Pistonheads TOTD: Z4M / E46 M3 - Are they just not that fast?
- Thread starter Fishy Dave
- Start date
340hp, small , relatively light by todays standards will always feel fantastic, lets not forget the proper sports car manufactures are now marketing these exact types of cars for the purists , a la 911 R / Gt4/ spyder etc etc....
the hatch market has exploded with silly power and some excellent cars but lets make no bones about it, my suped up ST is no where near the ownership prospect that my z4m is... the s54 has some seriously cool and exotic techniques that still TODAY are being employed by the likes of ferrari (valve train setup on the f12 TDF), the Z06 ( sodium filled valves) and so on etc....
The way the Z feels , sounds, goes still to this day thrills and i LOVE its analogue nature in this digital world of today, and the manufacturers are cottoning on that their is a market for this old formula and they are CHARGING for it, we are in the club already, so enjoy it, embrace it.
you //M guys have a front engine car with 343hp, manual box, Rwd, proper LSD, sat over the rear wheels , add some top level suspension, brakes a blower if you want to go the hole hog and you have the recipe for one of these 100k plus cars the likes of porsche are selling in the GT4 / spyder / 911R etc! All this can be done as cheap as a used hot hatch and you still quids in with the way its gone today.
i see ford have released a new ST fiesta 200, its 24k!!! i mean... i love the car but 24k?? no WAY.... buy a low mile used one for 14k and tune the snott out of it and you'll be in hot hatch heaven.
i agree with tom above however, these suck as DD, they are old and i think for any meaningful increase in value is now another good 5-6 years away, the low mile minters are just too expensive to make them viable and they are sticking in both flavours.
These hot hatches , modern ones are offering fun in a different place and cant offer what the ///M offers and vice versa the ///M cant offer the everyday beast mode, run them side to side and its a win.
the hatch market has exploded with silly power and some excellent cars but lets make no bones about it, my suped up ST is no where near the ownership prospect that my z4m is... the s54 has some seriously cool and exotic techniques that still TODAY are being employed by the likes of ferrari (valve train setup on the f12 TDF), the Z06 ( sodium filled valves) and so on etc....
The way the Z feels , sounds, goes still to this day thrills and i LOVE its analogue nature in this digital world of today, and the manufacturers are cottoning on that their is a market for this old formula and they are CHARGING for it, we are in the club already, so enjoy it, embrace it.
you //M guys have a front engine car with 343hp, manual box, Rwd, proper LSD, sat over the rear wheels , add some top level suspension, brakes a blower if you want to go the hole hog and you have the recipe for one of these 100k plus cars the likes of porsche are selling in the GT4 / spyder / 911R etc! All this can be done as cheap as a used hot hatch and you still quids in with the way its gone today.
i see ford have released a new ST fiesta 200, its 24k!!! i mean... i love the car but 24k?? no WAY.... buy a low mile used one for 14k and tune the snott out of it and you'll be in hot hatch heaven.
i agree with tom above however, these suck as DD, they are old and i think for any meaningful increase in value is now another good 5-6 years away, the low mile minters are just too expensive to make them viable and they are sticking in both flavours.
These hot hatches , modern ones are offering fun in a different place and cant offer what the ///M offers and vice versa the ///M cant offer the everyday beast mode, run them side to side and its a win.
tomscott said:
Welcome back
Having just done the circuit of test driving and working out the numbers on all hot hatches (M135i, RS3, A45, Golf R etc) and the usual used RS4/C63(bought this..)/M3+M4 etc would be interesting to hear your opinions and final decision on what car!If you're not after the be-all-and-end-all car in terms of numbers performance, i'd have to say the deals you get on M135i's are ... unbeatable, and it's definitely the logical choice of the bunch (something like 20%+ off a NEW custom spec M135i if you buy from the right dealer, with 2 week waiting time...).
jimmybell said:tomscott said:
Welcome back
If you're not after the be-all-and-end-all car in terms of numbers performance, i'd have to say the deals you get on M135i's are ... unbeatable, and it's definitely the logical choice of the bunch (something like 20%+ off a NEW custom spec M135i if you buy from the right dealer, with 2 week waiting time...).
Wow i bet the C63 is ballistic! Congrats on the purchase! So has the M stayed too?
Ive had a full turn on my decision if funds were not lacking I think I would have the M4... Just because its probably the best all rounder and you can commute in them relatively good MPG and comfy.
My funds are lacking atm I'm looking at 16-18k max really as traveling really destroyed my balance
I really hate the gen 2 iteration 1 rear of the 1 series I think the newer one looks so much nicer and more aggressive but my funds don't stretch to one unfortunately I assume they are being discounted because its been replaced by the M140? Cracking car but if I had 25k to spend I think I would take the M235 I really like them.
I was actually looking at a 35i that John bought. Very low milage pretty much all the toys was only about £16.5k great value for money and fancy keeping the 2 seater and staying within the forum. I dont know really its early days my mind keeps changing.
In an ideal world I want a 911, but from watching how much Tim has been piling into his recently it really puts me off. Great car but when things go wrong everything seems to. He's spent about 4k on it this year not including servicing and its only done 30k.
Haha yeah.. ballistic is a good description. First gear on a P31 C63 is probably one of the most special car experiences ive owned. The M has indeed stayed, i cant part with it :/
For M135i to work out financially you have to look at second hand (£22-24k, 6-24months old) via cheap loans (sainsburys bank... 3%) or BMW PCP on a new order. The discount off the sticker price makes the price paid pretty damn close to the GMFV, so it's a very cheap ownership proposition over the 2,3 or 4 year period. Can't remember the exact numbers but a top spec new shape car was around 38k with all options ticked, and i was offered around 29k, with GMFV well above 20k. I appreciate people don't like the idea of a PCP, or finance/debt in general - i'm partially of the same mindset. Though at the price offered the m135i was enough to make it comparable to general outright purchase+depreciation costs. The reason for the discounts is just due to the sheer volume they're selling, it's become the most popular 1 series model in certain dealers (babybmw has a thread dedicated to a certain sales guy who sells at great discount/volume wherever he works).
I was actually turned off by the M4, in the end decided i preferred the M3 for looks and general balance as a car (turbo = dailyable = practical suited = 4 door... or some sort of man maths like that). That combined with A45 test (great car, hard ride/seats) led me to bumble into a C63 and YOLO took over..
If m3's werent 50k second hand still (in decent colours/specs/sports exhaust+carbon trim) i'd be all over one as a daily, and possibly sell the Z4 until i can save for it's replacement. Still - as we all know - not much replaces the Z4 without significant cash outlay (991/997 GTS please..). Likewise RS3 i had a deposit on- but in the end i couldnt stomach the PCP/interest/deprecation of around £8k per annum over the duration.. just toooo expensive for what it is, even if it was my favourite option.
For M135i to work out financially you have to look at second hand (£22-24k, 6-24months old) via cheap loans (sainsburys bank... 3%) or BMW PCP on a new order. The discount off the sticker price makes the price paid pretty damn close to the GMFV, so it's a very cheap ownership proposition over the 2,3 or 4 year period. Can't remember the exact numbers but a top spec new shape car was around 38k with all options ticked, and i was offered around 29k, with GMFV well above 20k. I appreciate people don't like the idea of a PCP, or finance/debt in general - i'm partially of the same mindset. Though at the price offered the m135i was enough to make it comparable to general outright purchase+depreciation costs. The reason for the discounts is just due to the sheer volume they're selling, it's become the most popular 1 series model in certain dealers (babybmw has a thread dedicated to a certain sales guy who sells at great discount/volume wherever he works).
I was actually turned off by the M4, in the end decided i preferred the M3 for looks and general balance as a car (turbo = dailyable = practical suited = 4 door... or some sort of man maths like that). That combined with A45 test (great car, hard ride/seats) led me to bumble into a C63 and YOLO took over..
If m3's werent 50k second hand still (in decent colours/specs/sports exhaust+carbon trim) i'd be all over one as a daily, and possibly sell the Z4 until i can save for it's replacement. Still - as we all know - not much replaces the Z4 without significant cash outlay (991/997 GTS please..). Likewise RS3 i had a deposit on- but in the end i couldnt stomach the PCP/interest/deprecation of around £8k per annum over the duration.. just toooo expensive for what it is, even if it was my favourite option.
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jimmybell said:D4dawg said:Plus I'm putting up a video of hind head tunnel with my supersprint decat and new Eisenmann race boxes on!!!
Tune in turn up and remind me about a hot hatch
Intereste to see/hear this!
Up on forum here buddy
