Service History Red Flags - Opinion

[where.is.lee]

Hi all,

I've been on the hunt for a z4/m for a while and have tried to read through various similar threads regarding reasonable service history. I've recently come across a z4m which has "Full Service History (6/7 stamps)" however only 3 services (mix of Insp 1 & 2) in their last 11 years of ownership over 40K miles. The reason for this was the owner was told by the indie to follow the indicators on the dash. Would this be considered acceptable practice or considered a red flag regarding service history?

 

[DevonPaul]

Were there any intermediate oil changes or checks done, are there any invoices or receipts?

Is it private or trade sale - if trade then the previous owner might have had intermediate oil changes but not recorded them in the book (which reminds me, I need to take our service book to the local indy to get the oil service added that he did last month).

You don't say about the actual mileage, but with this owner it looks like an Ins1 or 2 every 12,000 miles, which suggests serviced on mileage, but Inspections instead of oil services.

I'd be tempted to look at the car as a whole, does the interior match the mileage, are the tyres a good brand and fairly recent, are all the undertray and wheelarch clips intact or bodged with cable ties, etc to see how loved it has been.

Paul

 

[plenty]

If there is no other evidence of work done during the period then this does suggest a not hugely knowledgeable owner.

Wouldn't be a deal-breaker for me if everything else checks out, but I'd definitely use it as price-negotiation leverage.

 

[plenty]

<duplicate post>

 

[Taz]

As the car been off the road?

I see no point in servicing and mot'ing a car that's not just parked up in a garage

 

[hopz121]

Huge red flag for me. I wouldn't touch it personally but each to there own.

Even servicing a car every 2 years is fair to long IMO.

If you do go for it factor in a vanos overhaul and bottom end bearings change as a precaution.

Bear in mind you may have issues if you ever decide to sell the car as well.

Good Luck

 

[plenty]

I always look at a used-car holistically. Other than VCAR very little is an absolute deal-breaker for me if everything else is right and it's priced accordingly.

I bought my Z4M with 115k miles and it's in superb condition. Another car I own has had 13 previous owners.

If you want a collector-grade example and are paying top dollar then of course you want everything to be perfect, but some excellent cars and excellent deals can be had if you're willing to compromise on some things.

 

[john-e89]

Huge red flag for me. I wouldn't touch it personally but each to there own.

Even servicing a car every 2 years is fair to long IMO.

If you do go for it factor in a vanos overhaul and bottom end bearings change as a precaution.

Bear in mind you may have issues if you ever decide to sell the car as well.

Good Luck

Even if it's serviced every year it could have been thrashed to death on every trip from cold and red lined whenever possible on the thinking that regular oil changes will look after it. This service paranoia about M's is misleading.

As plenty says surely far better to go on the overall condition rather than a book full of stamps..?

 

[where.is.lee]

Thanks all for your responses. I have looked at the car and it is a bit of a garage queen, paint and interior is in great condition and match the mileage, if not better, however it's the lack of oil changes between Inspection services which has kind of thrown me. It is a private sale and only 3 inspection service receipts + MOTs spanning the 11 year ownership. No preventative work has been done and tyres are 10+ years old. I'm the kind of person that looks at condition + history over number of owners/mileage (my last few cars have been 180k+ km) but this one has me truly baffled knowing how much potential care a S54 requires regardless of mileage.

 

[hopz121]

All cars need looking after but an M even more so, the fact it hasn’t been serviced properly, has 10 year old tyres fitted to it and has had no preventative maintenance done doesn’t scream out a well kept car to me! I expect it hasn’t been warmed up properly ever on that old oil which has started to degrade!

You could be buying a good car but you could also be buying a car which needs a fair bit of work to bring it up to scratch too. They aren’t cheap to maintain as I am sure you are aware.

There will be plenty of other cars about, it’s really down to you really. I usually go off of my gut and it usually works out.

 

[hopz121]

Huge red flag for me. I wouldn't touch it personally but each to there own.

Even servicing a car every 2 years is fair to long IMO.

If you do go for it factor in a vanos overhaul and bottom end bearings change as a precaution.

Bear in mind you may have issues if you ever decide to sell the car as well.

Good Luck

Even if it's serviced every year it could have been thrashed to death on every trip from cold and red lined whenever possible on the thinking that regular oil changes will look after it. This service paranoia about M's is misleading.

As plenty says surely far better to go on the overall condition rather than a book full of stamps..?

Very true but someone who services a car every year is very unlikely to do that, I’d say the complete opposite to be honest.

You buy on loads of factors, service history is just one of those factors.

 

[Mr Tidy]

I think this has come about because a less than well informed owner has been given bad advice by the Indy. Ms only display the mileage to the next service but later BMW models like my E90 3 Series display mileage and the month & year which may be what the Indy was thinking of.

