The best sports car for under £10k

tiglon said:
Surely it's the effect that weight has that is the point, not the weight itself?

If technology mitigates the effect of the weight, then a heavier car can have all the same qualities of a lighter car.

What's the heaviest that a sports car can be, and why?
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All cars are very similar in size, with around 15% difference in height and length. The width is very constant (otherwise they wouldn't fit on our tiny roads). All have a wheel at each corner, roughly.
The one biggest difference is their weight. No matter how clever manufacturers and engineers are, you can't disguise weight on a big lump of metal hurtling along bendy roads. Physics says this is so. The weight will always make itself known in one form or another.
If a car is so clever that it can make you not notice the weight, it isn't going to be 'fun' to drive. Actually, no, it is physically impossible for a car to not show it's weight at one time or another.

Look at the benchmark 'sportscar'.....the MGB. They were badly built, old technology even when new, gutless engines, crude chassis and suspension. But they were very light with skinny tyres and no power steering. They are extremely fun to drive. Like driving a go kart.

The Lotus Elise, a modern day benchmark sportscar. They are extremely popular because they are massively fun and involving to drive. They were not powerful but were well engineered and very very LIGHT.

Maybe the words 'involving to drive' should be the criteria to make a car a 'sportscar'. IMHO to be properly involved in driving a car it needs to be light. The lighter the better.

BMW have used the strap line 'the ultimate driving machine' for years. It's marketing bollox.....they ain't. I know this is a BMW forum and people love their Z4s, but for me they are NOT sportscars, purely because they are too heavy.
 
While I didn't mind the content, the swearing and the clarkson-esque metaphors was a bit much. There are plenty of other good automotive youtubers, so... probably give this guy a miss.
 
Hopefully he will get de monetised for the language, if not for the earring or misleading content - N53! 🤦‍♂️
 
Pondrew said:
All cars are very similar in size, with around 15% difference in height and length. The width is very constant (otherwise they wouldn't fit on our tiny roads). All have a wheel at each corner, roughly.
The one biggest difference is their weight. No matter how clever manufacturers and engineers are, you can't disguise weight on a big lump of metal hurtling along bendy roads. Physics says this is so. The weight will always make itself known in one form or another.
If a car is so clever that it can make you not notice the weight, it isn't going to be 'fun' to drive. Actually, no, it is physically impossible for a car to not show it's weight at one time or another.

Look at the benchmark 'sportscar'.....the MGB. They were badly built, old technology even when new, gutless engines, crude chassis and suspension. But they were very light with skinny tyres and no power steering. They are extremely fun to drive. Like driving a go kart.

The Lotus Elise, a modern day benchmark sportscar. They are extremely popular because they are massively fun and involving to drive. They were not powerful but were well engineered and very very LIGHT.

Maybe the words 'involving to drive' should be the criteria to make a car a 'sportscar'. IMHO to be properly involved in driving a car it needs to be light. The lighter the better.

BMW have used the strap line 'the ultimate driving machine' for years. It's marketing bollox.....they ain't. I know this is a BMW forum and people love their Z4s, but for me they are NOT sportscars, purely because they are too heavy.
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Is an MGB really the benchmark for sportscars, or was it just one of the first + nostalgia? Is it really that much fun to drive?

Physics is more complex than weight = bad.

If you can't mitigate weight, and weight is the defining attribute, then I'm assuming a 2CV is a better sportscar than an MGB?
 
The swearing and innuendos were a little unnecessary but other than that he just came across to me as someone who is really enthusiastic about the car. Very Clarkson-esque. As to his fashion choices <shrug> to each their own.

Only his 2nd youtube video after a bunch of tiktoks. I imagine his tiktoks are over the top to capture short attention spans and this has followed through to his youtube videos. Maybe as he finds his feet on youtube where its a longer format he may tone it down a touch.
 
I do not know this guy from Adam but I left a like on his video. Just as with any form of entertainment, it will please some, leave some untroubled and irritate others. I found it a well produced video with great shots of a classically-styled sports car driving through stunning scenery. This undoubtedly took no small amount of time and skill to produce and, vocabulary/syle aside, he was obviously a fellow Z4 enthusiast who, if his claimed driven mileage is correct, must practically live in his E86. I'm sure that this forum would be welcoming to all those who extol the virtues of such automotive design and engineering. It may even attract a slightly younger audience and fan base to these wonderful cars!

Of course the Z4 is a sports car.

Some said my MR2 Roadster wasn't a sports car; only 138 bhp and couldn't beat a hot hatch from the lights. And the Z4 not a sports car because it's too heavy? Both are sports cars. Happy motoring all :cool: :driving:
 
I’m confused. I thought everyone who owns and drives a coupe drives around making the noises he makes?

No? Just me?

Let’s hope he never gets hold of an M eh…
 
For a purely entertaining video on YT it was fine.

Some of his facts were a bit wrong and yes his ear ring was annoying.
 
bigwinn said:
drives around making the noises he makes
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I tend to laugh and make vroom vroom noises when I put my foot down, I cant help it. Its clearly contagious too because now my wife joins in with the noises from the passenger seat.
My wife also suggests taking Emily (ok, yes we named her eMily) for a run to "stretch her legs" some weekends.
 
