Refurbing my 108's myself

[a11y]

Thanks again, a kit made up from Merlin to do the whole job is ideal. I've already got the 12-point star bits ready to do this. And just remembered I've got a Black & Decker Quattro power tool thing that'll help, never gets used

IIRC you didn't lacquer yours at first, but then had issues with salt going straight through the wax on the lips? What lacquer did you then use afterwards once you'd tidied them up again? Once I tidy my wheels up, the last thing I want is a lacquer breaking down issue through using crap stuff or the wrong type of lacquer!

My only other issue is removing the kerbing marks (previous owner!) which I plan to use a very rough grade of sanding paper beforehand. Hopefully won't have to resort to anything more brutal than that.

 

[cj10jeeper]

Yep - Merlin thought quality wax would work, but this Winter was savage on road salt, so I had to quickly pull them to bits reshine the lips and sprayed with Halfords clear coat (Lesson learnt). I don't think it matters what you use as they will all deteriorate in a couple of years with water creep in minor marks, around the edges, etc. I can however now redo all 4 in no more than 2 hours with the kit, tools and expertise to hand.

Do call Merlin. I found them on Ebay but they are specialist metal polishing suppliers. Really helpful but they talk a strange language about Vienna Lime, mops, bar polishes, etc.

Small kerb marks can easily be sanded to reprofile them out. Major dings would need a pro to weld them or rather crude filler (which of course can't be polished).

 

[a11y]

Cool, cheers. When I call Merlin I'll just tell them what I'm intending doing and mention your kit. I think I've found the kit on their website, appears to be the same contents as in your guide topic, for £16.50.

I've gone off powder-coating my alloys - the polished lip just looks much better. My centres are OK too so it's only the rims/lips that need the TLC.

 

[Mr Whippy]

Get a good laquer for use ontop of polished metals, rather than laquer for ontop of normal paints.

There are special laquers in both 2k and 1k for going ontop of polished metals and I'm sure the performance is better since they actually offer these specialist laquers!

1k
http://www.frost.co.uk/item_Detail.asp?productID=7939&frostProductName=Eastwoods%20Clear%20%20-%20Gloss%20Finish%20for%20Bare%20Metal%20Surfaces%20(312g)&catID=24&frostCat=Painting&frostSubCat=Eastwood&subCatID=32

2k
http://www.wheelpaints.co.uk/category_Clearcoats_1.htm (CA LAK)

And as noted before, if you are doing your centres
http://www.wheelpaints.co.uk/product_details_7.htm (Deutsche Silver (OEM for these wheels iirc))



Then go over the top with a 1k or 2k laquer for use ontop of paints

http://www.wheelpaints.co.uk/category_Aerosol_clearcoat_Primers_1.htm

or

http://www.frost.co.uk/item_Detail.asp?productID=7938&frostProductName=Eastwoods%20Clear%20-%20Gloss%20for%20Painted%20Surfaces%20(312g)&catID=24&frostCat=Painting&frostSubCat=Eastwood&subCatID=32


Dave

 

[Mr Whippy]

I've gone off powder-coating my alloys - the polished lip just looks much better. My centres are OK too so it's only the rims/lips that need the TLC.

Powdercoating never looks as nice as proper wet paints because the build is high and gets lumpy, and since that is lumpy the wet special coats are lumpy, and then the top-coat clear is lumpy, so you never get super sharp reflections/highlights in the laquer. Many may never notice, but you can't really cut it back smooth either because the lumps are really big in paint terms. The laquer is technically smooth in micro scale, the actual topography of the underlying paint is what is lumpy in a more macro scale!

I really want to avoid powdercoating for those reasons. It's not really designed for normal road car wheels, it's more for heavy duty/toughness on 4x4's and so on.

