Southern Rail ...

pvr

pvr

Dutch
 Ruler of the South East UK
I just hope that karma will follow those strikers and that when they need assistance from any service, they will be let down as well.

Just surprised that May has not dealt with it - they just all need to be sacked like Reagan did with the traffic controllers strike and Thatcher with the miners.
 
pvr said:
I just hope that karma will follow those strikers and that when they need assistance from any service, they will be let down as well.

Just surprised that May has not dealt with it - they just all need to be sacked like Reagan did with the traffic controllers strike and Thatcher with the miners.
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PVR for president!!!
 
As a daily user of their "services" it is shocking :(

I am lucky that my boss understands and allows home working, normally only 1 day a week - but matters have been forced recently.

There was apparently a service last night - I wouldn't know though as they could give me no information about when a train going where I needed would show up, I cycled - thank gawd I've got that option though (also keeping me fit...)

They shouldve sacked the lot of 'em MONTHS ago...
 
gannet said:
As a daily user of their "services" it is shocking :(

I am lucky that my boss understands and allows home working, normally only 1 day a week - but matters have been forced recently.

There was apparently a service last night - I wouldn't know though as they could give me no information about when a train going where I needed would show up, I cycled - thank gawd I've got that option though (also keeping me fit...)

They shouldve sacked the lot of 'em MONTHS ago...
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Try sticking with biking to work!
I was cycling 40km/day, 20 there and back to a client every day last year when i was consulting for them. they didnt seem to mind me rocking up in shorts and a tshirt although i changed into 'smart attire' once there. easy peasy!
but i have to say it's a much safer prospect cycling in holland than it is in the UK maybe.
swings n roundabouts! :roll:
 
Chris_D said:
gannet said:
As a daily user of their "services" it is shocking :(

I am lucky that my boss understands and allows home working, normally only 1 day a week - but matters have been forced recently.

There was apparently a service last night - I wouldn't know though as they could give me no information about when a train going where I needed would show up, I cycled - thank gawd I've got that option though (also keeping me fit...)

They shouldve sacked the lot of 'em MONTHS ago...
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Try sticking with biking to work!
I was cycling 40km/day, 20 there and back to a client every day last year when i was consulting for them. they didnt seem to mind me rocking up in shorts and a tshirt although i changed into 'smart attire' once there. easy peasy!
but i have to say it's a much safer prospect cycling in holland than it is in the UK maybe.
swings n roundabouts! :roll:
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each way to cycle it all the way would be... 50+ miles a day through the london suburbs and back...
as it is I do 25 a day and that is about as much as I could manage without falling asleep at work...

yesterday, I had to be picked up by mrs gannet at Purley and then drive home, goodness only knows what time I've got home if using the trains only.
 
gannet said:
Chris_D said:
gannet said:
As a daily user of their "services" it is shocking :(

I am lucky that my boss understands and allows home working, normally only 1 day a week - but matters have been forced recently.

There was apparently a service last night - I wouldn't know though as they could give me no information about when a train going where I needed would show up, I cycled - thank gawd I've got that option though (also keeping me fit...)

They shouldve sacked the lot of 'em MONTHS ago...
Click to expand...
Try sticking with biking to work!
I was cycling 40km/day, 20 there and back to a client every day last year when i was consulting for them. they didnt seem to mind me rocking up in shorts and a tshirt although i changed into 'smart attire' once there. easy peasy!
but i have to say it's a much safer prospect cycling in holland than it is in the UK maybe.
swings n roundabouts! :roll:
Click to expand...
each way to cycle it all the way would be... 50+ miles a day through the london suburbs and back...
as it is I do 25 a day and that is about as much as I could manage without falling asleep at work...

yesterday, I had to be picked up by mrs gannet at Purley and then drive home, goodness only knows what time I've got home if using the trains only.
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hear u mate. ridiculous eh.
lived in london for 6 years and couldnt wait to get away in the end. my last job was working for a design consultancy in the city and it seemed my days were centred around the whole commuting lark and associated delays/problems. happy days. not.
but bein a northerner originally it wasn't such a wrench to escape the ratrace there.
good luck buddy!
 
Just listened to their "defense" for the strike, just hilarious. "Safety", in case of an accident, the driver would be dead and the conductor would have to save everyone :rofl:

What a joker, safety, my *rse. Sack them all and replace them all, hardly a challenging job.
 
trouble is dem unions don't listen to real life or the customers...

their other argument is that the conductors are better placed to spot someone hanging out the door before the train leaves... so all those cameras on every carriage can't do that... and er the door sensors would surely detect an unclosed door. no has to be somebody on the platform... purleeasse?!
 
I don't think it's as simple as opposing the strikes. The issue has been going on for years before strikes added to the issue. I'm no union fan at all, and personally don't agree with strikes typically - but there IS a safety issue here, if you commute on any of the busy southern stations you'll know its not safe for a driver with limited/no vision of the platform to decide when to pull away on rammed platforms. Only yesterday i waved the conductor down to stop the train leaving when the door hadn't fully shut (ladies bag and tassles hanging out). It's just the Govt using Southern as the spearhead so they can push the change through on other lines afterwards unopposed.

Sadly the unions are blind to the rest of the world and cant seem to figure out that by striking they're giving an excuse for the shoddy service., which is basically run by the DfT who are as much to blame as Southern/GTR and the Unions for causing this.

Oh well, i'm lucky - i can work-from-wherever-i-like and i'm at home happily taking the opportunity for daylight access to my cars to top up the oil on the C63 (which apparently is a thirsty motherfozker).
 
jimmybell said:
its not safe for a driver with limited/no vision of the platform to decide when to pull away on rammed platforms. Only yesterday i waved the conductor down to stop the train leaving when the door hadn't fully shut (ladies bag and tassles hanging out).
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Without seeing exactly what the driver can see through the cameras mounted on the outside of every carriage, I would actually wager they can see more than the conductor on the platform can - especially if the platform is not straight (as many are).

