Should I get an M in the mid to long term?

[Mr Tidy]

While I'm spouting unpopular opinions, going from an 3.0Si to an Z4M is, um, a bit boring I'm afraid. There are so many interesting cars out there to experience - why replace an E85/6 with another E85/6?

I bought my 3.0Si Coupe because I loved the looks so an MC seemed the obvious next step, especially as there was nothing else that took my fancy without a huge hike in budget!

I'm not sure stricter ULEZ regulations will have much impact as most E85/86s aren't daily drivers these days.

Given that E46 M3 prices seem to have increased lately it's possible Z4M prices may follow that trend, but I'm not bothered either way - I bought mine to enjoy. :driving:

 

[pvr]

Uh - when did you get that one???

 

[Special Kay]

- I bought mine to enjoy. :driving:

I don't think you need any better explanation than that. Car ownership has never been logical, people have always persuaded themselves they need it. So just buy one and enjoy it. Quit the reasoning.

 

[Mr Tidy]

when did you get that one???

I bought my first 3.0Si in June 2014 and I've had my MC since December 2019, so it was pre-Covid price!

 

[pvr]

I am waiting for a 50k miler to return to the 11.5-12k mark where I expect it to be soon for the MR. The running costs with the mileage doesn’t worry me, on my first M over the 7 years I had it, the costs were minimal even at main dealer service prices.

 

[Mr Tidy]

It looks like that will happen. My MC cost a bit more than that, but it had done 76K.

I'm not sure about the minimal costs though! I had an overdue Inspection 2 done on mine by RBM soon after I got it. With a new cam-chain tensioner and a couple of suspension bushes that was a 4 figure bill. Followed by another for new bearing shells and engine mounts. Then an even bigger bill last month for an Inspection 1, new front discs, calipers and pads. RBM currently charge £550 for an Inspection 1 so I hate to think what a main dealer would charge (and wouldn't have much confidence on it being done properly either).

But I need the back brakes sorting once my credit card has recovered!

 

[Fred Smith]

Ed Doe - "the engine feels a lot more like it's straining at the leash if that makes any sense - just wants to be let loose at any opportunity!"

That sort of is what puts me off... the 3.0 is fast enough, do I want a car that is screaming at me to go faster (not least as I don't do track days and have no immediate plans to do so)?

Zedebee - "You missed a pretty big elephant off the “con” list, that is they cost significantly more to buy." But other things being equal you get more back when you sell, so it's merely a question of whether the cashflow is high enough to have £15k tied up instead of £7k

"Until you are ready to commit to a well sorted (and reassuringly expensive) car, then stick with what you’ve got." 100% - maybe in a couple of years... unless I end up taking a chance on a real cheap dodgy one...

Mr Tidy - "it's all about the soundtrack, 8,000 rpm red-line and sense of occasion every time I drive it". Again, the thing that puts me off is the idea that the real benefit comes with your foot to the floor... do I need a faster car than a 3.0 full stop, let alone one that is begging to be revved to hell and back.

Plenty - "While I'm spouting unpopular opinions, going from an 3.0Si to an Z4M is, um, a bit boring I'm afraid. There are so many interesting cars out there to experience - why replace an E85/6 with another E85/6?"

A very fair point of view. But for me I love the Z4 coupe shape. Two seater modern(ish) alternatives aren't appealing - never been a big Porsche fan and a lot of them are expensive... the Japanese stuff doesn't massively appeal, not getting a Merc, TVRs are more expensive again. Aston Martins are too expensive and too large.

I could get an Evo or Impreza, but I want a two seater RWD sports car really. Ideally significantly bigger than an MX-5, but ideally a touch smaller than a Z4C in preference to any bigger.

Z4MC makes sense on the basis that it's half the price of a TVR 350C and I don't wanna porsch or merc or 370Z and Astons are too big.

I suppose the answer to the question is "because a Z4MC is a perfect half-way step to £30k of TVR coupe from a similar time."

The other answer to the question might be... you have a massive point, and maybe I should be saying to myself "the Z4C scratches the modern, fairly practical, almost-classic" itch... forget another modern-ish coupe... next time go for a Caterham 7 or a 60s or 70s TVR or Marcos or Lotus, something very different again.

