M40i brakes - design flaw uncovered

Sladester100 said:
Hey peeps

I’m back in this thread! Yay.

Does anyone have any other suggestions to remove a stone that is well and truly stuck? Or is it a case of calling BMW Recovery?

After leaving for work and getting 2 miles from home a squeal appeared - worse than last time! - it’s in the O/S/F wheel; I tried to dislodge with back and forth but nothing, got quite aggressive with my braking and even resorted to riding the “cats eyes” on my way back home on an older road where they’re big to see if the vibration helped

I then tried to flex the shield slightly (burning my fingers on the red hot rotor after my aggressive braking attempts) and I think I can see it with my phone camera right at the base being held in but can’t fathom how to remove.

Unless I take the wheel off? - where’s the jacking points? 😅

The more calls to BMW Recovery Services with this problem the better!
 
High pressure washer with the wheels on full lock could allow slightly easier access and possibly dislodge the stone.
 
Sladester100 said:
Hey peeps

I’m back in this thread! Yay.

Does anyone have any other suggestions to remove a stone that is well and truly stuck? Or is it a case of calling BMW Recovery?

After leaving for work and getting 2 miles from home a squeal appeared - worse than last time! - it’s in the O/S/F wheel; I tried to dislodge with back and forth but nothing, got quite aggressive with my braking and even resorted to riding the “cats eyes” on my way back home on an older road where they’re big to see if the vibration helped

I then tried to flex the shield slightly (burning my fingers on the red hot rotor after my aggressive braking attempts) and I think I can see it with my phone camera right at the base being held in but can’t fathom how to remove.

Unless I take the wheel off? - where’s the jacking points? 😅

I’m afraid the wheel needs to come off. You will also need a long screwdriver or something similar to dig out the stone. The jack points are plastic rectangular (holes) near to each wheel under the car. You can buy a special jacking point adapter on Amazon that fits the holes. I keep one in the car.
Good luck. :driving:
 
Sladester100: It has happened to me six times now. BMW emergency services is a waste of time. Can take 2-3 hours for them to turn up and then all they want to do is take you home. :thumbsdown:

I now carry a scissor jack with extending wheel brace, 17mm socket and jacking adapter in the boot so that I am able to take the wheel off and do the job myself if I am not near a BMW/Mini dealer. Prevents being stranded for hours or running around with the car sounding like a “ banshee” :headbang:
 
Jim S said:
Sladester100: It has happened to me six times now. BMW emergency services is a waste of time. Can take 2-3 hours for them to turn up and then all they want to do is take you home. :thumbsdown:

I now carry a scissor jack with extending wheel brace, 17mm socket and jacking adapter in the boot so that I am able to take the wheel off and do the job myself if I am not near a BMW/Mini dealer. Prevents being stranded for hours or running around with the car sounding like a “ banshee” :headbang:

This is so tedious

My biggest worry is causing damage to the disc. I’m sure the risk is low but still.

The car is on the drive so I don’t mind waiting for them to come out to prove a point and at least have it logged perhaps. Also I don’t have a adaptor (yet)

Thanks for the replies peeps!

Here’s the stone ;)
Disc on the left heat shield on the right
9A119B9E-793D-4194-A13E-DFF60435CF6E.jpeg
 
So after 4000 miles of driving it happened to my m40i

I heard the stone drop into the disc. Made a horrible noise. I pulled over straight away. Reversed a bit and it popped straight out. Guess I was lucky.
 
Got my first stone in the brakes today. Reversed down my friends drive (he’s a farmer not a super posh house) that’s a mile long but it still didn’t come out. Lucky it came out a mile down the road again driving forward. I recorded a video so ill send it to my local Bmw garage to complain.
 
Since my last post in March, it has happened another two times!

Once horrendously at work, recovery came out, send a local non bmw recovery compay bloke
He was useless. Told me he wasn’t allowed to take the wheel off and he needed to recover me. After some arguments and phone calls the wheel was off and it was dislodged (with a screwdriver!). Second time was just driving through a friends estate and picked up a tiny stone which span round and immediately lodged
Again recovery called - ravenscote motors mechanic sent this time - very nice, listened to my story (and stories of before), asked if I’d done the back and forth and hard brake, then said; I’ll get my jack…

I am so bored of this. I then booked it into the dealer for a full wheel removal and examination as there is now a constant squeak and it was potentially pulling slightly on braking hard.
No faults or damage found. Told there was no replacement part as yet but they would log my 3 most recent issues.
 
I feel for you as it has happened to me six times now. Horrible experience. I don’t think BMW have any intention of coming up with a retrofit solution as the same style of M Sport brakes are fitted to several other series models.
All you can do is report it to your dealer and book the car in for examination, otherwise BMW HO will never hear about it. :headbang:
 
You would have hoped BMW would have accepted that there is a fundamental design flaw by now.

