Rear camber alignment question

T

tomrdy

Member
 Sydney, Australia
Hey guys,

Booked the Z in for an annual alignment. I was digging through my documents and found an alignment print out from 2015 when I first got the car. Out of curiosity and in pursuit of becoming more mech-savvy (I've always just trusted the shop to sort the car out so I don't even have the printout from the last tyre change/alignment), I had an actual read of the thing!

I noticed that some of the L/R values are quite far apart, namely the camber highlighted below.

zYnui9l.jpg

That's... not right.. right? Or am I reading it wrong some how?

The car has always run straight so I've had no issues with the very previous alignment in 2017 - though right now the Left side is visibly and measurably - with a spirit level and calipers - more negatively cambered (part of the reason I'm bringing it in to have it checked up).
 
it all looks wrong to me... assuming column 2 is the before measurements, and column 3 the after measurements, then the rear toe and camber are still way off the target numbers?!? also, its possible they only did the rear toe, not the camber - depends on how good an alignment shop you used.

actually looking at the numbers... I'd suggest they adjusted the rear LH toe only, since the RH toe hardly changes... really, they should have done both, as the thrust angle (which should be zero) is now way out of spec, so the rear is crabbing to the side. I'd find a better alignment shop personally!
 
Your assumptions regarding the columns are correct.

Thanks for confirming I'm not a numpty and reading it wrong!

Im back at the same shop (Ive always gone there) and showed it to the manager. He agrees it looks like the tech didn't change it 3 years ago but not sure why. It could be that I just had the front control arm bushing replaced and the tech thought I only wanted adjustments of the front.

Eitherway, I've spoken to the manager. Specified to do a full 4 wheel alignment to get everything into spec. Raised my concerns so Ill give them one more go.
 
Alignment done. Rear camber... still not addressed.

After talking with (another?) manager who then spoke to the tech, they said that there was no adjustment on the rear camber. I know that the arms themselves had no adjustment sure (and theres kits for it), but I thought there was movement in the mounting pins? I wasn't sure on this point so I didn't argue. Does anyone have xp with this?

I know the theory behind an alignment but obviously never done it myself - what the hell goes on in there? Why does L/R never hit spot on? Isn't it a digital read-out that they just try to match or are the techs using it as reference only and making changes based on experience and inspecting the car's condition/tyre wear? Being in the service industry myself, I would totally understand if that was the case - as sometimes what my clients think is a straight forward thing, isn't really.

Literally the only value that was hit spot with spec within tolerance and matched L/R was the rear toe. Probably a good thing I had that corrected though as I had L +1, R -1. They are now both sitting +1 with a spec of +1.2.

The car does drive totally fine - straight as an arrow and no tram-lining - but i am a bit concerned that the rear camber is so far off each other.
 
No that certainly is n't right. Get back and get it sorted.

Years ago I noticed a newish tyre was wearing on one side after just a few months on the car. Only then did I dig out he slip and take a proper look at the readings. It was rather like h one you have. I went back to the same tyre shop a got them to stick two new tyres on. When they asked me for payment I pulled out the slip. After a short discussion I left with two new tyres fitted and an unused credit card. :D
 
Called BMW service up and they confirmed the eccentric bolt for adjustment.

I jacked my car up and confirmed the bolt exists (markers and everthing on it).

Called up the shop, spoke to the tech "ohhhh that's how. Bring it back I'll fix it up."

Are you f**** kidding me?

I'm back there now mildly fuming - entire morning wasted. I get that you don't know what you don't know but cmon. Rear wheel drive sports car with no camber adjustment at all? Just have a poke around and it's so obvious.

Asked to have it set close to spec around -2 for now.

Hopefully he knows how to use 2 spanners.
 
All done. Was a different tech from the first.

They also redid the front toes and now they're actually in specifications.

One thing thats off is the front cambers which from a quick google most shops don't know how to do? This one hadn't touched it at all.

Regardless, picking my battles here.

For anyone else reading this in the future, if the shop says they can't do your rear camber, call them out for it - eccentric bolt on lower control arm wheel side.
 
Good luck with the fix OP

Here’s a close up of the end of the camber arm - there’s not a lot of adjustment, but there should definitely be enough to bring L/R values closer together

B9F6A98D-5EA0-4109-A8D9-07BE25610BDD.jpeg

Aftermarket camber arms were one of the first things I changed on my car after removing various parts from my old E36 before I sold it (yes, they fit perfectly) after being repeatedly told by techs that BMW’s aren’t adjustable.
 
