My thoughts exactly... and from my own experience I feel the same. I rarely use the sport button on the highway when I'm really going fast in Germany. I don't use it on track... On the Ring I leave DSC on... On other tracks it's another story.exdos said:bennyboysvuk said:I never use sport mode, for me it reduces the progression of the throttle and does nothing else. Here's a graph of the throttle sensitivity (ok, it's for the M3, but it's the same engine for all intents and purposes). All it does is bring in the throttle sooner for a given amount of travel, until you get to 100% throttle where they're both the same.
^^^^ WHS
As that graph shows, even with Sport Mode on, you still have to depress the throttle to the floor to get WOT. The car doesn't accelerate any faster in Sport Mode.
I posted the graph below over 12 months ago on this forum which is a datalogged graph of 1-2-3 gear acceleration with Sport Mode on and DSC off, and the performance is no different than with Sport Mode off and DSC on! The ECU limits the fueling in 1st gear as a torque limiter. Sure, with DSC off you can break traction at will or by accident, but even with DSC on you can get sufficient slip angle to get the tyres performing up to their limits.
sport button, i think i get it !!!
- Thread starter mad4slalom
- Start date
exdos said:bennyboysvuk said:I never use sport mode, for me it reduces the progression of the throttle and does nothing else. Here's a graph of the throttle sensitivity (ok, it's for the M3, but it's the same engine for all intents and purposes). All it does is bring in the throttle sooner for a given amount of travel, until you get to 100% throttle where they're both the same.
^^^^ WHS
As that graph shows, even with Sport Mode on, you still have to depress the throttle to the floor to get WOT. The car doesn't accelerate any faster in Sport Mode.
I posted the graph below over 12 months ago on this forum which is a datalogged graph of 1-2-3 gear acceleration with Sport Mode on and DSC off, and the performance is no different than with Sport Mode off and DSC on! The ECU limits the fueling in 1st gear as a torque limiter. Sure, with DSC off you can break traction at will or by accident, but even with DSC on you can get sufficient slip angle to get the tyres performing up to their limits.
The first 10% of throttle travel with Sport off does little, whilst with Sport on any throttle travel provokes an immediate rise in revs. As such, blipping the throttle for rev-matching on downchanges does little with Sport off. Similarly, pulling away gently with Sport off is difficult as the initial press of the pedal does not provide the anticipated engine response potentially leading to bunny hopping or even stalling. The other benefit of Sport is the increase in pops and crackles (as mentioned already). I always switch Sport on even before I start the engine. I would prefer a throttle cable rather than fly-by-wire, but at least the Sport map is more linear than Sport off in the earlypart of pedal travel.
As for DSC, this is usually on on the road and always off on the track.
I always have sport nailed on. I find because it opens the taps up more for the same amount of movement, it does make for better shifts, response in the twisties, pops, crackles and general sex. It will take you a split second longer to get the same response out of the engine in normal mode in theory, and I feel it makes a difference on a spirited run.
If you want to play with how much the revs are effected, hold your throttle at say 3k revs with sport on, then turn it off - you should see the revs drop. IIRC it won't work the other way round because you have to come off the throttle before it will engage, as to not spin you into the nearest shrubbery mid corner
If you want to play with how much the revs are effected, hold your throttle at say 3k revs with sport on, then turn it off - you should see the revs drop. IIRC it won't work the other way round because you have to come off the throttle before it will engage, as to not spin you into the nearest shrubbery mid corner
exdos said:I posted the graph below over 12 months ago on this forum which is a datalogged graph of 1-2-3 gear acceleration with Sport Mode on and DSC off, and the performance is no different than with Sport Mode off and DSC on! The ECU limits the fueling in 1st gear as a torque limiter. Sure, with DSC off you can break traction at will or by accident, but even with DSC on you can get sufficient slip angle to get the tyres performing up to their limits.
Some very interesting reading in this thread!
Apologies for going slightly off-topic, but the above post mentions there is a torque limiter in 1st gear, and from how I read the post, it seems to imply that this relates to having the DSC on, or having the sport mode off? Could you clarify if this is the case please? I'd be interested (purely theoretically
) to know if and how this is disabled!I realise the ///M is a different beast to the rest of the range, but could anyone confirm if this information also relates to the 3.0si Coupe, which I have.
To add my tuppence worth on-topic; I've certainly found (admittedly in my non-M Coupe) the sport button to deliver a much sharper, and more precise throttle than with it off. I far prefer having it on when going for a spirited drive; the crispness of the revs when heel-and-toeing just makes it a pleasure to drive. I may be being a pedant, but I always turn it off if I get caught up in traffic, or whenever I'm in town or pottering, as I just don't want the Adaptive Throttle to reduce it's crispness! The sport mode is exclusively the fun mode!
