance. I pay over £7k/year on indemnity & locum insurance. NHS Hospital doctors are not independant contractors - they are employed by the hospital. So you could see GPs and hospital doctors cannot negotiate a contract together!

Sorry its a bit of a rant but its a bit upsetting to see a fellow doctor making such comment......

 

[BMWZ4MC]

Rant away, it was meant to be facetious - sorry for any offence caused!

 

[JimmyPop]

Does anyone know if the pay freeze for the NHS means we don't get our incremental as well, or is it just the inflationary rise we miss out on?

I would imagine our incremental is protected. Would imagine the BMA would have something to say about F1s moving to F2s and trainees progressing to registrar posts and staying on the same pay!

 

[pvr]

Rant away, it was meant to be facetious - sorry for any offence caused!

Unfortunately, that is exactly how the papers have reported it though.

 

[RX-78]

Rant away, it was meant to be facetious - sorry for any offence caused!

Unfortunately, that is exactly how the papers have reported it though.

Yes, thats how most patients percieve GPs as well. I get some thats doing 0 hours/week work tellimg me I should work more to justify my pay! I'm not suggesting GPs do anymore work then anyone else - but we do deserve a due credit where its justified.

 

[pvr]

Not disputing that. But like with the MP expense scandal, it is very easy to sway the public with figures that have a source of correctness in them.

If they quote examples of a GP x, earning in 2005 50k, working 70 hours and weekends and in 2008, the same GP x is earning 150k and works 40 hours and never on the weekend - that will tar the entire GP "population" with the same brush.

Just like all MPs were assumed to be fiddlers after the expense scandal.

 

[ronk]

What about us wrinkly old pensioners!

It's ok, us hard working and generous tax payers will keep you in Werthers Originals and slippers!

Thank you very much for the sweeties and slippers, but dont forget cars and the rest of "boys toys" we need to have to occupy our days between going B & Q for a 10% discount!

 

[IK.]

RX-78, I'd love to have a chat some time! I'm interested in the viewpoint of GPs external to my town.

 

[NikB]

Bit confusing though, wasn't there the issue with GPs under labour tripling their salary and halving their workload (i.e. 9 - 5 only, no weekends etc)?

I assume you guys are not GPs then ...

We don't like talk about GPs! They negotiated their own contracts, effectively acting as small businesses with licences to manufacture Mercedes, golf clubs, and country houses!

Thats a bit unfair!

GPs did negotiate a good contract but prior to it they were doing far more work (many I know did 1 in 3 night 24 hours oncalls and sat morning surgery before this) then consultants who often had his senior registrar (again no longer exists) do most emergency work for him, effectively sitting at home. Even now I go in for 8am, work till 11:30, then home visits, then mountain of paper works at lunch break, followed by afternoon surgery, finishing around 6pm. That is if I'm not doing late evening surgery on top or if I'm the duty doctor (when I'll generally finish nearer 7pm). And yes, I often end up taking work home - dont forget most GPs manage their own surgery, so we have to look at non medical things like stuffing, expenditure, QOF/government targets, PCT issues, PBC budget, 5 year plans, accounts etc etc. And most of us do this in our private time (one afternoon/week for admin isn't enough time to address all the above). This amounts to well over 60 hours/week in actual work load, during which I get swarn, threatened, black mailed, and even got a knife pulled out once (I know of several GPs who were robbed during house visits).

I do know how secondary care work as I worked from 2000-2008 in hospital, and amount of work a junior doctor does is much less now then when I first qualified (around 70 hours/week!).

Also (almost all) GPs are small business - they have always been an independant contractors and hence they are subcontracting from NHS - a contract called GMS or PMS contract. Hence we are self employed (which in itself comes with whole host of stigma - try and get a mortgage/loan now as a selfemployed and you'll see!), and have to cover our own work load & insurance. I pay over £7k/year on indemnity & locum insurance. NHS Hospital doctors are not independant contractors - they are employed by the hospital. So you could see GPs and hospital doctors cannot negotiate a contract together!

Sorry its a bit of a rant but its a bit upsetting to see a fellow doctor making such comment......

You can't deny you're quite well paid though. Try being a vet! We work longer hours, do more on call and are paid considerably less. One reason for lower pay is that it's private and we don't charge the extortionate prices that human private surgeons/medics do.

 

[Mikey]

Yes cheers guys, I'll be remembering your comments about the public sector pay freeze when I'm in Afghanistan with trace flying at me and IED's trying to blow me to pieces later this year and end of next year. All you lot get to see or hear about is the deaths, when you have an understanding at how many are sent back as amputees or with other horrendous injuries you may think otherwise.

 

[pvr]

Yes cheers guys, I'll be remembering your comments about the public sector pay freeze when I'm in Afghanistan with trace flying at me and IED's trying to blow me to pieces later this year and end of next year. All you lot get to see or hear about is the deaths, when you have an understanding at how many are sent back as amputees or with other horrendous injuries you may think otherwise.

Armed forces are not included as far as I understand it.

 

[Anonymous]

Yes cheers guys, I'll be remembering your comments about the public sector pay freeze when I'm in Afghanistan with trace flying at me and IED's trying to blow me to pieces later this year and end of next year. All you lot get to see or hear about is the deaths, when you have an understanding at how many are sent back as amputees or with other horrendous injuries you may think otherwise.

Armed forces are not included as far as I understand it.

I understand they have been given an operational uplift which is only fair, to many of our young lad's are giving up their lives

 

[Mikey]

Yes cheers guys, I'll be remembering your comments about the public sector pay freeze when I'm in Afghanistan with trace flying at me and IED's trying to blow me to pieces later this year and end of next year. All you lot get to see or hear about is the deaths, when you have an understanding at how many are sent back as amputees or with other horrendous injuries you may think otherwise.

Armed forces are not included as far as I understand it.

Oh yes we are, all three services.

 

[mikedav]

Yes cheers guys, I'll be remembering your comments about the public sector pay freeze when I'm in Afghanistan with trace flying at me and IED's trying to blow me to pieces

The armed forces operational allowance just doubled from £14.51 per day to £29.02. AND it's back dated to May 2010?

Six-month tour takes £2,640 up to £5,281.

 

[badwolf456]

its always been the same

labour - working class
conservs - middle class
and the rich? well your in a league of your own!!

It doesnt really matter to the mps earning 65k+ per year! i work in the public sector (emergency services is all im going to say)
and i can live with the pay freeze for two years (lets be honest, we all like more money but a pay rise will only make you want more)
but reducing my pension no. the state pension is pittance so my own is far healthier and to have it taken away makes me not want to do the job i do. People who work for the country whether is hm forces/emergency services - keeping it safe and secure shouldnt have pension cuts :thumbsdown:

armed forces should have unlimited access to cash to do the jobs they do safely instead of using out of date equipment.

i think they should of left everything how it is and simply put a decifit tax £5-10 per month (depending on earnings) and that money goes into clearing the decifit
30 million workers at £10 a month = 300,000 million squid!!!! much better then arse raping us with more vat increases!!

providing ive got the zed. im happy

HERE! HERE!

 

[BMWZ4MC]

What about us wrinkly old pensioners!

It's ok, us hard working and generous tax payers will keep you in Werthers Originals and slippers!

Thank you very much for the sweeties and slippers, but dont forget cars and the rest of "boys toys" we need to have to occupy our days between going B & Q for a 10% discount!

Surely you just use your bus pass to get to B&Q?