The unions are bleating on about how the driver operated doors are unsafe and ultimately the conductors jobs will go, yet the train companies have guaranteed those jobs for as long as they can (til end of contract/franchise). Driver operated trains are running perfectly well on other lines - equally as busy. why only kicking up such a fuss on Southern :headbang:
 
And now let's check what other countries do. Ah yes, automatic doors without anyone pressing buttons.

This is a typical union muscle flexing exorcise which is why IMO, the only way to deal with this is to get rid of them altogether, right now. They are a disgrace and should be replaced with a work force that is dynamic and not union driven.

They don't even have drivers at some of the connecting rail links that seem to work pretty well.
 
Sorry, you're simply wrong. You need to look into the issue much further before making a loose call on what's going on. Sadly you're doing as most are, and simply seeing the heavily one sided arguemnet put forward by the BBC, and the Govt, who seem to be getting the most publicity. Checkout the ABC (Association of British Commuters) on FB, the owners of the ongoing crowdsourced judicial review and the commuter protests.

Literally i detest the concept of unions and striking, but unless you live in a Southern metro station area, or on a core busy station you wont appreciate the risks. I should say the busier SW Trains stations in this situation work much more efficiently, they actually maintain the guard role and have had to add platform security/attendants to aid the situation. How can REMOVING staff be the answer, doors will just never get shut. It's all done with commercial interest for profit as priority, modernisation would involve adding better cameras not removing 1 member of staff.

The network is not designed for DOO, there are not sufficient cameras in place, and those that do have cameras they do not account for 12 carriage trains along huge curved stations. Bare in mind any issue with doors or safety will then involve the driver parking the train (so they cannot do anything until they reach the next station - nor communicate if comms break), locking and leaving the carriage and then walking to investigate (on one of the busiest lines in Europe), as opposed to someone who is dedicated for this. The guarantee is for a second onboard staff member, not a trained guard (safety/security/etc). not sure actually what that second person will be there to do other than check tickets if they aren't trained for more than that.

Frankly, having previously been a SW Trains commuter, the guards were actually very helpful, often the only people on the ground able to share information when things weren't working perfectly, and also the only person on very long trains that can actually do anything to help. Al that's really happening here is that dumb union leaders are giving the DfT the best possible excuse to hide behind for their failure to manage this franchise and explain away all the past 3 years terrible service.

As i understand it, existing DOO works on very strict lines where they're prepped for this (specifically nice new fancy thameslink ones).
 
A good sane reply. A welcome change from what appeared to Margaret Hilda (may she rot in hell) projecting her evil and destructive spirit.
 
You can't say I am simply wrong, I just have a different opinion about the situation than you have.

I compare train companies in all the countries that I travel to, and then I see what is going on over here on my own local trains. As usual, the British train system is lagging behind the European counterparts. It is not long ago that the slam door trains were finally phased out, there were dozens and dozens on a train and now there are more centralised doors, they suddenly can't control them anymore "safely" ?

I am forming my own opinion on something rather ridiculous, but you can't avoid the confused mumblings of union members versus rail specialists, no idea if they represent the companies or government departments. I tried explaining the issue to some US customers coming around, and it sounded even more pathetic when I tried to summarise it.

Gatwick Express is driver only, but a Southern train running on the same track, stopping at the same stations, suddenly would be unsafe in the same stations, with the same length trains.
 
Like it was mentioned,,, the other services run ok with this 10 year old "modern" idea. Rest of Europe as well. Unions do have a place in the working mans life where NEEDED and not just when they feel like holding other peoples customers to ransom to serve some long forgotten cause which most of them can"t remember. Unions should get with the times and work on what we need and stop the kindergarden politics.
Should be able by law to punish the Unions for piss poor behaviour and all at the same time as when 94% of their member already agree with the offer made 6 months ago
 
It's all too easy just to say " sack em' all " - I have no real sympathies with unions but they do protect some of the more vulnerable people - rank and file - from exploitation and dickensian workpractices - I don't profess to know all the details of the arguments in this case but I would be hard pressed to believe it's all political - the last time I used Southern was when we were returning home from Gatwick - the platforms were packed and a commuter was having a real go at a guard who had signaled the train to leave - the commuter thought he had deliberately let the train go without holding it back solely for him - he was threatening and obnoxious - the guard happened to be black and was really stressed out - no one should be subjected to such abuse - I spoke to the guard and said as much - he was grateful and surprised that someone took the time to support him - he told me I wouldn't believe how much abuse he takes at busy times.
 
sorry - i was referring to gannet's point about cameras in my first few words.

Gatwick express is very much a corner case here, you 100% cannot apply that to effectively any other situation. Trains run from LGW to Victoria, and invariably only stop at two stations, if ever - clapham junction and east croydon. both heavily manned stations with largely straight platforms.

DOO would work if trains werent overcrowded and hugely oversubscribed at peak times, and there was no hurry to squeeze on. If you visit any of the top 5 Southern stations during peak hours (i commute from 3 of them), without a guard handling the doors the train would just never leave - people will always try and f**k with the doors when unchecked.

I'm all for DOO, but Southern hasn't invested in any of the required infrastructure to enable it. This does exist where DOO exists, like the tube, DLR and newer thameslink services with purpose built modern platforms+trains.
 
And us poor bods in the south west have to open our own doors, get the tracks washed away when it rains and have 1 train an hour to London :cry:
 
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