N52/N/K vanos phaser bolts? Does it affect UK cars?

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0btu5e

Member
Hi all, I have just came across this forum after going on a deep dive in preparation to buying hopefully either a E92 325i/330i (hopefully the latter) auto or manual, or a z4 3.0 IF I can fit in it (very tall :thumbsdown:)

All I see in countless posts from Americans on forums and on Youtube, is these 'vanos phaser bolts' (camshaft rear security screws/bolts) coming loose/destroying engines/jumping a tooth etc etc...

I have terrible luck with cars but am happy to spend the money to do preventative maintenance...

My questions are:

1) IS the N52N that realoem tells me RHD UK cars have on a 2006/2007 'the same' as the N52K that America, etc mentions? (obviously avoiding any awful N53 engines shown in for sale pics that are missing the valvetronic motor bulge)

2) Is there a better model, i.e. the magnesium valve cover N52? Or is the 'revised' N52N/K actually better? I know the power seems to be a little less claimed, but I hear that's due to exhausts?

All I can seem to spot is that all E92 had the N52N with the black plastic valve cover in the UK and all the E90 have the N52 with the magnesium valve cover? When you have the same model, i.e. a 330i in both E90 and E92 form, the power figures are always better on the E92 and the E92 always has the N52N?

3) Do either of our UK N52 engines in the Z4/E9X platforms have this dreaded 'vanos phaser bolts' backing out issue?

4) Do the timing chains snap/guides go brittle/vanos cam pulleys teeth wear out - this was mentioned by one bmw 'specialist' I spoke to when getting quotes, but n- one else had mentioned this after speaking to 5 others...

5) IF the 'vanos phaser bolts' need replacing, I have the American part number that claims it's the revised part that fixes it - can anyone confirm it (I can paste it when back on my pc to cross reference) BUT is it true they simply over-torqued it from the factory and it snapped due to this? Or was that the USA etc variant or the N52 and not N52N/K version? So much conflicting and worrying misinformation online...

6) IF there is a difference in these 'vanos phaser bolts' why do some snap and some undo? Is this 2 different issues depending on it being N52/N52N/K and 2 different 'bolt types' used with their own issues across the 2 engine revisions?

7) Has anyone from the UK had any of this happen to them? What did you do to fix it?

8) I plan on keeping this car for years and finding as low of a mileage/mint one with a decent history, so to 'be on the same side' would you just replace everything timing wise? Or just do the timing chain tensioner and the vanos phaser bolts?

9) IF these bolts are an issue, do they simply get tightened to OEM torque specs like the previous bolts that had a failed design/weak/over tightened/came loose? I worry that if they're replaced but say, not tightened enough/too much, this could happen again?

Sorry for so many questions; I genuinely have THE WORST luck with cars but never let them beat me and instead just do insane amounts of deep-dive research and basically end up replacing/modifying/upgrading everything :rofl: :thumbsup:

I know not to ever touch an N53 and the crazy amount of continually failing parts that continue to keep needing to be replaced, but the UK knowledge on N52's seems to be very mixed, a lot borrowed from USA etc and not actual hands on experience, and you have these con artists like 'BMW Doctor Dean' on Youtube, who try and blur the faults between different countries issues whilst trying to sell you free software for £50/monthly subscriptions, etc etc...

Thank you for your patience and any input/experiences.
 
The Vanos bolt recall only seem to affect later N52 engines - it's a topic in the E89 pages on here.

The reason it gets mentioned so much in some places is because the North American market never got the N53 engine, so their later 325i and 330i models still had N52 engines.

But BMW stopped making E85/86 Z4s in 2008 and stopped fitting the N52 to the E9* models in 2007 IIRC so they don't seem to be affected.

There is a recall for the E89s with the N52 engine here:- https://z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=148800&hilit=recall

My current 330i has done 127K miles and replaced a 2006 325i that had done 139K miles (both N52s) and I never had a VANOS problem with either of them.

I didn't have a problem with either of my 2006 E86s either, but neither had reached a 6 figure mileage.
 
Mr Tidy said:
The Vanos bolt recall only seem to affect later N52 engines - it's a topic in the E89 pages on here.