What gives you an idea of the time/attention to detail is that the powdercoaters will do mine in a day at £80 each, while the wet painter will want them for 9 days and charge £90 each.
That tells me the wet painters are going to spend more time doing a better process! ( www.steve-edwards.com seen his work before and it is, imho, superior to oem, and he is highly recommended, just not cheap when you consider £200 for old 107's and £380 recon = nearly £600, and brand new 107's from BMW are £850! )

Dave

 

[a11y]

Dave

Go on then, what's the difference between 1k and 2k lacquers then? I've got zero knowledge of these and you've just confused me further over what lacquer I should use for my wheels...

Also, what quantity I'd need for doing 4 wheels?

Cheers
Ally

 

[Mr Whippy]

Dave

Go on then, what's the difference between 1k and 2k lacquers then? I've got zero knowledge of these and you've just confused me further over what lacquer I should use for my wheels...

Also, what quantity I'd need for doing 4 wheels?

Cheers
Ally

1k and 2k is just like say UHU glue and Araldyte, one is a one part and one is a two part.

2k is what most spray shops will use as it's fast to dry to a very hard level, is very hard wearing and good chemical resistance etc, just it's harder to use needing mixing and cleaning form your gun etc... you can't get an aerosol tin of it for example.
The main reason it's used really is speed. You can clear a load of wheels in a booth, leave them an hour, take them out and they are rock hard and can be cut back etc right away. That means fast turnaround and a good long lasting finish. It really is the best of all worlds apart from the kit to use it...

1k can come in tins as you have seen, but it takes longer to go off, so needs to be kept away from dust for maybe 12hrs, kept warm, and doesn't fully harden for a few days, so no fitting tyres on it for a while otherwise it might just rub it off.
It's not as hard when it does go off, nor is it as chemically resistant, so every year you might just want to polish it back up to get it super sharp again... keeping the wheels waxed and cleaned well will offset those problems a fair old bit. I've seen 1k laquers on wheels looking great 5 years later!
So, for DIY use it's perfect. You can leave your wheels in a dry warm room for days on end to harden, which a spary shop can't afford to do, or maybe customers can't wait for! (ie, a whole resprayed car sat in a dry, clean, warm booth for days waiting for the clearcoat to harden, not economical )


Both can be bad for your health, 2k is bad because you breath in a fast drying vapour, so kinda like plastic in your lungs over time, so an air-fed mask is ideal really, and then you need another compressor for your gun, thinners, etc etc... gets a bit silly for just four wheels when you are in no rush, but it is ultimately the best product to use.
1k is also bad, because it can also contain the isocyanates in the product, or others which are equally as nasty to harden the product when curing etc.


I'm far from an expert really. I think 1k stuff should be fine, just longer term the finish won't be as tough as two pack products, but as said, unless you literally wash wheels once every 6 months and don't give a crap it will be fine. Using the appropriate products and good quality ones where you can will improve them no end. Ie, a very good 1k prep/application will probably match a poorly done 2k with cheap 2k gear

Dave

 

[Nerra]

I've just ordered this 26 piece polishing kit:

http://www.thepolishingshop.co.uk/acatalog/Standard_Polishing_Kits.html

It should be arriving tomorrow so I'll let you know how I get on with it. It would be nice to get them to a near mirror finish.

I used regular Halfords clear laquer but I would be interested to see how a laquer made specifically for polished surfaces comes out. Its just finding some where that sells the stuff where I can get it before the weekend

 

[Mr Whippy]

Polish the wheel, put it back together, then when the laquer comes just remove wheel again, give a nice quick clean and then spray...

No point putting laquer for ontop of painted surfaces on if there is a more appropriate one out there, imho.

 

[srhutch]

On the OEM finish I'd say it was lacquered all over in one go, but difficult to tell as that's also the area where all the dirt and crud builds up. I just cleaned it down and flased some silver paint over it.

You mean with the star in, if thats the case no wonder the corrode

No of course not - with the star out.

didnt think so but had to ask

 

[cj10jeeper]

Dave,

All you say about the types of lacquer, wheel finishes, etc. etc. is great info. and really useful. My only observaion in all this is that the post that I made and methods posted (and used by Nerra) are targetted at memebers wanting to have a go and use readily available materials. The goal here is for people to get a reasonable finish and limited costs, bearing in mind that some of the posts refer to having no machine tools, etc. and in other refurb threads are working outside, and wanting to start 'today', so there can be diminishing returns in chasing down quality products.