If anyone is still doing a DIY fix there are cheaper jacking pads:-

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_nkw=bmw%20jack%20pad&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=710-55005-18975-0&mkcid=2&keyword=bmw%20jack%20pad&crlp=_&MT_ID=&geo_id=&rlsatarget=kwd-81501430809228:loc-188&adpos=&device=c&mktype=&loc=41226&poi=&abcId=&cmpgn=3731
 
I had this happen yesterday, I assumed it was because my car had been sitting all week and needed a run out.
Drove for about 5 miles squealing all the way went over a speed bump and silence.
Reading this now it all makes sense.
At least I know what's happening and some ideas on how to fix it.
 
I had this happen a few times on the NC500 it wouldn’t release with back and forth. I manually pushed the guard back with a longish screwdriver with a fair amount of force and the stone dropped out each time. Don’t know if I was just lucky but I now carry a long flatbladed screwdriver in the bag with the bottle jack and jacking pad
 
This happened to me last month, hadn’t joined here so didn’t know what it was, really loud squealing. I’ve had stones stuck before on other cars, but never as loud as this. Called the garage where I got it from, they said bring it up (40min journey), I said I wasn’t going to drive it, didn’t know what damage was being done. Cut a long story short, picked up on low loader through BMW assist. Taken to closer BMW dealership, big stone taken out and charged £108. Fast forward a few weeks later and another stone, not as loud as the first one (had just joined here), saw this thread and thought, jees, new car with a hidden design fault, great! Was parked up at work, finished work came out, went into reverse (like suggested on here) didn’t have to it must have dropped out when stationary. Anyway, think I will have to annoy the dealership where I got it from, I aint paying over a hundred pounds each time a stone gets stuck, ridiculous!
Seen a few suggestions for do it yourself, anyone have a sure fire way that doesn’t involve taking the wheel off etc. (would do if really necessary).
 
Wulliem12 said:
This happened to me last month, hadn’t joined here so didn’t know what it was, really loud squealing. I’ve had stones stuck before on other cars, but never as loud as this. Called the garage where I got it from, they said bring it up (40min journey), I said I wasn’t going to drive it, didn’t know what damage was being done. Cut a long story short, picked up on low loader through BMW assist. Taken to closer BMW dealership, big stone taken out and charged £108. Fast forward a few weeks later and another stone, not as loud as the first one (had just joined here), saw this thread and thought, jees, new car with a hidden design fault, great! Was parked up at work, finished work came out, went into reverse (like suggested on here) didn’t have to it must have dropped out when stationary. Anyway, think I will have to annoy the dealership where I got it from, I aint paying over a hundred pounds each time a stone gets stuck, ridiculous!
Seen a few suggestions for do it yourself, anyone have a sure fire way that doesn’t involve taking the wheel off etc. (would do if really necessary).

I know your pain. Happened to me six times now. Once that stone gets right down into the gap between the disc and heat shield it is almost impossible to get out without taking the wheel off or getting the car up onto a ramp unless you are lucky enough for it to break up whilst driving the car. :thumbsdown: :headbang:

By the way, I was the one who opened this thread very early on to make others aware of this problem. Seems like BMW are not interested in altering the design to resolve the problem. Very poor show BMW. :thumbsdown:
 
Wulliem12 said:
This happened to me last month, hadn’t joined here so didn’t know what it was, really loud squealing. I’ve had stones stuck before on other cars, but never as loud as this. Called the garage where I got it from, they said bring it up (40min journey), I said I wasn’t going to drive it, didn’t know what damage was being done. Cut a long story short, picked up on low loader through BMW assist. Taken to closer BMW dealership, big stone taken out and charged £108. Fast forward a few weeks later and another stone, not as loud as the first one (had just joined here), saw this thread and thought, jees, new car with a hidden design fault, great! Was parked up at work, finished work came out, went into reverse (like suggested on here) didn’t have to it must have dropped out when stationary. Anyway, think I will have to annoy the dealership where I got it from, I aint paying over a hundred pounds each time a stone gets stuck, ridiculous!
Seen a few suggestions for do it yourself, anyone have a sure fire way that doesn’t involve taking the wheel off etc. (would do if really necessary).

The car is still under warranty till 3 years old. Don’t think I’d have paid to get the stone out, particularly as BMW Assist recovered the car. I would definitely be contacting BMW customer service as there is lots of supporting information available to confirm this is not a one off incident that’s unique to you.

This has happened 3 times to me. Each time I’ve been lucky the slow reverse then forward method has worked.
 
Jim S said:
I think I may have uncovered a design flaw in the M Sport brakes fitted to the new Z4 M40i and other Z4 G29 models fitted with the same brakes. Stones are far too easily getting trapped between the brake disc rotor and the metal heat/protector shield behind the rotor.

In the space of only a few weeks and 800 miles of taking delivery of my brand new Z4 M40i this problem has occurred four times. When it happens it sounds absolutely horrendous. The noise is a very loud high pitched squeal and it sounds like the wheel is just about to fall off. I have also noticed that it usually only happens when the car is slowing down close to stopping. I have a theory for this, which I will explain later.

There is no jack in the car to lift up the wheel to see where the stone is trapped and you either need to try to free it by driving, sometimes several miles and causing damage by scoring the disc rotor, or call out the BMW breakdown service.