The reason it gets mentioned so much in some places is because the North American market never got the N53 engine, so their later 325i and 330i models still had N52 engines.

But BMW stopped making E85/86 Z4s in 2008 and stopped fitting the N52 to the E9* models in 2007 IIRC so they don't seem to be affected.

There is a recall for the E89s with the N52 engine here:- https://z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=148800&hilit=recall

My current 330i has done 127K miles and replaced a 2006 325i that had done 139K miles (both N52s) and I never had a VANOS problem with either of them.

I didn't have a problem with either of my 2006 E86s either, but neither had reached a 6 figure mileage.
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Hi, thanks for the reply :)

Before I say anything, I'm not 'the best with words' so don't think I'm being arsey if I word anything badly haha :headbang: :rofl:

Yeah, I'm aware they had that awful N51 first and then got the N52 - the N51/52/54 are all affected by this pulley bolt issue, as I'm sure you've seen in the recalls in the States.

I don't believe the year is a factor for this, sorry...

The E39/E46/E60/E85/E90 all shared the same M54 variants before they switched over to the N52 in 2006 when the lci E39/E46 retired, and then the Z4 carried on using the N52 until 2011 with the E89 - at this time the E90/E92 had already switched over late 2007 to the awful N53...

If you look on realoem and select a 2007 late E92 325i/330i you will see (on the correct month) you can have both N52N and N53, then after that it's purely N53, and that is before the LCI facelift comes into play; from LCI onwards they are ALL N53 on the E90/92...

Whereas the Z4's skipped the N53.

Both the magnesium valve cover N52 and the plastic valve cover N52N/K are affected by those 4 rear-facing vanos bolts coming undone or snapping - not the 2 big bolts that go in from the centre of the pulley at the front of the engine.

Apparently this is due to them being over-torqued from the factory, or using the wrong type of bolt strength on the revised N52N/K, so either way you can have 2 different major issues, be it snapping or coming loose on either engine.

Thus, I cannot see why ours won't be affected, as the UK Z4/E9X have the same 2 variants of the N52 as the American cars had.

Having spoken to a very trusted local BMW approved independent, they have seen this issue in the UK, I've also seen on a pistonheads thread that a few people have been contacted by BMW for the recall with N52's...

It would be awesome if there was a clear cut "NO it only happens on this exact version/revision" but seeing as it happened on the N52 and N/K, I'm pretty worried with my bad luck. As sods law someone will do 500k and it'll be fine, yet if I dare do 150-180k without doing it, it'll break - that's just the story of my life, even when I plough thousands into parts on a 'just incase' basis :fuelfire:
 
Might be worth getting one of those cheap £20 ebay bendy bore scopes and having a look via your oil cap - apparently it's possible to see the bolts.
 
UPDATE:
I have just looked on realoem, comparing E89/E90 USA and European models for the same years, be in 2006-2011 for a Z4 E89, and BOTH the USA and UK have N52N listed, and the same goes for the E92 models that shared a N52 (as the USA never got the N53)

So what I red previously about the N52N and N52K being the same variant, is now confirmed, thus we must have the same potential failure :| :thumbsdown:
 
I don't think E85/86 or UK E9* models do have the same potential issue.

Everything I have read, including the US recall notice issued by BMW which doesn't mention the E85 or E86, says engines manufactured after 2 September 2009. E85/86 production ended in 2008 and by then the UK E9* models already had the N53.

Link here:- https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/rcl/2023/RCRIT-23V707-2875.pdf
 
Mr Tidy said:
I don't think E85/86 or UK E9* models do have the same potential issue.

Everything I have read, including the US recall notice issued by BMW which doesn't mention the E85 or E86, says engines manufactured after 2 September 2009. E85/86 production ended in 2008 and by then the UK E9* models already had the N53.

Link here:- https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/rcl/2023/RCRIT-23V707-2875.pdf
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I'm not saying you're wrong, but surely when the year is mentioned, they in fact mean cars sold/produced on that year chassis-wise but using whatever engine stock is left that that platform supports?

For them to use the N52N in the Z4 all the way up to 2011, means they must have had a hell of a lot of engines left over from the E9X/X3-5 platforms, hence not bothering with N53's despite our UK cars having them in the E9X?