 

[plenty]

It's clear that rationally speaking, it's a no. What an MC offers vs a Z4C isn't relevant for you.

But we don't always own cars for rational reasons.

Shame you mentioned the Japanese stuff doesn't appeal, as otherwise I'd be suggesting you look into a GT86, 350Z or 370Z. Or a Jaguar XK X150, but they're a bit on the bulky side and you'd have to live with a slushbox.

 

[Ed Doe]

It sounds like you need a few more years to think on what you want tbh :lol:

To me getting an M over a regular e85/6 is a bit like getting a dog. If you assess it empirically it doesn't make sense, it's a lot of cost for a little more performance that as you rightly say you will likely use rarely. To assess the decision in this way doesn't quite address the 'heart over head' aspect of the decision. The intangible positives a dog (or an S54 to continue my feeble metaphor) brings to your life can't really be quanitifed as a cost/benefit.
Best thing for you to do is get a test drive in one and see how it makes you feel. If you're smitten and nothing else will do then you have your answer. There are plenty of alternative cars if the particular z4m formula is not quite what you're after.

 

[Abbas]

As others have said, I think it comes down to what kind of driver you are and what your needs are.

I've had a 3.0si in both roadster and Coupe form and now own a Z4M roadster. I generally don't really drive cars that hard as I drive within my pretty limited skillset so I think around town and for somewhat spirited driving it's not a massive difference to the 3.0 to be honest. You definitely feel much more torque low down but as I said you need the right road and the minerals to really wring it out and then it comes to life and it pulls like an absolute train and sounds brilliant. However so does the 3.0si in it's own way to be honest (especially once I took the foam out of the sound generator).

I'm glad I scratched my M itch, as otherwise I would always think 'what if'' My advice would be...

1. If this will be your only car like me and you will do mostly urban driving with a weekend thrash now and then - go for the 3.0si. It's much more pleasant to drive around town and more than fun enough on the weekend. As said, I also quite miss that outrageous howl it did in the cabin at about 4000RPM once you took the foam out.

2. If you're buying this is a weekend toy only, and have the funds to look after servicing and maintenance - 100% go for the M. It's a different animal and has an LSD and all the good stuff too. If mine was a weekend toy only, I would 100% get a fruity exhaust on it and a carbon intake as it totally transforms the car and for me an incredible soundtrack is half the joy of driving. It still sounds a bit tame for my taste when it's stock. Or get an intake atleast so you can hear those ITB's sing.

As a general note too, consider cars you've had previously and your skills and driving style. For what I'm comfortable with the M probably feels a bit too powerful for me. I always feel I'm holding back a bit. I'm sure it would be brilliant on track. The 3.0si was alot easier to wring out and keep in the power band without losing your license on public roads. After buying the M I have realised around 200-250hpish is the sweet spot for me and what I look for in a car. I much more enjoy driving a 'slow' car fast and don't really have the skills or 'feel' to notice LSD's and whatnot. I just want to hoon around and have a giggle with a car that sings

 

[Ed Doe]

Excellent post

Awful lot of truth to what Abbas said above I'd say that pretty neatly summarises my thoughts on the M vs si comparison too.

I do think honestly the M is a bit much for the road sometimes. If I didn't track mine then it would feel even more so too much - but being able to fully unleash it on track does mean I can resist the urge to drive it at maximum attack on the road, and just enjoy being in it.

The noise is another thing entirely when you get an eventuri, let alone a carbon airbox. My eventuri may well be for sale soon as I don't think I can resist the temptation any longer :lol:

 

[Fred Smith]

It's clear that rationally speaking, it's a no. What an MC offers vs a Z4C isn't relevant for you.

But we don't always own cars for rational reasons.

Shame you mentioned the Japanese stuff doesn't appeal, as otherwise I'd be suggesting you look into a GT86, 350Z or 370Z. Or a Jaguar XK X150, but they're a bit on the bulky side and you'd have to live with a slushbox.

To be fair I do like Japanese cars, and could live with a 350Z or 370Z... and the GT86 looks nicer still... but there's nothing that makes them appeal and I prefer the shape of the E86, and if I buy a sports car I do not want a 2+2/-.

An auto is a 100% no no, and I do not want a big car.