I wanted a seriously good finish so actually left my 'stars' with a pro where it took him a few days to strip, refinish, apply base black, bake them, wet paint chrome and lacquer.

cj

 

[a11y]

I'm glad I'm not the only one thinking that then! Thanks for the info Dave - very useful I agree - but very much in-depth I feel, possibly more than I was expecting. I'm in a similar position to CJ/Nerra in wanting a good finish while keeping to a tight budget (while possessing less practical ability I feel!). Although I said I'm less keen on powdercoating, I was very happy with the finish on my previous car's wheels after powdercoating. Bearing in mind that cost me £150 for 4 wheels including tyre removal and refitting, DIY'ing it will have to be significantly cheaper for me to justify the effort LOL.

I'm in the process of polishing up some mountain-bike parts back to bare metal, and bought a can of "No Nonsense clear lacquer for metal surfaces" from screwfix for <£3.00. If that turns out OK on them then I might even consider using it for the alloys if I decide to polish up the lips and inner surfaces.

Ally

 

[Mr Whippy]

By no means think you need a two pack laquer or anything, I was just pointing out the differences

There are good cheap products in those links that are for the home DIY user, aerosol application and not hugely expensive at all.

The Deutsche Silver aerosol is cheap/easy to use, and is ideal for those who want OE colouring/finish if they need to do their stars, and is also aerosol application.


As they say, the hardest work is in the preparation, and you are spending lots of money and time getting the rims/inners polished up and clean, seperated etc, so where is the harm in buying a decent laquer in an aerosol for £10 that is designed for over polished metal car wheels? Just seems like investing in your finish (despite it actually costing about the same anyway)

Well worth buying it and waiting for it to come through than rushing out to use an inferior product after investing all that time in preparation! Fair do's if you've used a general purpose laquer already, but there are ones that work better over polished metals for the same price, just you'll have to order it and wait a few days (just like for the metal polishing pads/soaps )

Dave

 

[Nerra]

Do they work better though Dave? I recently bought some Hammerite aerosol paint to do my van wheels thinking it would be better quality than Halfords own brand and it turned out to be complete rubbish. Don't always believe what you read on the tin :wink:

If BMW's own laquer can't hold up then I doubt some random lacquer with a special label will do much better.

 

[561design]

excellent work!

 

[Mr Whippy]

Do they work better though Dave? I recently bought some Hammerite aerosol paint to do my van wheels thinking it would be better quality than Halfords own brand and it turned out to be complete rubbish. Don't always believe what you read on the tin :wink:

If BMW's own laquer can't hold up then I doubt some random lacquer with a special label will do much better.

There are distinct differences between a clear that will apply to a rough base coat and key nicely, and one that has to bond into/against a polished surface.

It's not a brand thing by any means. Buy Halfords own brand if they actually make one for use ontop of polished metals (from what I can see their clear is for use onto paints ideally)

Dave

 

[a11y]

I've got this stuff to try from Screwfix - it's meant for use on top of bare metal and is claims to be scratch resistant with good weather resistance. I've actually bought it for lacquering my bikes crank arms which I'm polishing up, and hadn't thought of it being suitable for the car wheels. I'll reserve judgement on it until I've tried it on my bike cranks though!

 

[easty027]

I've got this stuff to try from Screwfix - it's meant for use on top of bare metal and is claims to be scratch resistant with good weather resistance. I've actually bought it for lacquering my bikes crank arms which I'm polishing up, and hadn't thought of it being suitable for the car wheels. I'll reserve judgement on it until I've tried it on my bike cranks though!

Interested to know if you have done yours yet ? wondered how you were getting on as i am about to start mine as soon as i have a free weekend.

 

[paddy wright]

easty- lovin that signiture

 

[easty027]

easty- lovin that signiture

Cheers Paddy !......just a selection of old photos (nothing special as i am no photographer) and a bit of photoshop magic.