Should I get an M in the mid to long term?

[Fred Smith]

I think I've concluded that a Z4MC is right up there on my list of cars I want to own... but realistically it's in competition with cheaper pure weekend classic cars and £30k of TVR 350C or similar, which I'm not going to be able to afford for years if ever.

I am very happy to own an E86 SE that I can daily and not worry about, and I think the next level of weekend car has to be on top of a cheap-ish to run E86 daily, not instead of... and if it's on top of then the sensible thing is to get something different.

The Z4MC is for when I can afford 4 cars or get bored of the E86 SE.

The car looks like it's going off the road for at least 2-3 months, maybe 6... rust treatment and protection underneath, rust spots on bodywork, chips, dings, small crack in front bumper, service, work out what parts around the wheels need changing, think about whether to switch from the 19" Veeman's on there now to the 18" MV2s I have had refurbed, think about whether I lower and if so do I do the dampers as well? I need to work out how to take out the one remaining foam sound deadener. And check out the two error codes and the bonnet senser, and driver side cup holder, and loads of other things.

 

[Fred Smith]

Given how this thread has gone I don't think you are ready for an M yet James!

I had 3.0Sis for over 5 years and loved them, but had started to lose the excitement when I drove them. Possibly having a 330i as a daily didn't help.

An unaccompanied test drive in an MC made my mind up for me. You aren't far from me so PM me if you do want a ride in one.

I think you are spot on.

I would love a ride in your MC (ideally unaccompanied, but all options gratefully received!) But no hurry... a Z4MC is 1-2 years away absolute minimum, and probably longer.

 

[Mr Tidy]

I think you are spot on.

I would love a ride in your MC (ideally unaccompanied, but all options gratefully received!) But no hurry... a Z4MC is 1-2 years away absolute minimum, and probably longer.

Based on my experience I wouldn't recommend trying an M until you feel ready for one. After my test drive I just knew I had to have one!

I'm sure we can sort something out, maybe at the Black Swan.

 

[Fred Smith]

I went there last time... met a friend there (owner of a very quik modern bmw estate, can't remember what)... very quiet... i was in the main car park.

 

[Pondrew]

I much more enjoy driving a 'slow' car fast and don't really have the skills or 'feel' to notice LSD's and whatnot. I just want to hoon around and have a giggle with a car that sings

I think most people do if they are honest.
Also, if it 'sounds' powerful then sub-consciously it is.
But this is a BMW forum. BMW make cars with quite a bit more power than needed, to compensate for the fact they are heavy, lumbering lumps of metal IMO.

I remember a couple of years ago getting out of my 360hp, 550nm 440i cab (at 1.8 tonnes dry) and getting into my wife's 120hp Mazda3, FWD 'shopping car' and feeling much more confident and happy in that. It just felt lighter (cos it was. A lot), more nimble and more 'fun' to drive.

Horsepower isn't everything. It's not even half of anything IMO. Look at the Elise. Probably revered as the ultimate sportscar of modern times. It started life with a crappy little Rover K series engine. My lawnmower has more HP, but the sum of the other parts (mainly lightness and decent suspension) made it extremely fun to drive.

 

[Pondrew]

I see you’ve met my missus

:rofl: :rofl:

 

[Mr Tidy]

I remember Mazda for making light bulbs, not cars!

Anyway it looks like a 2007-2009 2 litre petrol Mazda 3s weighed between 1320 to 1335kg so maybe 100kg lighter than an E85 3.0Si, unlike your lardy 440i.

 

[Pondrew]

I remember Mazda for making light bulbs, not cars!

Anyway it looks like a 2007-2009 2 litre petrol Mazda 3s weighed between 1320 to 1335kg so maybe 100kg lighter than an E85 3.0Si, unlike your lardy 440i.

Mazda made very light bulbs. oke: Get it? :lol:

The Mazda is twice the size of an E85, with 5 seats, so should be a LOT heavier but isn't. The Mazda was an example, not the epitomy of a 'driver's car'.