Ed Doe - "Best thing for you to do is get a test drive in one and see how it makes you feel. If you're smitten and nothing else will do then you have your answer." I think that quite simply nails it!

 

[salfer]

To me, it’s not about performance, running costs or resale, it’s about how a particular car makes me feel.

I’ve been a decades long Porsche guy and still have a 997S, a 1970 911S and in the past few years I’ve added a 1M and an E86 M.

Out off all my cars, the E86M makes me feel excited each time I plan to drive and never disappoints. So much so that the others hardly get a second glance except my daily car, my 1988 Peugeot 205 GTi Mi16.

OP, you won’t find a definitive answer here as everything is subjective, so drive everything on your list and buy the one that makes you feel the best.

Look forward to seeing what you end up with.

Cheers.

 

[Fred Smith]

As others have said, I think it comes down to what kind of driver you are and what your needs are.

I've had a 3.0si in both roadster and Coupe form and now own a Z4M roadster. I generally don't really drive cars that hard as I drive within my pretty limited skillset so I think around town and for somewhat spirited driving it's not a massive difference to the 3.0 to be honest. You definitely feel much more torque low down but as I said you need the right road and the minerals to really wring it out and then it comes to life and it pulls like an absolute train and sounds brilliant. However so does the 3.0si in it's own way to be honest (especially once I took the foam out of the sound generator).

I'm glad I scratched my M itch, as otherwise I would always think 'what if'' My advice would be...

1. If this will be your only car like me and you will do mostly urban driving with a weekend thrash now and then - go for the 3.0si. It's much more pleasant to drive around town and more than fun enough on the weekend. As said, I also quite miss that outrageous howl it did in the cabin at about 4000RPM once you took the foam out.

2. If you're buying this is a weekend toy only, and have the funds to look after servicing and maintenance - 100% go for the M. It's a different animal and has an LSD and all the good stuff too. If mine was a weekend toy only, I would 100% get a fruity exhaust on it and a carbon intake as it totally transforms the car and for me an incredible soundtrack is half the joy of driving. It still sounds a bit tame for my taste when it's stock. Or get an intake atleast so you can hear those ITB's sing.

As a general note too, consider cars you've had previously and your skills and driving style. For what I'm comfortable with the M probably feels a bit too powerful for me. I always feel I'm holding back a bit. I'm sure it would be brilliant on track. The 3.0si was alot easier to wring out and keep in the power band without losing your license on public roads. After buying the M I have realised around 200-250hpish is the sweet spot for me and what I look for in a car. I much more enjoy driving a 'slow' car fast and don't really have the skills or 'feel' to notice LSD's and whatnot. I just want to hoon around and have a giggle with a car that sings

I think that last paragraph may be where I am.

I think that maybe for me the Z4C is the perfect car in that it is a great fun weekend car for someone who doesn't do a lot of miles and doesn't want a driving ban - whilst also working as a urban "daily" (it even did a garden waste trip to the dump last weekend).

A Z4MC is something I should only consider as a pure luxury weekend car in the same way a 1960s TVR would be.

 

[Fred Smith]

To me, it’s not about performance, running costs or resale, it’s about how a particular car makes me feel.

I’ve been a decades long Porsche guy and still have a 997S, a 1970 911S and in the past few years I’ve added a 1M and an E86 M.

Out off all my cars, the E86M makes me feel excited each time I plan to drive and never disappoints. So much so that the others hardly get a second glance except my daily car, my 1988 Peugeot 205 GTi Mi16.

OP, you won’t find a definitive answer here as everything is subjective, so drive everything on your list and buy the one that makes you feel the best.

Look forward to seeing what you end up with.

Cheers.

Don't hold your breath.... it may be years!

Any practical advice on how to persuade the owners of a variety of classic and more modern sports cars to let me test drive them? I don;t much like the idea of lying to private and trade sellers that I am seriously interested when I'd really be trying to rack up 30 test drives before actually starting to search hard?

Also... why test drive when the important thing is looks?

 

[Abbas]

As others have said, I think it comes down to what kind of driver you are and what your needs are.