If the car got an Inspection service every 3 years or so and didn't do many miles between them it may be worth a punt at the right price, but as someone said you'll have the same problem when you come to sell it. Although the longer you kept it and got it serviced on time I suppose it would be less of an issue.

At the end of the day it depends how much of a risk you are prepared to take!

Despite not many Ms getting sold in the UK there always seem to be quite a few for sale.

 

[john-e89]

Huge red flag for me. I wouldn't touch it personally but each to there own.

Even servicing a car every 2 years is fair to long IMO.

If you do go for it factor in a vanos overhaul and bottom end bearings change as a precaution.

Bear in mind you may have issues if you ever decide to sell the car as well.

Good Luck

Even if it's serviced every year it could have been thrashed to death on every trip from cold and red lined whenever possible on the thinking that regular oil changes will look after it. This service paranoia about M's is misleading.

As plenty says surely far better to go on the overall condition rather than a book full of stamps..?

Very true but someone who services a car every year is very unlikely to do that, I’d say the complete opposite to be honest.

You buy on loads of factors, service history is just one of those factors.

I've been in the motortrade mechanicing side Hopz, believe me a full service history means next to nothing, folk rag cars as they think it's ok to do so with regular oil changes protecting the engine, there are plenty out there that have zero mechanical knowledge or care about it. The point I'm making is this car by the OP doesn't mean a red flag by any means, as you quite rightly say yourself buy on overall condition, but a book full of stamps really isn't the holy grail it would appear to be and needn't put a potential buyer off.

That was until this one had 10yr old tyres on anyway..... :lol:

 

[hopz121]

Even if it's serviced every year it could have been thrashed to death on every trip from cold and red lined whenever possible on the thinking that regular oil changes will look after it. This service paranoia about M's is misleading.

As plenty says surely far better to go on the overall condition rather than a book full of stamps..?

Very true but someone who services a car every year is very unlikely to do that, I’d say the complete opposite to be honest.

You buy on loads of factors, service history is just one of those factors.

I've been in the motortrade mechanicing side Hopz, believe me a full service history means next to nothing, folk rag cars as they think it's ok to do so with regular oil changes protecting the engine, there are plenty out there that have zero mechanical knowledge or care about it. The point I'm making is this car by the OP doesn't mean a red flag by any means, as you quite rightly say yourself buy on overall condition, but a book full of stamps really isn't the holy grail it would appear to be and needn't put a potential buyer off.

That was until this one had 10yr old tyres on anyway..... :lol:

Exactly the Tyres would be the final nail in the coffin for me!

 

[brillomaster]

10 year old tyres probably means the car is barely driven and when it is driven, its not driven very hard. if you dont drive hard enough to wear out tyres, and they've still got tread on, then why replace them? what make of tyres are they? i'd be more worried if the tyres were nearly bald or wearing unevenly, or if the owner had just fitted new cheap tyres.

when i bought my boxster it had tyres that were 5 years and 7 years old on... getting on a bit in age, but they were matching michelin PS2s with plenty of tread, so i took that as a good sign. I've since replaced them with brand new accelera 651 sports, which are probably worse than the tyres i had on before (see note above about new cheap tyres... :roll: )

personally, i'd go for it, just factor in the cost of a full service and 4 new tyres when you buy it.

 

[Scubaregs]

Tyre manufacturers recommend a tyre life of 6/7 years. Tyres harden with age, they may look fine tread wise, but they will not grip anywhere near as well.

 

[Simon 3.2M]

All depends on price of the car really - I actually buy my cars in feel and less on history. We all know it’s only a piece of paper, as mentioned it could have been thrashed and it may not have actually had the servicings done and the book stamped by an unscrupulous garage. I don’t subscribe to the vanos / bearing paranoia either - if you thrash your cars or track them then yes, do the bearings, for everyday driving I wouldn’t panic too much initially other than doing an obligatory oil change. The key, like with all engines, is letting them get to full operating temperature before playing. Again with the vanos, unless it bogs down massively then just be aware of it as it only really affects around 3k rpm. Yes it is noticeable, especially when you drive a car with the vanos refreshed, but it shouldn’t stop you enjoying the car and it feeling pretty quick.

 

[pvr]

Tyre manufacturers recommend a tyre life of 6/7 years. Tyres harden with age, they may look fine tread wise, but they will not grip anywhere near as well.

I agree, but was surprised the Porsche dealer passed my 8 year old fronts as absolutely fine. For the warranty, the tyre sealant has to be no more than 4 years old but the tyres can be way more. Does help that my tyres never see sunlight of course when not being driven.

 

[MikeyH]

Are they Vamptires :rofl: :rofl:

 

[pvr]

Are they Vamptires :rofl: :rofl:

Wrong thread oke: