OMG soooo cheap - someone rescue it please

[Breaker]

I know this is a bit :hijacked:

but:

The 3.0si I test drove felt slower than the 335i.

"Felt" is probably the word there. Interesting you say that because the BMW websites figures for the 0-62 on the 335i is only 0.2 sec quicker than the 3.0si and the 50-75 mph times in 4th gear are the same? The 335i makes good torque though so this may make it feel faster to the driver I guess.
I was convinced my JCW MINI S was faster on overtaking than my 3.0si, but using markers on some of my fav roads, it wasn't! It just felt like it because of the way the supercharger kicked in.

Fugures:

The Z4M:
0-62 - 5.0 sec
50-75 - 5.0 sec in 4th

The Z4 3.0si
0-62 - 5.7 sec
50-75 - 5.2 sec in 4th

335i M sport
0-62 - 5.4 sec
50-75 - 5.2 sec in 4th

Not a massive amount in it really, but I know these sorts of figures don't mean a lot as it depends a lot on the driver! A slight delay in take off on a 0-62 run will put any of them ahead! :wink:

Out of interest, how do they work these figures out? Do they use the same driver, conditions, timing gear and track or is it all worked out on computer?

 

[Wondermike]

Out of interest, how do they work these figures out? Do they use the same driver, conditions, timing gear and track or is it all worked out on computer?

They try to, I suppose the Autocar tests are the most conclusive, but different cars on different days can produce differences on their own, I think unless the tests are back to back at the same time, driver, etc then it can be inconclusive sometimes. Although saying that, the margins for error probably aren't that big.

At the end of the day, once you get over 200bhp the differences at speeds under 70mph aren't going to be that great, it's only above that speed that the additional power starts to show in a big way. I don't think a 3.0 would see which way an ///M went in accelerating from 100 to 140mph.

Doesn't stop us wanting cars like the ///M though

 

[FirstKnight]

Not a massive amount in it really, but I know these sorts of figures don't mean a lot as it depends a lot on the driver! A slight delay in take off on a 0-62 run will put any of them ahead! :wink:

I totally agree with you - on our daily drives it would be down to driver reaction time and ability in most cases and, as Wondermike says, the benefits of the ///M in particular would only really be felt above 100mph; which, personally, I very rarely approach. Indeed, my car is used 90% of the time commuting A / B roads at circa 30-50mph. On my routes I have negligible advantage over a 3.0si and I'm paying a lot more in running costs! If I didn't get a bargain ///M the 3.0si would be what I was driving now and I would be thrilled with it - especially given that I drive my car like a granny on Valium, not racing other cars and only occasionally putting my foot down for a few seconds to slap a huge grin on my face!

As an added aside, when I tested the 3.0si I forgot to engage the Sport button and my 335i was running nearly 350bhp and 500Nm courtesy of an SSTT chip. In that modified form the 335i and my ///M are very close in terms of butt dyno and I had to 'imagine' it unchipped when doing back-to-back comparisons with the 3.0si which, as you will point out, is far from ideal and not at all fair on the Z4! Hence my proceeding down the route to actually buying a 3.0si which soured when the Dealer wouldn't budge even a little more and I saw ///M's for similar money.

 

[Breaker]

I must admit that if I hadn't bought my 3.0si, when I saw that '07 M coupe at my dealers with only 385 miles on the clock the other day for £26,850, I would have bought the M and put up with the extra costs! Bargain performance car! That M was for sale for almost £1,000 less than I paid for my 3.0si 6 months earlier!!! Go figure!! :|

Having said all that, all 3 are faster on paper than the basic Porshe Cayman, but that is selling for around £6,000 more second hand for a 1 year older car!! :?

 

[ovrkll]

Any idea why the 50-75 testing was done in 4th gear? I would imagine that 3rd would show a more dramatic difference in engine hp.

I
The Z4M:
0-62 - 5.0 sec
50-75 - 5.0 sec in 4th

The Z4 3.0si
0-62 - 5.7 sec
50-75 - 5.2 sec in 4th

335i M sport
0-62 - 5.4 sec
50-75 - 5.2 sec in 4th

 

[Breaker]

What are the revs at those speeds? I wonder if it sits out of the dead spot they programme in for noise/emission testing? (usually around 4,500 RPM) Or could it be the best use of the toque? Not sure to be honest.

 

[Breaker]

I don't think a 3.0 would see which way an ///M went in accelerating from 100 to 140mph.

I'd be interested to test that theory. :wink: The M would definitely be quicker at that speed range (it is a racing developed engine after all), but by how much, side to side, would be an interesting trial. I wonder why no one has posted that test on Youtube yet. Perhaps someone in Germany could!

I had an interesting run with an M3 when I had my JCW MINI on a dual track once and was surprised at the way the MINI lost ground so slowly!

 

[Wondermike]

I can help there, using EVO and Autocar test results. The 3.0Si does 0-100 in 14.7 then gets to 130 in 27.4 (this is as fast as the data went) whereas a Z4MC got 0-100 in 11.9, to 130 in 20.0. So quite a difference.

0-80 for 3.0 was 9.3 and the ///M was 8.1

 

[Breaker]

Start to use all the revs available and the M wins because of the top end power. What the engines designed for I guess.
I'd like to see the MPG difference in that test!

 

[pvr]

Having had the 3.0 before I had the M, I can compare them using the same driver . They are complete different cars to drive which can not be put down in paper figures. The LSD on the M makes turns out of roundabouts quicker then what I could do with the 3.0. The 3.0 was a great car, no doubt about it.

And the final bit - nothing like sticking 4 exhausts pipe up to Gordon Brown is there?

 

[Breaker]

Just out of interest, was it the 3.0si with the 265BHP motor you had?

 

[FirstKnight]

I've been browsing the Fastest Laps website and did a comparison of the ///M vs 3.0si - not a whole lot in it really.

http://www.fastestlaps.com/index.php?page_id=compare&car1=458f012060be9&car2=467a49836950c&excludewet=true

 

[Breaker]

I bet all those times are using the full rev range on each engine. On the road I bet it's even closer!

 

[FirstKnight]

I bet all those times are using the full rev range on each engine. On the road I bet it's even closer!

I rarely go above 5000 rpm on my daily journey which would mean any 3.0si behind me would be bumper to bumper most of the time.

Didn't know the Roadster was quicker than the Coupe though:
http://www.fastestlaps.com/index.php?page_id=compare&car1=458f012060be9&car2=46c81a841feb7&excludewet=true

 

[Breaker]

That just proves that these figures don't tell who the driver was or the conditions. For instance, the difference between the M and the 3.0si could be significantly closed by having the wrong driver aboard! Look at the times posted on Top Gear by celebrities on the "Star in a reasonably priced car" feature all using the same car!

 

[Breaker]

This is getting interesting. Cool site!

3.0si v 3.0i :

http://www.fastestlaps.com/index.php?page_id=compare&car1=45c49164512bf&car2=45c751b0d25c0