BMWs (and all German cars) are fecking heavy. It's just a 'thing'. I have a theory they started doing it to make them feel 'solid' and re-assuringly expensive.
Heavy cars don't make 'fun' cars to drive. They can be entertaining, mainly due to the huge power and RWD. I know the Germans have pretty much perfected the engineering to make them handle a lot better than they should, given the weight. But they are all still heavy. And having big heavy engines hanging over the front axle makes them less 'fun' to drive. That's just physics.

It sounds like I hate BMWs, so why do I own four of them? :lol:

 

[buzyg]

I remember Mazda for making light bulbs, not cars!

Anyway it looks like a 2007-2009 2 litre petrol Mazda 3s weighed between 1320 to 1335kg so maybe 100kg lighter than an E85 3.0Si, unlike your lardy 440i.

Indeed, but the Mx5 is a lite car. Get one with almost 200bhp and it's not slow either. Just a shame it sounds like a tractor and I can't comfortably drive it more that a few hundred miles or my right leg goes numb. (Oh I do miss my ///M at times.) :lol:

 

[True-Blue]

Don't hold your breath.... it may be years!

Any practical advice on how to persuade the owners of a variety of classic and more modern sports cars to let me test drive them? I don;t much like the idea of lying to private and trade sellers that I am seriously interested when I'd really be trying to rack up 30 test drives before actually starting to search hard?

Also... why test drive when the important thing is looks?
[/quote]

I’m guessing the final line here is joke? The best looking notch on my bedpost was an absolute nightmare; Poor performance, very high maintenance, some parts made of plastic, kept breaking down… but yeah, she was pretty :| :!:

How do you know if you’re seriously interested or not without test driving? :?

I’ve recently test driven a number of Porsche’s, hadn’t decided on Cayman or Boxster so tried both. The dealers I went to were more than happy to let me test drive them, as was a private seller.

‘I’m seriously considering ‘x’ but haven’t driven one yet, when can I come and view?’… not stringing anyone along, and your heart might make the decision for you once you’re behind the wheel.

If it takes you 30 test drives… it’s not the right car.

 

[Fred Smith]

If it takes you 30 test drives… it’s not the right car.

I meant if I'm looking at a Z4MC as a purely luxury / weekend car then it's up against every completely impractical sports car I can afford and there's a lot of nice ones to try!

I was joking about 30 test drives, though. Looks - joking, but I'd rather buy a car that is supposed to be good and I love the looks of, than one I find ugly but I have driven and enjoyed.

 

[Pondrew]

but I'd rather buy a car that is supposed to be good and I love the looks of, than one I find ugly but I have driven and enjoyed.

I had a car last year which was considered ugly by many (my wife wouldn't get in it) but was the best car to drive I have ever experienced. I give you the FK8......

 

[CliveN]

I am fortunate to have 4 BMWs. One with a mini engine, and ones with the B58, the N52 and the S54.

The B58 in the 2 Series chassis is sublime and super fast. But it’s not that engaging really. The N52 (like in a E86) is super smooth and sort of nice. The Mini engine is a rocket ship but again a little anodyne. The S54 is a complete animal…..

You can’t compare the 3.0Si and the ZM in my view. You buy the ZM for the S54. Simples. Okay it has LSD and four exhausts but it’s the motor that singles it out. As others have said, it’s the car to take out when you want to drive and feel alive and be part of the experience. For me, with limited experience (despite decades of trying), it’s border line terrifying. But that’s what is so good about it.

If you want to trundle and just have a good looking car, buy a 3.0si. If you want to feel as though you have bought something special, get a ZM. There is really nothing like it save a 2.7 Carrera R/S perhaps.

 

[Ed Doe]

I am fortunate to have 4 BMWs. One with a mini engine, and ones with the B58, the N52 and the S54.

The B58 in the 2 Series chassis is sublime and super fast. But it’s not that engaging really. The N52 (like in a E86) is super smooth and sort of nice. The Mini engine is a rocket ship but again a little anodyne. The S54 is a complete animal…..

You can’t compare the 3.0Si and the ZM in my view. You buy the ZM for the S54. Simples. Okay it has LSD and four exhausts but it’s the motor that singles it out. As others have said, it’s the car to take out when you want to drive and feel alive and be part of the experience. For me, with limited experience (despite decades of trying), it’s border line terrifying. But that’s what is so good about it.

