Steering - notchy and stiff
- Thread starter Otto
- Start date
Have a kind of result with the steering issue - BMW dealership said it would be a £2500.00 steering column fix, but that there was no difference between the old and newer column/ECU's, so the problem may return! (Not what I've read here - I understood the facelift models had a re-designed ECU/column?))
My independent dealer offered to take the car back and give me a full refund, but was unwilling to carry-out the repair under guarantee if it wasn't a permanent fix.
I really didn't want to part with the car, so agreed to a one-off compensation payment of £1000.00 from the dealer. As the problem is (at present) evident only under rare circumstances, I'll put-away some money each month for when it really needs fixing, with the £1000.00 a good start.
I have to say I feel the Dealer was in all respects very fair in this - I expect there are plenty of Independents who wouldn't part with a penny for an intermittent problem such as this one.
I'd certainly buy from them again.
Interestingly, the Dealer stated he'd never buy another Z4 after learning about this common (but well-kept secret) fault, but felt it was only a matter of time before BMW put out a factory recall. I hope so!
Surely collectively we could do something to publicise this and shame/prompt/worry BMW into recalling the early cars? Anybody any ideas???
My independent dealer offered to take the car back and give me a full refund, but was unwilling to carry-out the repair under guarantee if it wasn't a permanent fix.
I really didn't want to part with the car, so agreed to a one-off compensation payment of £1000.00 from the dealer. As the problem is (at present) evident only under rare circumstances, I'll put-away some money each month for when it really needs fixing, with the £1000.00 a good start.
I have to say I feel the Dealer was in all respects very fair in this - I expect there are plenty of Independents who wouldn't part with a penny for an intermittent problem such as this one.
I'd certainly buy from them again.
Interestingly, the Dealer stated he'd never buy another Z4 after learning about this common (but well-kept secret) fault, but felt it was only a matter of time before BMW put out a factory recall. I hope so!
Surely collectively we could do something to publicise this and shame/prompt/worry BMW into recalling the early cars? Anybody any ideas???
I've have this problem on 2004 3.0. I've only had it a week and noticed it at the weekend on a long drive in the sun.
The car was bought from a local ford dealer and luckily I did buy a warranty, but I'm a little worried that they won't take the problem seriously, as much of the time it's very subtle.
I'm taking to car in tomorrow to get some unrelated work done, so I'll mention it to them, but I'm also worried that my warranty only covers up to £1000 per claim, so even if they do acknowledge it, I could still end up with a hefty bill!
I would have thought this is a serious safety issue, as it did cause me to end up nearer to oncoming traffic than I would have liked at times
I wonder what the best route to make BMW aware of the situation is?
The car was bought from a local ford dealer and luckily I did buy a warranty, but I'm a little worried that they won't take the problem seriously, as much of the time it's very subtle.
I'm taking to car in tomorrow to get some unrelated work done, so I'll mention it to them, but I'm also worried that my warranty only covers up to £1000 per claim, so even if they do acknowledge it, I could still end up with a hefty bill!
I would have thought this is a serious safety issue, as it did cause me to end up nearer to oncoming traffic than I would have liked at times
I wonder what the best route to make BMW aware of the situation is?
I've been contemplating what to do about the nasty tram lining that I'm getting on my 2003 2.5 SE fitted with 17" Potenza RFTs, it's spoiling the experience particularly on lane 1 motorway grooves which can be a bit unnerving and certain linear surface repairs which can be a pain when entering a bend. It's nowhere near as bad as my former SLK 320 with 18" Potenzas, that was buttock clenching.
I have found that it subsides in hotter weather or once the tyres heat up which I assumed was due to more side wall flex, until this week - the car had been parked in full sun all day and was red hot inside. On pulling away the steering reacted in a series of stiff increments with no feedback or self centring, once in a turn it stayed there until forcibly returned, usually over reacting. Having nursed it to a filling station I checked tyre pressures assuming I had a flat, but all were OK. 15 mins later it had almost returned to normal and after the 25 mile jorney was fine. I parked the car facing the other way next day in similar heat and all was OK. Having looked at this and a related thread
http://www.z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=7972&p=122902&hilit=sticky+steering#p122902
I assume I have hot ECU related sticky steering. I'm going to try lubricating the steering UJ, get the bushes examined, change the tyres which are 2/3 worn (any current suggestions welcome, non RTFs or well behaved RFTs if they exist), get a 4 wheel alignment done and park in the shade, this is a shame 'cause I love this car!
Anyone know if shielding or cooling this part has been tried or is feasible, perhaps fitting a processor/small PC fan?