Like how the early E60 still had a M54B30 and then was replaced with the N52/53 shortly after?
That's usually the case when a model is about to be replaced, hence why the M54B30 went into the early E60's, and the M52TUB existed prior to the M54 in pre lci E39/E46.

Also, IF there was a later produced version that was affected in the 2009-2011 period, surely that would have a different engine code and not be still called a N52N/K (which as realoem shows are the same) it would have a different letter again at the end?

As for the stats, they avoided admitting it for years in America until a fair few people sued them, if I remember correctly? I read something along those lines that certain states avoided taking responsibility, etc, and some honoured it, then a recall magically happened not long after?

It wouldn't surprise me at all if the UK just hasn't 'caught up' yet?

The few recalls I've found in the UK seem to be only on Z4 E89's from 2010/11, of which a lot of the dealerships won't provide receipts or info on what was changed bar 1 customer had some luck with an invoice; I think that is because that stupid Recall Sheet states to 'only replace' bolts that are snapped/loose, which is ridiculous! Versus replacing all 8! As the remaining non-replaced ones still could come loose at a later date!
Typical scummy half-arsing of a main stealer!

They also claim it can take 2 days, lol to take a valve cover off, undo 1 bolt per pulley at a time, replace it, torque it, turn the crank, repeat! Ridiculous!

The worst thing is, the bolts are like £1+vat each, I have a quote from 2 dealerships part dept's for £8.64 for all 8 of the revised bolts!

I would literally do mine myself, I just don't want to drive home and have they fall out/snap! Would be just my luck despite heavily investing in maintaining my cars myself with OEM or better parts!

EDIT:
I just tried using a 2006, 2010 and 2011 3.0 Z4 numberplate into the recall system and nothing shows up, so this is definitely a minefield...
 
I'm not sure BMW were using left-over stock of N52 engines because they were still fitting them to UK bound E89s until 2011 and the 125i. Something in the back of my mind makes me I think N America didn't get N53s because they didn't suit US fuel?

If they were using old stock then presumably some post September builds wouldn't have had the suspect parts!

I know early E60s had the M54, but E60s came out in 2003. E90s weren't launched in the UK until 2005 and my sales brochure from that year only shows the spec for the N52 engines. E91/92/93 models didn't go on sale until some time later.

While I can understand your concern, in the 10 years I have been on here I haven't read of anyone having an issue with N52 Vanos bolts in an E85/86, and plenty seem to have done over 150K miles.
 
Mr Tidy said:
I'm not sure BMW were using left-over stock of N52 engines because they were still fitting them to UK bound E89s until 2011 and the 125i. Something in the back of my mind makes me I think N America didn't get N53s because they didn't suit US fuel?

If they were using old stock then presumably some post September builds wouldn't have had the suspect parts!

I know early E60s had the M54, but E60s came out in 2003. E90s weren't launched in the UK until 2005 and my sales brochure from that year only shows the spec for the N52 engines. E91/92/93 models didn't go on sale until some time later.

While I can understand your concern, in the 10 years I have been on here I haven't read of anyone having an issue with N52 Vanos bolts in an E85/86, and plenty seem to have done over 150K miles.
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Sorry if my wording isn't the best mate, I'm trying to say that they must have planned to build XYZ chassis/models, and allocated, as usual, many engine variants, so on that basis, they would have been churning them out for years before the end of the E9X platform, so they 'could' have had a reasonable amount leftover when the N53 crossover happened just before the physical LCI facelift happened (at least on the E9X).

As I say, you can see on a 2007 E92 for example, that you can have both N52N/N53, despite the LCI 'facelift' being 2008-2009 in physical appearance in it's various guises - be that interior/lights/bumpers/engines...

So I'm wondering in our UK case that some of the E9X N52's might have been left over when they switched to the N53? And thus those went to the E89? It would make sense considering the 2006-2007 N52's in an E92 specifically are N52N, which is what all of the E89 N52's are... According to realoem; I know the E90 is different, and they tend to all be magnesium valve cover lesser power N52's. But E92/E89, definitely are the same engine code...