Certainly interesting as regards the steering weighting up; I can't say I've noticed that yet, but I'll look out for it on my way home
Ed Doe said:Apologies for going slightly off-topic, but the above post mentions there is a torque limiter in 1st gear, and from how I read the post, it seems to imply that this relates to having the DSC on, or having the sport mode off? Could you clarify if this is the case please? I'd be interested (purely theoretically
I realise the ///M is a different beast to the rest of the range, but could anyone confirm if this information also relates to the 3.0si Coupe, which I have.
The torque limiter in 1st gear for the Z4M seems to be a permanent feature irrespective of whether the DSC and/or Sport Mode are on or off. It's simply a matter of fuelling in 1st gear is leaner under full load than it is in higher gears. I've not datalogged a 3.0si, but I expect that this will also be the same.
Another thread revival 
just spent 3 hours out in the Trough of Bowland on my own "playing" with the car , Scotland was great but with mrs w on board the Sport button was not required
It seems to have differing effects on different cars but in regards to my own car the Sport button makes a few noticeable differences .
1)Much easier to get off the mark quicker , as in raucously quick v v easily
2)Tootling on from 30-60 the car feels wired to mains electric when prodding the throttle ,
3)Nicer tone from the exhaust especially on overrun & most speciifically in 3rd accelerating from 30-50 then release the gas peddle
infectious little burble 
4) No need for the DSP Hi-Fi due to all above
Coupe drivers may want to override no 4) as they probably won't benefit from no 3 ) :roll:
just spent 3 hours out in the Trough of Bowland on my own "playing" with the car , Scotland was great but with mrs w on board the Sport button was not required It seems to have differing effects on different cars but in regards to my own car the Sport button makes a few noticeable differences .
1)Much easier to get off the mark quicker , as in raucously quick v v easily
2)Tootling on from 30-60 the car feels wired to mains electric when prodding the throttle ,
3)Nicer tone from the exhaust especially on overrun & most speciifically in 3rd accelerating from 30-50 then release the gas peddle
infectious little burble 4) No need for the DSP Hi-Fi due to all above
Coupe drivers may want to override no 4) as they probably won't benefit from no 3 ) :roll:
mr wilks said:Another thread revival
It seems to have differing effects on different cars but in regards to my own car the Sport button makes a few noticeable differences .
1)Much easier to get off the mark quicker , as in raucously quick v v easily
2)Tootling on from 30-60 the car feels wired to mains electric when prodding the throttle ,
3)Nicer tone from the exhaust especially on overrun & most speciifically in 3rd accelerating from 30-50 then release the gas peddle
4) No need for the DSP Hi-Fi due to all above
Coupe drivers may want to override no 4) as they probably won't benefit from no 3 ) :roll:
Yep to the first three for sure, though I don't have DSP
I like the way it makes the car feel more edgy all the time when the button is pressed - feels more like a sports car that requires thought when driving. Weird probably just in my head :wink:
P-Dub - you need to remove the CDV to improve that 1-2 change
Bing said:mr wilks said:Another thread revival
It seems to have differing effects on different cars but in regards to my own car the Sport button makes a few noticeable differences .
1)Much easier to get off the mark quicker , as in raucously quick v v easily
2)Tootling on from 30-60 the car feels wired to mains electric when prodding the throttle ,
3)Nicer tone from the exhaust especially on overrun & most speciifically in 3rd accelerating from 30-50 then release the gas peddle
4) No need for the DSP Hi-Fi due to all above
Coupe drivers may want to override no 4) as they probably won't benefit from no 3 ) :roll:
Yep to the first three for sure, though I don't have DSP
I like the way it makes the car feel more edgy all the time when the button is pressed - feels more like a sports car that requires thought when driving. Weird probably just in my head :wink:
P-Dub - you need to remove the CDV to improve that 1-2 change
And switch out the engine mounts for VT Competition engine mounts.
And consider changing the gearbox oil
BMWZ4MC said:Bing said:mr wilks said:Another thread revival
It seems to have differing effects on different cars but in regards to my own car the Sport button makes a few noticeable differences .
1)Much easier to get off the mark quicker , as in raucously quick v v easily
2)Tootling on from 30-60 the car feels wired to mains electric when prodding the throttle ,
3)Nicer tone from the exhaust especially on overrun & most speciifically in 3rd accelerating from 30-50 then release the gas peddle
4) No need for the DSP Hi-Fi due to all above
Coupe drivers may want to override no 4) as they probably won't benefit from no 3 ) :roll:
Yep to the first three for sure, though I don't have DSP
I like the way it makes the car feel more edgy all the time when the button is pressed - feels more like a sports car that requires thought when driving. Weird probably just in my head :wink:
P-Dub - you need to remove the CDV to improve that 1-2 change
And switch out the engine mounts for VT Competition engine mounts.
And consider changing the gearbox oil
need to do the GB and diff this year for me now i think.... however at 12k miles do i really need to??