I'll do the work stage at a time and let you know how it goes.
I have found that it subsides in hotter weather or once the tyres heat up which I assumed was due to more side wall flex, until this week - the car had been parked in full sun all day and was red hot inside. On pulling away the steering reacted in a series of stiff increments with no feedback or self centring, once in a turn it stayed there until forcibly returned, usually over reacting. Having nursed it to a filling station I checked tyre pressures assuming I had a flat, but all were OK. 15 mins later it had almost returned to normal and after the 25 mile jorney was fine. I parked the car facing the other way next day in similar heat and all was OK. Having looked at this and a related thread
http://www.z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=7972&p=122902&hilit=sticky+steering#p122902
I assume I have hot ECU related sticky steering. I'm going to try lubricating the steering UJ, get the bushes examined, change the tyres which are 2/3 worn (any current suggestions welcome, non RTFs or well behaved RFTs if they exist), get a 4 wheel alignment done and park in the shade, this is a shame 'cause I love this car!
Anyone know if shielding or cooling this part has been tried or is feasible, perhaps fitting a processor/small PC fan?
I'll do the work stage at a time and let you know how it goes.
My car is so-far behaving itself (fingers crossed), but I'm sure the problem will return - probably to all early cars in time?
Other than running the aircon and waiting for the car to cool, there's not much we can do.
Going forward though, could BMW be perhaps persuaded to look at a recall if enough of us complained?
What would be best I wonder - a signed petition-type of list from all of us with the problem or us individually writing and quoting safety concerns, etc?
Letters to Motoring magazines and the like?
What do you think guys?
Other than running the aircon and waiting for the car to cool, there's not much we can do.
Going forward though, could BMW be perhaps persuaded to look at a recall if enough of us complained?
What would be best I wonder - a signed petition-type of list from all of us with the problem or us individually writing and quoting safety concerns, etc?
Letters to Motoring magazines and the like?
What do you think guys?
bmwangler said:
VOSA manage recalls in the UK, according to their site it is generally up to the manufacturer to report safety issues needing a recall, but they can investigate and approach manufacturers when the public report problems fitting the criteria. It seems odd to me that there is a well documented problem with early Z4 steering systems, which is a clear safety issue and has not been recalled. According to people on this forum there is an official BMW technical notice and lots of examples of it being fixed with an upgrade, so it surely needs a recall? Anyone know of any accidents? that would put a chilli pepper in their pants! The form to report incidents to VOSA is on their site, I will submit one and see what the reply is. .
http://www.dft.gov.uk/vosa/repository/vehicle%20safety%20defect%20report.doc
Quick update on my plan to resolve this which was to lube bothe the steering universal joints, get the front bushes checked, change the run flats and do something about the steering sensor going awol when hot - Got an MOT done asking for particular attention to bushes which were OK, I figured it was a cheap way to get a full examination.
I then lubed the steering joints which were very dry and showed surface corrosion, particularly the bottom which is tricky to get to. I took advice from another thread and painted some high temp oil in to the joints as they obviously get hot – result, I'm not dreaming it but the tramlining has been reduced, the steering feels more progressive and despite deliberately trying to provoke the heat related sticky steering by leaving in the sun all day haven’t had a repeat episode yet.
I don't know enough about how the electric steering works to explain this but maybe the sensors are measuring abnormal mechanical resistance in the system, and interpreting them as cornering loads from the wheels? Either way it’s worth trying if you have similar problems.
I’m going to give it a couple of weeks then move on to a non RF tyre change from Kwik-Fit (I’ve had some decent prices on 4 Goodyear F1 asymmetric - £450 fitted with balance, 4-wheel alignment check and nitrogen inflation which I have never used, slightly off topic but is it worth having?)
I then lubed the steering joints which were very dry and showed surface corrosion, particularly the bottom which is tricky to get to. I took advice from another thread and painted some high temp oil in to the joints as they obviously get hot – result, I'm not dreaming it but the tramlining has been reduced, the steering feels more progressive and despite deliberately trying to provoke the heat related sticky steering by leaving in the sun all day haven’t had a repeat episode yet.
I don't know enough about how the electric steering works to explain this but maybe the sensors are measuring abnormal mechanical resistance in the system, and interpreting them as cornering loads from the wheels? Either way it’s worth trying if you have similar problems.
