Thinking about changing Z4M for 360...

[Inuit]

I have thought about upgrading, bit like others sometimes i spend too much gin and tonic fuelled time on piston heads classfieds deciding what i would like.

To be honest just cannot convince myself to spend that much on running costs, when i have a few other expensive tastes and hobbies. If i did not have these then they there would be no discussion i would go for it. Life is too short , you can always keep it for a year and then sell or swap back to an M if the costs or the wrong type of attention got too much. Certainly think it would be a good experience to own one. i would go red or something really flashy.

 

[ksher]

I was thinking about a 348/456 GT earlier (they are cheaper than 360 F1). A good 360 F1 will cost at least £40k. I want to use it everyday. That means 2 services (£1.5k) and 2 sets of tyres every year. And the fuel will be 60% higher. I will have to leave it on the drive (single garage). But 360 F1 is still my doable dream car.

 

[Darren M]

Money pit on wheels!
Back when I did trackdays more often I knew a Ferrari owner and he told me some scarey stories about the cost of ownership of his 355. A service and a few bits and bobs cost £5000 (this was back in 2001). He took it abroad for a trackday and it jsut fell apart, something like another ££££££bill(engine issue and exhaust if I remember correctly). it sounded great on track but was so fragile. His great friend had an E46 M3 and the Ferrari owner spent more time in that at trackdays I think.

Some say ///M is for Mugs (due to the sometimes extortionate prices BMW put on parts/servicing) but Ferrari are in another league when it comes to extortion . I`ve fancied a Porsche in the past but I hear a lot of bad stories about the Porsche dealers taking advantage also (ripping people off because they think Porsche owners will just get their wallet/purse out no matter what the cost).

if it`s a dream then try one. But I`d place good money on you spending more time polishing it, worrying about it, worrying about driving it too much that you`ll soon sell it just like a dreamworld mate did when he bought a TVR Tuscan. He paid 32k for it, kept it in the garage, spent every weekend polishing it instead of driving it, used it a few times only, was scared of the running costs and then sold it again within three or so months when he realised he was just in a dream world when he bought it.

 

[Mr Whippy]

Having read lots on their costs they (F360) are not THAT bad.

They are when they are new under warranty, when taken to Ferrari, but a 2002 F360 taken to a decent independent would cost easily half what Ferrari charge.
There is also that useability issue. Use them less and things sieze and cost plenty to fix (like any car, but the F360's delicate suspension joints seem suceptible to premature failure through under-use)

You only have to look at retarded BMW who replace a windscreen to sort a failed rain sensor gel. £350+ part vs £5 for a gel pad... 2hrs work vs 10 minutes work.
Just imagine if Ferrari do anything like this to appease customers, then that is why they can cost so much.


They horror stories from owners who just take their car to Ferrari no questions asked, when they were new, are not really indicative of owning one now imho, using independents and doing cheaper but still no less effective fixes...

The F355 seems to have a reputation mainly because of the engine out for a cambelt job, and it was from, ultimately, the 348 era, so it is a decade older in tech/design etc. The F360 is a late 90's car with much more emphasis on reliability and serviceability! It's from the generation of cars that don't break, and were designed/engineered to be serviced.

Pretty sure there is a PH member with one on over 100k miles who spends £300 every other year on a cambelt change, and about £600 a year on servicing. That sounds perfectly acceptable to me. OK there will be costs for maintainance (lets not confuse the service cost with maintainance which plenty of people just add into one), but again, referring to the BMW windscreen replacement above, what is REALLY necessary? Just because Mr Wadded is happy to pay Ferrari £5000 on his new car at service time for a load of uncecessary work, or work that could be completed more easily, doesn't mean Mr Sensible who owns the car at 8 years old can't get the same work done for £500 instead!

Dave

 

[alexman]

After driving one and having a think about it, the 360 was a bit of an anti climax for the money... a bit too flashy and obvious without a "huge" increase in power over the Z4M... in the meantime I've fallen for a Cobra instead... raw power, stunning noise from 427 motors (actually a Chevvy 5.7 but hopefully a 7.0 Ford), 425HP at least and it's less of a poser car...

Just looking for a good builder now who can put together a professional replica which is a more reasonable 25-30k

 

[mikedav]

a bit too flashy and obvious without a "huge" increase in power over the Z4M...

That would be my concern. Lovely car to own but not as a daily - very loud, very flash, not always appropriate...you can't go to Tescos in a 360....can you? Though my neighbour drives his everyday, it's been on a flatbed once in 12 months so that can't be too bad. Running costs sound scary but that's what they say about M cars...though the belt change every 15k would need to be accounted for, and clutches , regularly, too. As a second car, why not.

Having said that I was told by a Ferrari guy that a 355 is a better buy? The 360 being a bit too common to be collectable, and in that weird phase between current and classic, where it's just 'old' (especially next to the 430, though a similar car underneath). The 355, however, is rarer, beautiful, a bit cheaper and unlikely to drop much more in value, so you won't lose as much on it?

I wouldn't touch a 348. Cheap for a reason...

 

[Darren M]

So Ferrari use a cam belt on a high revving high performance engine that needs changing at 15k? Shocking

 

[mikedav]

So Ferrari use a cam belt on a high revving high performance engine that needs changing at 15k? Shocking

Here's a good one - I actually looked at a Maserati Gransport a while back, was quite tempted as I wanted something different, but a 4 seater. Turns out apparently the clutches go every 12-18k. The explanation was that it's the same flappy paddle system used in the 360, but a much heavier car, so it's too small for the job and thus wears quickly, particularly in auto mode in traffic. Gransport owners forums will say 'you have to expect that of a 400BHP car'. Except of course BMW currently make a car named the 'M3' with 414BHP, and if you told an owner he'll need a new clutch annually at best, he would probably have a word...

BUT , as others have said, choosing a car is more than picking the one with the best figures per £ in a top trumps style, otherwise we would all drive the same thing, and that Maserati was bloody lovely, so you could probably forgive it. You would just need to build it into your own running costs (£1200-£1500 a go) and decide whether it was worthwhile.

 

[Mr Whippy]

Is the Ferrari cambelt done on mileage, age, or a combo of both?

It's very likely that you would probably get 30k/2yrs from one without excessive risk etc, but obviously doing 15k a year.

MOST owners will probably do 5k a year and have it on there for 3 years... and doing harder driving when they do it, hence the apparent low mileage.


Probably same with clutch too. F1 wears it hard at lower speeds, and so will any gear change.


Infact, most of the issues with these seem to be with low use.

Personally I wouldn't worry about running one if I could afford the £35,000 ish to buy an older one. I see plenty of people spunk £10k up the wall on a new £40,000 BMW in 1st year depreciation!!! Now that I couldn't afford to do £1000 on clutch/cambelt every other year seems perfectly fine to me however

Dave

 

[AlanJ]

Just do it...... :evil:

 

[PawnSacrifice]

Just do it...... :evil:

Not the most considered response here and yet, I suspect, you're reading that thinking, he's got a point! He has. :evil:

PS... I wish I had your dilema!

 

[PawnSacrifice]

Not to throw a spanner in the works, but have you considered a stripped out XJS with nitros?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DoxEis_Y7F0

(Actually dug this out for the 911 Turbo - superfast and dry sump = no RMS worries!)