If there's a new batch, surely it'd have extra revisions like the various ones listed from the N52 versus the N52N?

As realoem shows that in both USA and EUR, the N52N was fitted, so that 'K' version is clearly just a country derived name - which is what I'd read in the past.

As for the E90/M54, sorry I meant the E60 shared the M54 with the E39/46, the E90 however, did get the M47/M47's that the E39/46 320d/330d had, my mistake. Then obviously were replaced with the N52 and the shocking N47/N57 :thumbsdown: :cry:

The reason I am so worried is that I am hunting for a mint one, and I will literally replace every arm/bushing/entire coolant system/any required module and other part with genuine brand new OEM, and spare zero expense, run it on premium fuel and fluids, service it every 3K myself, fit very nice aftermarket suspension and adjustable arm, expensive wheels+tyres, and various other custom touches, as that's what I like to do, and if I ignore this and £8.64 worth of bolts destroys my engine, because the internet or BMW lies, I will be throwing away a LOT of money and gutted.

Whereas if someone knows this is an issue, then I'd happily chuck a new timing chain/tensioner/guides/pulleys/upgraded bolts on it!

I come from a generation of the old skool BMW's where chains/engines outlived the owners/rust would destroy the car first, so all these modern cars with terrible build quality and junk like HPFP/Direct injection/NOX sensors and what blatantly would appear to be made to fail and get bent over for another on finance, era cars, boils my blood!

That's why I will not go any newer than a N52, as yes change the expensive waterpump/thermostat/pipes/solenoids and do the usual BMW leaking gaskets/disa's/coilpacks, and the rest is just wear and tear; I'd be happy with that for a 'modern' ish car.

As it is it's far too big for a 3 series and is E38 size, and our roads haven't got wider, nor have the parking spaces, I loved the idea of a E85/E89 coupe because they don't weigh as much and don't look bad and still fit in a parking space. But I will settle for a E92 330i, as I wouldn't touch a N54/55/S55 if my life depended on it, knowing what I know about them, I did work for BMW years ago amongst other marques.
 
I can see what you mean, N52 is as new as I want to go as well.

If size is an issue wouldn't a 125i work?

They have the 3 litre N52 that is apparently only a remap away from 130i power.

Unless you can fit in an E86!
 
Mr Tidy said:
I can see what you mean, N52 is as new as I want to go as well.

If size is an issue wouldn't a 125i work?

They have the 3 litre N52 that is apparently only a remap away from 130i power.

Unless you can fit in an E86!
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Yeah N52 is the last well made straight 6 N/A BMW engine for sure!

I'm pretty sure the 125i to 130i power is because the USA got a 3L N52B30 but still called it a '325i' :headbang: Then they swapped the inlet manifold with the better Disa onto it and remapped it and it's the 130i power? So they just held it back by the map/inlet manifold.
I'm 99% sure the UK 125i is just a 3L N53B30 with a weaker map, just like the N53 '325i' 3L E9X late 2007 onwards and LCI facelift are, as we got the same inlet manifold on both N53's...

EDIT: just checked 125i coupes, and yep N53 junk.

I don't think either way I could stomach a 1 series, especially not a hatch, let alone a 5 door hatch :throwsup: they are very girly/daddy bought me this spec aren't they lol, and the coupes rarely look any good, I absolutely despise the 1M, I know what it is blah blah skunkworks project etc, but nope.

Both the hatch and the coupe 1 series seemed to be owned by chavs and people that 'think' they know about cars.

If I'm to have only one car I don't think it can be that, I'd have a 2 series, because they are around E46 M3 size - IIRC 2" shorter and 4" wider, or something like that? I know there's not much in it, but they have the crank/bearing destroying N44/N45/S55 engines :( and as we know all of these have been ragged from cold with pop and bang maps downshifting 5+ gears to show off to jailbait, so shall be in awful condition, future lifespan wise and rarely serviced if at all, and the rest will have been owned by similiar tossers who finance/have them as company cars and don't care.

How reliable are the 6-speed auto's in the E9X 330i's? I have considered one purely due to the rarity of finding a E92 N52 330i manual…
 
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