I’m going to give it a couple of weeks then move on to a non RF tyre change from Kwik-Fit (I’ve had some decent prices on 4 Goodyear F1 asymmetric - £450 fitted with balance, 4-wheel alignment check and nitrogen inflation which I have never used, slightly off topic but is it worth having?)
z4phill said:I had the same problem the dealer fixed my car cost over £2000.00 so well pleased to have it done hope its ok now coz it has not been hot enough to check
well to report back I have had no problem during our recent hot weather with the steering since the rack was replaced with the 08 upgrade 6 months ago so good news
Ewazix - glad your efforts appear to be working and thanks for sharing with us.
As I said, mine's behaving itself so-far this summer, but will definitely lube the UJ's as you've outlined - can only help I'm sure.
Have to say though my problem in the winter was definitely temperature-related. I actually got this to happen deliberately when I took the car back to the dealer - whenever I run the heating very hot for a lengthy time (eg. with the hood down in winter) sticky steering gradually kicks-in. Turn-on the aircon and 10 mins later its normal. It is temperature for sure.
I hope it doesn't take someone to get killed for BMW to recall these older cars for what is a well-known safety issue. :x
As I said, mine's behaving itself so-far this summer, but will definitely lube the UJ's as you've outlined - can only help I'm sure.
Have to say though my problem in the winter was definitely temperature-related. I actually got this to happen deliberately when I took the car back to the dealer - whenever I run the heating very hot for a lengthy time (eg. with the hood down in winter) sticky steering gradually kicks-in. Turn-on the aircon and 10 mins later its normal. It is temperature for sure.
I hope it doesn't take someone to get killed for BMW to recall these older cars for what is a well-known safety issue. :x
Hi - should have posted weeks ago, but you know how it is....
Did the column on mine - I got an 07 one from a breaker for £95 and it was in great condition. I spoke to a guy at the stealers and he said the dash all has to come out to do the job. We looked at it and managed to do it without!! The secret is:
1 - Take your steering wheel off and all the cowling and dash lowers.
2 - Neatly cut out the piece of trim that runs across the car and will stop the column dropping down - this sits behind the dash trims so you won't seed it cut once all back together. I made two small alloy brackets to allow me to bolt this back in when finished. Use stainless screws and speedclips to retain it and it looks very neat.
3 - Undo the column link in the bay so the column in the car can move.
4 - undo all the fixing bolts for the column under the dash - a bit fiddly but not hard.
5 - rotate the column so you can get to the multi plugs and unplug everything.
6 - unplug the entire wiring loom that crosses the dash - I disconnected the light switch etc and routed everything to the left and made lots of room around the column.
7 - Rotate the column and gently 'roll' it out of position - it's quite tight, but it will come out through the trim (providing you chopped the little bit out first!)
8 - strip the steering lock/switch assembly off your column and onto the new one (make sure you remove the circlip on the column before you try pulling it all off, and make sure you get the key with the new coulmn just to undo the steering lock!!) I used a cutter to make a slot in the top of the security shear bolts and unscrewed them witha big flat blade driver. I refitted the lock with some stainless security allen bolts. I also swapped my steering angle sensor over thinking I had managed not to move it so it wouldn't need re-setting....
Assembly is the reverse of the above - just remember to plug the loom in before bolting everything solid - its hard to get some of the plugs in otherwise.
I didn't manage to align the steering angle sensor - it's more or less impossible with everything moving about as you do the job. I spoke to an indy and a stealer for a price on resetting it (loads of warning lights are on while its not working!) and they wanted between £80 and £100 to do the job.
I managed to borrow a scanner from a mates garage and had a go myself - it took about 3 mins!! Found the setting for steering angle sensor re-set, straigthened the wheel, pressed the button on the scanned and bingo!! All is well with the world!
Steering is a bit firmer and more positive now in both normal and sport - in keeping with my mates 08 3.0si - and I have had no notchy steering at all since doing it.
Job took 4-5 hours to do including the column strip down and working it all out - I would think a days work if you are at home (I had a ramp) and probably not quite novice level, but basic skills and patience will see the job done. If you don't want to do that I am sure my mate (guy with the garage, ramp and scanner) would sort it for you at a sensible price. Just get looking for those post '05 columns in the breakers now!!
Did the column on mine - I got an 07 one from a breaker for £95 and it was in great condition. I spoke to a guy at the stealers and he said the dash all has to come out to do the job. We looked at it and managed to do it without!! The secret is:
1 - Take your steering wheel off and all the cowling and dash lowers.
2 - Neatly cut out the piece of trim that runs across the car and will stop the column dropping down - this sits behind the dash trims so you won't seed it cut once all back together. I made two small alloy brackets to allow me to bolt this back in when finished. Use stainless screws and speedclips to retain it and it looks very neat.