Gebbly said:
I tend to laugh and make vroom vroom noises when I put my foot down, I cant help it. Its clearly contagious too because now my wife joins in with the noises from the passenger seat.
My wife also suggests taking Emily (ok, yes we named her eMily) for a run to "stretch her legs" some weekends.
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Clever way of linking M into it!!
 
We had £10k and after looking at several from Jags to MX5s we bought a Z4 2.5si for under £5k, it’s comfortable plenty of performance, luggage space and can be used as an everyday car if needed, you can’t do that with MGB or anything else 40+yrs old.

I really rate the Z4 as long as you maintain it properly, if you’re not into maintenence maybe an MX5 is for you.
 
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Pondrew said:
I could take him more seriously if he didn't have an '80s dangly earring and wasn't a typical 'youtube' car knob.

Where were all these online 'car experts' hiding before they could make money out of 'likes'?

As for the best sportscars under £10k.......very debatable. Not least depending on your definition of a sportscar. Personally don't think any BMW can fall into this category as they're too heavy.
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What do you classify as too heavy? I thought my E86 was fairly lightweight at 1320kg to say its got a straight six
 
I have just bought an e85 3.0si. Previous to that, an E89 3.0 sdrive and previous to that an F87 M2. Obviously the M2 was a great car and in a way regret selling it. The E89 was a spontaneous decision as a neighbour was looking to sell. It did get me hooked into open top driving but was way too refined.

I have to say, when I test drove the e85, just got so excited. It handles really well, corners flat and that 3.0si engine with the sound generator makes me want to rev it out. And it doesn't have stupid power that is not fun because its too quick on normal roads. I am hoping I can maintain this old car and keep it on the road. The newer gen cars just dont have the personality and feel of the older cars. Sports car, maybe not, but sports enough for me.
 
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Pondrew said:
Look at the benchmark 'sportscar'.....the MGB. They were badly built, old technology even when new, gutless engines, crude chassis and suspension. But they were very light with skinny tyres and no power steering. They are extremely fun to drive. Like driving a go kart.
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That's not my definition of a sports car, it's more like masochism!

A sports car needs at least some performance, which is probably why Mazda are said to have based the MX5 on the Lotus Elan. Alfa Romeos and Fiats from the MGB era were also way more sophisticated with twin-cam engines, 5 speed gearboxes and 4 wheel disc brakes.

I still remember a former schoolmate of mine selling his Mk3 Cortina GT and adding a few hundred quid to buy an MGB GT, then he realised he had wasted his money as the Cortina was a much better drive in every way!
 
Mr Tidy said:
That's not my definition of a sports car, it's more like masochism!

A sports car needs at least some performance, which is probably why Mazda are said to have based the MX5 on the Lotus Elan. Alfa Romeos and Fiats from the MGB era were also way more sophisticated with twin-cam engines, 5 speed gearboxes and 4 wheel disc brakes.

I still remember a former schoolmate of mine selling his Mk3 Cortina GT and adding a few hundred quid to buy an MGB GT, then he realised he had wasted his money as the Cortina was a much better drive in every way!
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TBH Iain I am bored of this subject now. I know what I mean but either I am not conveying it well, or people are refusing to understand. Either way it doesn't matter. If you want to call an E86 a 'sportscar' who am I to argue?

Actually......why aren't E86s referred to as 'hot hatches'? They are a hatchback and quite powerful. That's my new moniker for them..."hot hatches". :)
 
I think perhaps the descriptor "sportscar" is a very subjective term. If you had asked 10 year old me to point out "sportscars" on the road I think I would have pointed at every coupe. In much the same was as today so many cars are advertised as SUV when so few of them have anything "Sport" or "Utility" about them.

I guess the term "sportscar" just means different things to different people. I can imagine if someone had experienced owning things like ferraris, porsches or lamborghinis they would not consider something like a Z4 to be a sports car and if someone had only driven cars like smart or lada they might well consider a ford capri as a sports car (10 year old me did and my dad used to even call it a "poor mans sportscar" although these days i think their market has grown). So everyone can be right at the same time :)

I think if we stepped outside of the petrolhead community and just asked average-joe off the street if a Z4 was a sportscar they would probably see the lines, hear the growly straight 6 and see it zip around the roads and say yes it was a sportscar. So for a youtube video trying to pull in as big an audience as possible I think using the term "sportscar" is reasonable.

Sidenote: Names like coupe and hatchback (therefore hot hatch) I find a little less subjective. For me that is just a definition of the body shape. My Z4M is a coupe, my previous M135i was a hatchback and my 330e is a saloon.
 
Quite a bit of inaccurate info in there but I like the enthusiasm for the Z and would agree there isnt anything else comparable. I don't see 350Zs as comparable either and at this age most will be rusting to pieces.

A 10k Boxster 3.2 is technically a better platform but I had one for a while and thought it was a really boring experience no drama and not particularly quick. You could be getting a really leggy 3.4 for that money which will need quite a bit of money to make it how it should be. The Z is far more engaging imo and is far cheaper to look after and a much better looking car.
 
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