Front camber is adjustable via the removal of a small guide-screw

8F2B1353-CB5D-45B3-B122-6637C95306CD.jpeg

Remove the guide screw (one on each strut top), loosen strut screws and push towards engine to increase negative camber, or pull away from the engine to decrease negative camber, re-tighten when desired camber values found
 
Thanks guys I'm going to leave it as it is for now since I'm hoping to put in new struts and springs in the first half of next year. I know who I WONT be going to for geometry afterwards...

paulc_bkk said:
screw
Click to expand...

Thanks Paul - dumb question but the guide screw is the Allen headed one? Im sure it will make total sense when I take my suspension out later haha :)

paulc_bkk said:
Here’s a close up of the end of the camber arm - there’s not a lot of adjustment, but there should definitely be enough to bring L/R values closer together
Click to expand...

Thanks! I took pics from under my car as well while I was home incase they wanted to contest there was no adjustment again :P .
 
Yes - the Allen head screw... remove that and there’ll be possibility to move the three bolts inwards or outwards
 
tomrdy said:
All done. Was a different tech from the first.

They also redid the front toes and now they're actually in specifications.

One thing thats off is the front cambers which from a quick google most shops don't know how to do? This one hadn't touched it at all.

Regardless, picking my battles here.

For anyone else reading this in the future, if the shop says they can't do your rear camber, call them out for it - eccentric bolt on lower control arm wheel side.
Click to expand...
Im always amazed how many so called alignment specialists don't know this. It's not like it's an e85/6 only thing.
 
For others who stumble on this thread in the future, the adjustments are here (so you can show your chosen alignment "expert" :rofl: )

rKYilLm.jpg

4MDPRKQ.jpg
 
i recently had my z4 e85 adjusted, and first thing the guy recommended was swapping in rear lower camber arms from an M3, which use ball joint rather than a bush. more adjustment, and less squidge from a bushing.
 
Hi- similar story, but after a little help too.

I have an E85 facelift 3.0 Si with BMW sports suspension- factory spec. I have just put a new set of Non RFT as the rear RFT were on the limit with slightly worse wear on the inner 1/3rd. Because of this I d ecided to get the wheel alignment checked at a local HiQ on their Hunter machine.
The settings were reasonable but the reat camber and toe were out. The operative didn't have any weights to put in the car and said they didn't need them?
When he tried to adjust the rear camber, he had the cam bolt at maximum on both rear wheels, but the reading was only -2 deg 15 min which isn't 2 deg 5 min on the spec sheet and not within the 'green' on the Hunter machine.
The car is an 07 with just over 50k. It recently wenth through an MOT and had the lolipop bushings replaced, but passed on everything else.

I had though the track control arm bushings may be worn, but they seem OK and that wasn't picked up at MOT. I have had one of the cam bolts out for a clean up, and there wasn't any obvious wear.

Does anyone know why there insn't any more adjustment on the rears?
 
OK-
The back ground to my request is that I took my Z4 3.0 Si on factory spec 18" off-set wheels and non-RFT, to have its wheel alignment checked, It was too +ve at the rear and likewise at the front. The rear camber could not be adjusted further than its circa 2 deg 15 min. We didn't try adjusting the front. These checks were done unladen. So I wondered whether this was the reason for the lack of further adjustment.
Doing a bit of research and measuring the ride height, my rear measures 610mm and front 598mm (lower edge of rim to wheel arch) which looks as if the rear is riding high for the MTech sports suspension.

Looking through some of the papers that came with the car and its MOT history, it failed the MOT with a broken rear spring in 2012. The test was done at a BMW delership and may have carried out the repair.

Also in the papers is an alignment print from 2015, showing a 'standard' suspension set up. Initial readings show the rear track and camber as being out of range and then adjusted to standard suspension settings not the MTech.

So, from the ride height, it looks as if the rear is non-sports height, with the front sports suspension height and that the car has been set up with non-sports suspension alignment.

I am presuming that the non-sports springs are longer, which is why the ride height is high and that the combination of this and not using weights is why the rear camber can not be adjusted any further?

The car seems to handle and ride well on its new tyres and I was only checking the alignment due to inner rear tyre wear on the old tyres.

As I see it, I have a number of options, do I stick with the 'pimp my ride' rear high- ever so slightly set up or get the springs changed and set it up as it should be?
 
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