3 - Undo the column link in the bay so the column in the car can move.
4 - undo all the fixing bolts for the column under the dash - a bit fiddly but not hard.
5 - rotate the column so you can get to the multi plugs and unplug everything.
6 - unplug the entire wiring loom that crosses the dash - I disconnected the light switch etc and routed everything to the left and made lots of room around the column.
7 - Rotate the column and gently 'roll' it out of position - it's quite tight, but it will come out through the trim (providing you chopped the little bit out first!)
8 - strip the steering lock/switch assembly off your column and onto the new one (make sure you remove the circlip on the column before you try pulling it all off, and make sure you get the key with the new coulmn just to undo the steering lock!!) I used a cutter to make a slot in the top of the security shear bolts and unscrewed them witha big flat blade driver. I refitted the lock with some stainless security allen bolts. I also swapped my steering angle sensor over thinking I had managed not to move it so it wouldn't need re-setting....
Assembly is the reverse of the above - just remember to plug the loom in before bolting everything solid - its hard to get some of the plugs in otherwise.
I didn't manage to align the steering angle sensor - it's more or less impossible with everything moving about as you do the job. I spoke to an indy and a stealer for a price on resetting it (loads of warning lights are on while its not working!) and they wanted between £80 and £100 to do the job.
I managed to borrow a scanner from a mates garage and had a go myself - it took about 3 mins!! Found the setting for steering angle sensor re-set, straigthened the wheel, pressed the button on the scanned and bingo!! All is well with the world!
Steering is a bit firmer and more positive now in both normal and sport - in keeping with my mates 08 3.0si - and I have had no notchy steering at all since doing it.
Job took 4-5 hours to do including the column strip down and working it all out - I would think a days work if you are at home (I had a ramp) and probably not quite novice level, but basic skills and patience will see the job done. If you don't want to do that I am sure my mate (guy with the garage, ramp and scanner) would sort it for you at a sensible price. Just get looking for those post '05 columns in the breakers now!!
hawkeye00021
Member
Just found this thread, my car has the same problem and there are several reports of it on the NHSTA website (American safety oversight body). It is incredible that BMW will not consider this a recall as it has to be a safety issue, but to my knowledge to accidents have been reported over here.
hawkeye00021
Member
In the states, the NHSTA has finally launched an official investigation into this issue. I would urge fellow American's to file complaints on their web page as I would imagine the more attention we can draw to the problem the better. I reported mine today, I hope this forum can generate some more traffic for this dangerous issue.
stevecbrz4
Member
I am experiencing this problem on my 07 2.5si. I have one month left on my one year BMW Used Warranty and I have raised this Sticky Steering problem with the local stealership. They said they knew nothing about a long term problem to the steering on the Z4 and want to get a technician to drive the car. Trouble is the sticky steering is very intermittent and for the past week since I raised it there has been no sign of it!! If I can't get them to agree there is a problem I'm going to end up going past the warranty date!!
Does anyone know whether this issue has a formal BMW Code or Complaint against it in the UK that I could refer to with the stealer?
Thanks
Does anyone know whether this issue has a formal BMW Code or Complaint against it in the UK that I could refer to with the stealer?
Thanks
stevecbrz4 said:
I understood that a post facelift model like yours has the modified column and module so should not be affected by heat related 'sticky steering'? Some people have reported being able to induce the heat related module problem by leaving the car running with the lower heater vents on max.
With the warranty date looming you need get it acknowledged, then leave it for them to diagnose and sort, but it's not easy if it's intermittent. There are other possible causes, e.g. tyres, bushes, rack, column and UJ condition/lubrication or even battery condition, any of which can easily be checked by the technicians.
Lets us know how it goes.
stevecbrz4
Member
Thanks Ewazix, I'll try to provoke it using the heater method and if that works run it quickly round to the stealers for them to test.
Anyone else got any info about BMW in the UK acknowledging this as an issue and briefing stealers?
Thanks.
Anyone else got any info about BMW in the UK acknowledging this as an issue and briefing stealers?
Thanks.
waterdog101
New member
I have a 2005 z4 with 28000, miles on it. just noticed the steering hanging or sticking today. it will hang when I need to steer to the left. when it sticks, or hangs, i have to pull the steering wheel a little harder to get it to steer. in traffic it's really unsafe to drive. I looked on the bmw-z4 forums and found this post. and have been reading about this problem, it is for sure a safty hazzard when driving. is there a phone number that can be called, to find out if this is a safty problem that bmw will fix. if this isn't a safty problem with the bmw-z4 cars, I sure would like to know what they would consider a safty hazzard.