I've had a 3.0si in both roadster and Coupe form and now own a Z4M roadster. I generally don't really drive cars that hard as I drive within my pretty limited skillset so I think around town and for somewhat spirited driving it's not a massive difference to the 3.0 to be honest. You definitely feel much more torque low down but as I said you need the right road and the minerals to really wring it out and then it comes to life and it pulls like an absolute train and sounds brilliant. However so does the 3.0si in it's own way to be honest (especially once I took the foam out of the sound generator).

I'm glad I scratched my M itch, as otherwise I would always think 'what if'' My advice would be...

1. If this will be your only car like me and you will do mostly urban driving with a weekend thrash now and then - go for the 3.0si. It's much more pleasant to drive around town and more than fun enough on the weekend. As said, I also quite miss that outrageous howl it did in the cabin at about 4000RPM once you took the foam out.

2. If you're buying this is a weekend toy only, and have the funds to look after servicing and maintenance - 100% go for the M. It's a different animal and has an LSD and all the good stuff too. If mine was a weekend toy only, I would 100% get a fruity exhaust on it and a carbon intake as it totally transforms the car and for me an incredible soundtrack is half the joy of driving. It still sounds a bit tame for my taste when it's stock. Or get an intake atleast so you can hear those ITB's sing.

As a general note too, consider cars you've had previously and your skills and driving style. For what I'm comfortable with the M probably feels a bit too powerful for me. I always feel I'm holding back a bit. I'm sure it would be brilliant on track. The 3.0si was alot easier to wring out and keep in the power band without losing your license on public roads. After buying the M I have realised around 200-250hpish is the sweet spot for me and what I look for in a car. I much more enjoy driving a 'slow' car fast and don't really have the skills or 'feel' to notice LSD's and whatnot. I just want to hoon around and have a giggle with a car that sings

I think that last paragraph may be where I am.

I think that maybe for me the Z4C is the perfect car in that it is a great fun weekend car for someone who doesn't do a lot of miles and doesn't want a driving ban - whilst also working as a urban "daily" (it even did a garden waste trip to the dump last weekend).

A Z4MC is something I should only consider as a pure luxury weekend car in the same way a 1960s TVR would be.

I loved my E86, that's actually one of the cars I quite miss owning. I'd 100% have one of those over a newer F-type and other cars in a similar class. So I think an E86M would be a fantastic, fantastic machine and if soft top's dont really float your boat I can't see why you'll ever need anything else to get your thrills.

Also as someone who uses his M for mundane stuff around town 90% of the time, I actually average 1mpg better than my 3.0si did. A gigantic total of 21mpg compared to 20

If this will be your only car I'd probably lean more towards a 3.0si for reasons stated but I'd definitely recommend a test drive in one just so you know for sure. Or even sit in with someone from here. I'm quite far away from you but there should be a few close to you. Only owning and driving an M has made me realise what I look for when it comes to driving enjoyment on a b road. If I had the funds I'd have a wafter as a daily and I'd make my Z4M into an absolute weapon like this guy > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LpPkke1qGXQ&t=203s

 

[bigwinn]

Please consider that if you believe a non-M is 90% of an M then also consider that your girlfriend/boyfriend/mistress/wife shares 98.8% of their DNA with a chimp

I think in that case, even that 1.2% makes a huge difference (to me - your choices may differ).

I see you’ve met my missus

 

[buzyg]

Please consider that if you believe a non-M is 90% of an M then also consider that your girlfriend/boyfriend/mistress/wife shares 98.8% of their DNA with a chimp

I think in that case, even that 1.2% makes a huge difference (to me - your choices may differ).

I love this analogy. The ///M is indeed a completely different animal to the 3ltr cars. :driving:

 

[Special Kay]

Please consider that if you believe a non-M is 90% of an M then also consider that your girlfriend/boyfriend/mistress/wife shares 98.8% of their DNA with a chimp

I think in that case, even that 1.2% makes a huge difference (to me - your choices may differ).

I see you’ve met my missus

That's killed me :rofl: :rofl:

 

[Mr Tidy]

Given how this thread has gone I don't think you are ready for an M yet James!

I had 3.0Sis for over 5 years and loved them, but had started to lose the excitement when I drove them. Possibly having a 330i as a daily didn't help.

An unaccompanied test drive in an MC made my mind up for me. You aren't far from me so PM me if you do want a ride in one.