Snow foam and clay!

R

RedLine

Member
I've always been somewhat sceptical of new things, but, after reading about both snow foam and clay bars I thought I'd give both a try.
The Zed got the snow foam treatment first. It was covered in tree pollen and had a distinct yellow tinge. After applying the foam I thought this seemed a quick way to ship several pounds for no benefit. Then, the magic happened! I was stunned at the way the foam stuck to the car and how all the dirt and pollen was lifted and swept away. Couldn't have thought it possible to make it so easy and somewhat quicker than a traditional wash.

So, it was on to the clay-bar. This time it was my car, the trusty Landy Freelander with 115k miles that got the clay treatment - I didn't want to risk the far newer Zed to this until I'd tried it. The Landy hadn't had a wash, never mind a wax for some time. This time a traditional wash, and then I stood there wondering what on earth is this going to do to my car and am I going to spend hours and expense for little or no improvement.

Not quite sure what I was supposed to be doing and how to do it, I gave a discrete application to one panel and I got a clay bar that quickly turned brown and a car with paintwork as smooth as it came out the showroom. For the second time in an hour I was stunned at the impact.

The rest of the car done in less than an hour and it was transformed. A good wax, and, apart from the stone chips that you get on a hard working high miler, it looks as good as the day I bought it with 8k miles on it. I wouldn't have thought it possible to so dramatically improve the look and finish with so little effort.

I am completely sold on both! Brilliant!
 
i only used a clay bar for the first time last month and i also couldn't believe how better the paint looked and felt :thumbsup:
 
I would not recommend claybar unless you do machine polishing after that. Claybar always makes damage for clearcoat, (swirls, scratches)..

My top tip.. use proper cleaning fluids instead of claybar to avoid swirl marks.
Usually before i do machine polishing i just wash it with petrol based solvant, and then de-tar & de-iron fluids. Not so much left for claybar..
 
AnttiO said:
I would not recommend claybar unless you do machine polishing after that. Claybar always makes damage for clearcoat, (swirls, scratches)..

My top tip.. use proper cleaning fluids instead of claybar to avoid swirl marks.
Usually before i do machine polishing i just wash it with petrol based solvant, and then de-tar & de-iron fluids. Not so much left for claybar..
Click to expand...

Not necessarily. Poor method or too harsh a clay bar will cause marring. As will the new clay mitts. Something like Bilt Hamber soft autoclay does not marr my paint work, so I am happy enough using a cleaner glaze and then sealing afterwards.

Also to point out, a petrol based solvent will remove old residues/polishing oils/LSPs (last stage products like waxes etc) but is highly unlikely to remove bonded on contaminants. It will also degrade your rubbers and plastics very quickly (dries them out).

The correct method should be rinse, snow foam, rinse, 2BM, rinse, IronX, TarX, wash, rinse, clay... and then on to your choice of polishing, glazing, cleaner fluids such as Werkstat Prime, sealing etc...
 
JAD said:
AnttiO said:
I would not recommend claybar unless you do machine polishing after that. Claybar always makes damage for clearcoat, (swirls, scratches)..

My top tip.. use proper cleaning fluids instead of claybar to avoid swirl marks.
Usually before i do machine polishing i just wash it with petrol based solvant, and then de-tar & de-iron fluids. Not so much left for claybar..
Click to expand...

Not necessarily. Poor method or too harsh a clay bar will cause marring. As will the new clay mitts. Something like Bilt Hamber soft autoclay does not marr my paint work, so I am happy enough using a cleaner glaze and then sealing afterwards.

Also to point out, a petrol based solvent will remove old residues/polishing oils/LSPs (last stage products like waxes etc) but is highly unlikely to remove bonded on contaminants. It will also degrade your rubbers and plastics very quickly (dries them out).

The correct method should be rinse, snow foam, rinse, 2BM, rinse, IronX, TarX, wash, rinse, clay... and then on to your choice of polishing, glazing, cleaner fluids such as Werkstat Prime, sealing etc...
Click to expand...

Totally agree, also using petrol or solvents like neat ipa can soften and damage your clearcoat :thumbsdown:
 
JAD said:
Not necessarily. Poor method or too harsh a clay bar will cause marring. As will the new clay mitts. Something like Bilt Hamber soft autoclay does not marr my paint work, so I am happy enough using a cleaner glaze and then sealing afterwards.
Click to expand...
I've had no problems with mitts or towels, I prefer the towels though. Following advice, I've used them on glass first before going near the paint to prepare them, then not had any issue at all with the paint using a stronger than normal shampoo or ONR wash solution bucket and keeping the surface nice and lubricated. Using a towel makes it so much quicker to clay, and I think I personally get much better results with far fewer missed spots. As with any clay, the key is not to put pressure on, let the friction do the work :)
 
Use common sense with solvants. I dont believe you do use claybar monthly? It is same thing with solvants. Basicly i clean paintwork in april/may after winter season (once / year)
Correct solvants dont do nothing bad for lacquer. And i cannot think any situation you use claybar or solvants but do not wax after it..?

Claybars were pop 5 years ago, modern solvants and cleaners do the same.
Show me one professional detailer who uses claybar without machine polishing.. :P
I am 100% sure if we polish paintwork in show condition and you rub with "soft clay" there will be damage and swirls. Normal washing will cause swirls (yep i know 2bucket method and snow foams + quality mitts... )
but you wont see it if you dont know what to look and how to look (proper lights).

I have done this kind of things almost 15years now and i have saw lot of different methods and things.
 
AnttiO said:
Use common sense with solvants. I dont believe you do use claybar monthly? It is same thing with solvants. Basicly i clean paintwork in april/may after winter season (once / year)
Correct solvants dont do nothing bad for lacquer. And i cannot think any situation you use claybar or solvants but do not wax after it..?

Claybars were pop 5 years ago, modern solvants and cleaners do the same.
Show me one professional detailer who uses claybar without machine polishing.. :P
I am 100% sure if we polish paintwork in show condition and you rub with "soft clay" there will be damage and swirls. Normal washing will cause swirls (yep i know 2bucket method and snow foams + quality mitts... )
but you wont see it if you dont know what to look and how to look (proper lights).

I have done this kind of things almost 15years now and i have saw lot of different methods and things.
Click to expand...

I'd just rather not risk it when the product I/the majority of detailers use is safer.

Cleaners still need a clay surface to lift bonded on contaminants... so unsure why the mention of cleaners? I presume we're talking the same language, i.e. Orchard Luminos and Werkstat Prime?

Soft clays can indeed be used without marring the paintwork, unless you've not decontaminated properly and thus are dragging tar spots around your paint work. As an example, have a look at Andy's work at http://www.abc-detailing.co.uk/ If the car is new/in immaculate condition already and doesn't need it, why unnecessarily remove clearcoat?

It's certainly down to personal experience, which I appreciate. And having run a detailing business with a friend before he bought me out of it a few years back so I could concentrate on my day job, believe me, I've tested the products under the Sun :thumbsup: Not quite your age, so can only offer 11 years of experience :poke:
 
MickAdams said:
JAD said:
Not necessarily. Poor method or too harsh a clay bar will cause marring. As will the new clay mitts. Something like Bilt Hamber soft autoclay does not marr my paint work, so I am happy enough using a cleaner glaze and then sealing afterwards.
Click to expand...

I've had no problems with mitts or towels, I prefer the towels though. Following advice, I've used them on glass first before going near the paint to prepare them, then not had any issue at all with the paint using a stronger than normal shampoo or ONR wash solution bucket and keeping the surface nice and lubricated. Using a towel makes it so much quicker to clay, and I think I personally get much better results with far fewer missed spots. As with any clay, the key is not to put pressure on, let the friction do the work :)
Click to expand...

Good to hear which ones you've been using chap - all down to personal experience as you say :thumbsup: I'd call you up on your coverage technique regarding the missed spots point but know that I'm and not infallible :poke: :rofl:
 
JAD said:
MickAdams said:
JAD said:
Not necessarily. Poor method or too harsh a clay bar will cause marring. As will the new clay mitts. Something like Bilt Hamber soft autoclay does not marr my paint work, so I am happy enough using a cleaner glaze and then sealing afterwards.
Click to expand...

I've had no problems with mitts or towels, I prefer the towels though. Following advice, I've used them on glass first before going near the paint to prepare them, then not had any issue at all with the paint using a stronger than normal shampoo or ONR wash solution bucket and keeping the surface nice and lubricated. Using a towel makes it so much quicker to clay, and I think I personally get much better results with far fewer missed spots. As with any clay, the key is not to put pressure on, let the friction do the work :)
Click to expand...

Good to hear which ones you've been using chap - all down to personal experience as you say :thumbsup: I'd call you up on your coverage technique regarding the missed spots point but know that I'm and not infallible :poke: :rofl:
Click to expand...
It's not so much technique that's lacking, it's time :oops: I'm fine doing smaller areas like a single panel, but doing the whole car takes quite a while and I start rushing. It's more of an issue on my bigger cars, but seeing as I'm happy with the towel I might as well use it on everything :)
 
MickAdams said:
It's not so much technique that's lacking, it's time :oops: I'm fine doing smaller areas like a single panel, but doing the whole car takes quite a while and I start rushing. It's more of an issue on my bigger cars, but seeing as I'm happy with the towel I might as well use it on everything :)
Click to expand...

Only :poke: of course, and completely agree with you, it's a seriously laborious process and the one I hate most (apart from carpets, hate hate hate, double hate, loathe entirely etc).

What are you using, Mick?
 
I have one of these http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/271871400840 after being recommended them as coming from the same factory making a lot of the towels places are branding as their own. I've had a look at some more expensive towels and couldn't feel any difference at all. I've had it since early last year and it still looks pretty much like new after doing 7 or 8 full cars with it, and the odd single panel a few times.

As I said, use it on the glass first, and keep everything well lubricated :)
 
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