If you want to trundle and just have a good looking car, buy a 3.0si. If you want to feel as though you have bought something special, get a ZM. There is really nothing like it save a 2.7 Carrera R/S perhaps.

Good post that. Agree there are still times when I find prodding the old s54 a bit terrifying! The way it revs is something to be enjoyed that's for sure!

 

[Mr Tidy]

Good post that. Agree there are still times when I find prodding the old s54 a bit terrifying! The way it revs is something to be enjoyed that's for sure!

I couldn't agree more.

That's what makes it feel so special.

 

[Z4MPower]

Purchased my blue 2006 M Roadster this past March .. 55K miles. Such a capable, head turning car. If you can get your hands on one, do it.

 

[BMWZ4MC]

I had a very interesting conversation with a NSW Highway Patrol Officer after enthusiastically taking my Zed to the red line in one too many gears. It really does encourage exuberant driving that can easily offend... In comparison, I can absolutely rag my 190bhp / 800kg Exige down a back road without exceeding the speed limit, and the rawness of the experience as well as its incredible agility makes it feel special at any speed.

Fred, have you considered a 4 cylinder Lotus Elise or Exige as an alternative? They offer the diminutive car that you're looking for, without needing intimidating power. They certainly won't cosset you or offer a numb experience. The running costs are minimal too. Mine is my daily driver in all but monsoon conditions and has been completely reliable for the 10k miles or so that I've owned it.

 

[Fred Smith]

Fred, have you considered a 4 cylinder Lotus Elise or Exige as an alternative? They offer the diminutive car that you're looking for, without needing intimidating power. They certainly won't cosset you or offer a numb experience. The running costs are minimal too. Mine is my daily driver in all but monsoon conditions and has been completely reliable for the 10k miles or so that I've owned it.

That's another question entirely!

This thread is about the fact that I love my cheap Z4 Coupe, and that in the mid to long term it would be nice to get a nicer one (primarily lower miles and perfect - in my eyes - colour scheme, and M-Sport seats not SE.) If I am going to consider a nicer one long term then it makes sense to consider the step up to an M.

I think I've concluded that the non-M suits me, and that were I to go for an M at some point in the future then arguably it should wait until I could buy one in addition to a standard E86, not instead, as they are very different cars.

An entirely separate question is "what pure sports cars are out there that I could get, if / when I am in a position to have a 100% weekend car?" I'd be very happy to consider an Elise or Exige (but think I'd probably go for something older).

 

[Ed Doe]

My [Exige] is my daily driver in all but monsoon conditions

Absolute hero 8) I'm jealous! Currently making do with a 320d Touring daily, I'd take an Exige any day, especially on the roads I take my toddler to and from nursery on!!

 

[Bing]

I drove a fellow forum member’s M up and down the Cheddar Gorge and I was hooked. I had to have one. I bought mine from PVR 10 years and 80k miles ago and have never once regretted it. Though he has :lol: . It’s my daily, and I have no real issues with that, though after a change of job it does not get driven anywhere near as much now.

I have had a 2.5, 3.0Si and the M. The M wins, and rightly so. It’s intoxicating to drive, and with the roof down through a tunnel or between the hedgerows at the red line it is aurally orgasmic. But you don’t need to red line it to have fun, just knowing the power is there is enough - I have had mine long enough that I can resist it’s goading.

Yes, they are much more expensive to run - though as PVR says the insurance is surprisingly cheap - and things like the bearing shells are £££. £1,100 to get mine done in May. Services likewise are not cheap. I pay my tax by direct debit and never pay attention to it - I only realised a couple of weeks ago it’s over £700 now

But even with all that cost - which fortunately I can afford by ignoring it - I couldn’t sell it. I’ve thought about it a few times but I just can’t. I have never come across another car (that I can afford) that I talks to me in the way my M does when I open the garage or look back at it after parking. I’d love a Carmine Red Porsche 911 Targa, but that’s just not happening anytime soon. On the rare occasions I manage to get out to drive my car properly on quiet twisty roads I fall in love with it again, every single time.

Drive one. I dare you :evil: