Second Scottish IndyRef
- Thread starter PerryGunn
- Start date
I wasn't trying to exclude anyone Craig, it was just skelters and AlfaScozzesi had been the ones making the posts suggesting that, because of Scotland voting 'Remain' in the EU Referendum, Independence was now a foregone conclusion....craig3.2 said:
Clearly the 'outers' think the 'stay inners' majority vote doesn't matter. Maybe they should look up the definition of democratic vote. You can't keep asking for more and more referendums until you hope a vote will go your way. Scotlands vote to stay part of the U.K. didn't have a caveat of being part of the eu.
Carol M said:
Unfortunately Carol, that's the problem with a minority of pro independence voters, they, just like Nicola Sturgeon want it to keep happening until they get their way. That's no longer a democracy.
I pass this hole, everyday http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/court-rules-independence-camp-cannot-be-evicted-from-holyrood-1-4119971 which is set to remain into either eventually evicted or they get independence.
After the first one, Alex Salmond said
"I accept that verdict of the people and I call on all of Scotland to follow suit in accepting the democratic verdict of the people of Scotland."
He also advised during the whole campaign that there wouldn't be another vote if the vote was to stay with the union, well not for at least another 18 years (not sure the significance in that m, brain washing perhaps) He then resigned and Nicola Sturgeon put another vote into her manifesto basically straight away......now forgive me but that sounds like what Alex Salmond said was a lie, a blatant lie. It wasn't if things change, it was we won't call it for at least another generation.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scottish-independence/11095188/Alex-Salmond-pledges-no-second-Scottish-referendum.html
Re the caveat part, Scotland becoming independent was based on them still being in the EU. it couldn't be confirmed that an independent Scotland would be automatically accepted as they wouldn't have been so people argue that for Scotland to have stayed in the EU they needed to stick with he rest of the U.K. That is true, however at the time the EU referendum was not even on the table so people are now peddling the fact we are now leaving the EU and No voters in Scotland were lied to when it wasn't even something to consider at the time.
Angie4m said:craig3.2 said:
Because those two started banging on about it as soon as it was a leave vote in other threads.
In fact in one thread where we have been told it is happening, I questioned says who and quoting the 'it's on the table and needs to be discussed' to be told 'says me' so that'll be the gospel then!
Its been reported in the press that if it was to happen they would want to make sure there was an appetite to win it, currently doesn't seem to be and it would possibly be 2020 before it would happen. Plus we'll be out the EU, we wouldn't just get back in, where's the money coming from? What currency will we use etc........basically the same questions from before that they (the SNP) couldn't answer really.
The majority of what I've read is useless guff spouted by others who have talked/typed so much of it that they actually believe that the made up bull in their heads is fact. They'd do well in politics cause they also live in fantasy lands and twist everything to their own agenda.
It's quite a dangerous topic really as it does bring out the worst in people especially those who'll claim they aren't 'anti English' but 'pro scottish' so it seems to make it alright to make bigoted and archaic comments. There is no need for it, there is no room for it on here or outside in the real world.
I too was like you Craig and had voted SNP for over 10 years but after the last referendum I started to question some of their policies and logic and until they can give proper answers to pretty difficult questions I'm not voting for them again.
I agree,angie4m.....with your points above,and exactly what I was saying/meaning,re the SNP policies not making enough sense,or no proper answers to questions such as where will you get enough money to pay for an Independant Scotland,without have tax rises and public spending cuts.
Nice to have a grown up debate,as some people do get carried away,as you say,it brings the worst out in people
craig3.2 said:
You can lay the blame for the parlous state of UK finances at the feet of one certain Scottish MP, representing the Dunfermline East constituency, namely Gordon Brown. He sold our gold reserves at rock bottom prices, he made a raid on pensions and spent the bloody lot in creating the "Client State".
PerryGunn said:
Ooh just saw all this! Getting very heated which I don't think was meant. If I was banging on it was to say that another independence referendum was almost a foregone conclusion but that was no secret. The SNP exist to achieve independence for Scotland and so they were always going to turn it around this way. As I have said in my earlier post I don't think she will call it until she has the polls firmly in her favour as the SNP can't afford to lose again. At the moment there are definately more people willing to vote for independence after Thursday but whether this would actually materialise in an independence vote is another thing. The SNP did well at the last Scottish elections but this was based on people thinking there would not be another independence referendum for "at least a generation" and no matter what side of the fence you sit they fight for Scotland and Scottish issues better than all the subsidiary Scottish parties who are told what to say by the parent parties.
All my other thoughts and rhetoric are on other threads but wasn't meant to be decisive but only my personnel thoughts on the current issues.
AlfaScozzesi said:PerryGunn said:
Ooh just saw all this! Getting very heated which I don't think was meant. If I was banging on it was to say that another independence referendum was almost a foregone conclusion but that was no secret. The SNP exist to achieve independence for Scotland and so they were always going to turn it around this way. As I have said in my earlier post I don't think she will call it until she has the polls firmly in her favour as the SNP can't afford to lose again. At the moment there are definately more people willing to vote for independence after Thursday but whether this would actually materialise in an independence vote is another thing. The SNP did well at the last Scottish elections but this was based on people thinking there would not be another independence referendum for "at least a generation" and no matter what side of the fence you sit they fight for Scotland and Scottish issues better than all the subsidiary Scottish parties who are told what to say by the parent parties.
All my other thoughts and rhetoric are on other threads but wasn't meant to be decisive but only my personnel thoughts on the current issues.
to be fair you've not been that bad with the banging on but that's a really rational post. If only others could do the same.My points were more towards the other two that have been a crusade. Not sure who I mean? First two pages should cover it.
AlfaScozzesi said:
+1 was glad to get near the end of this thread and find some level headed thoughts!
Angie4m said:
My points were more towards the other two that have been a crusade. Not sure who I mean? First two pages should cover it.
So because we disagree I'm on "a crusade"? Pathetic.