In many years of motoring in BMW's and several other brands of cars this is the first time I have ever experienced such a problem. I believe that there is a fundamental design flaw in the structure of the M40i brakes as I will explain below.

Most modern cars have disc brakes and they can develop a lot of heat so the manufacturers incorporate a metal shield right behind the brake rotor to prevent unwanted heat transfer to brake pipes, ball joints and other heat sensitive parts of the car. The shield is also there to prevent stones, debris, water and dirt getting into the brake assembly. Normally, this shield is bent over the top of the rotor to close off the gap where debris and stones can fall into the brake assembly. On the M40i both the front and rear metal shields do not bent over the rotors. In fact the front ones actually bend away from the rotor creating an even bigger gap for stones and debris to fall into the brake assembly. The gap is large enough for small stones and debris to pass through but anything larger than about 1cm (1/2”) in size is likely to get trapped, causing the problem that I am describing in this review.

In the UK, many of the roads are covered in stones washed up out of pot holes and decaying road surfaces so it is very difficult to avoid getting stones thrown up into the wheel arches of our cars. I have also noticed that the Z4 M40i is very prone to throwing up stones and this might have something to do with the 19" Michelin Pilot Super Sport Performance tyres. These two things are exacerbating the problem.

On examining the location of the brake rotors on the M40i it is difficult to understand how the stones are getting into the rotors as the wheel rims are extremely wide and the rotor assembly is near the centre of the rim. Also, the rotors are quite large in diameter so the space between the top of the rotor and wheel rim is quite small, making it very difficult for stones or debris to get thrown directly into the brake assembly.

My theory is that some stones are being thrown onto the wheel rims and the centrifugal force of the wheels rotating causes the stones to stay on the wheel rim until the car slows down at which point they fall down into the gap between the brake rotor and metal shield. Any stone or debris larger than about 1cm is likely to get trapped, particularly since the design of the metal shield does not prevent the stones and debris getting into the brake assembly as it should.

I believe that the problem outlined above is a design flaw in the Z4 M40i brakes and BMW should stand up and take responsibility and offer an immediate remedy for the affected cars. I have already requested my Dealer to take this issue up with BMW.

I would like to hear if any other Z4 G29 owners have had similar problems with their car.
:headbang:
Yep looks like me to! See my post in G29 problems!
 
Jim S said:
Wulliem12 said:
This happened to me last month, hadn’t joined here so didn’t know what it was, really loud squealing. I’ve had stones stuck before on other cars, but never as loud as this. Called the garage where I got it from, they said bring it up (40min journey), I said I wasn’t going to drive it, didn’t know what damage was being done. Cut a long story short, picked up on low loader through BMW assist. Taken to closer BMW dealership, big stone taken out and charged £108. Fast forward a few weeks later and another stone, not as loud as the first one (had just joined here), saw this thread and thought, jees, new car with a hidden design fault, great! Was parked up at work, finished work came out, went into reverse (like suggested on here) didn’t have to it must have dropped out when stationary. Anyway, think I will have to annoy the dealership where I got it from, I aint paying over a hundred pounds each time a stone gets stuck, ridiculous!
Seen a few suggestions for do it yourself, anyone have a sure fire way that doesn’t involve taking the wheel off etc. (would do if really necessary).

I know your pain. Happened to me six times now. Once that stone gets right down into the gap between the disc and heat shield it is almost impossible to get out without taking the wheel off or getting the car up onto a ramp unless you are lucky enough for it to break up whilst driving the car. :thumbsdown: :headbang:

By the way, I was the one who opened this thread very early on to make others aware of this problem. Seems like BMW are not interested in altering the design to resolve the problem. Very poor show BMW. :thumbsdown:

So has anyone got anywhere with this with BMW. It's now happened to me twice in ten days with the most horrendous noise. Can't go on like this as in all the cars I have ever ever owned it has never happened to me before.
 
You need to complain strongly to your Dealer and book the car in for inspection, otherwise it won’t be logged into the BMW system.
In July 2019, just after I had a few experiences with this problem on my car I wrote a strong letter to Mr Graeme Grieve, UK HQ CEO, and attached photos to highlight the most obvious reason for the problem. His reply was that he had been in contact with BMW AG Technical and they said that they had not received sufficient complaints to justify making any changes to the design (or words to that effect). They did offer me some compensation for my troubles. :thumbsdown: :headbang:
 
Jim S said:
Wulliem12 said:
This happened to me last month, hadn’t joined here so didn’t know what it was, really loud squealing. I’ve had stones stuck before on other cars, but never as loud as this. Called the garage where I got it from, they said bring it up (40min journey), I said I wasn’t going to drive it, didn’t know what damage was being done. Cut a long story short, picked up on low loader through BMW assist. Taken to closer BMW dealership, big stone taken out and charged £108. Fast forward a few weeks later and another stone, not as loud as the first one (had just joined here), saw this thread and thought, jees, new car with a hidden design fault, great! Was parked up at work, finished work came out, went into reverse (like suggested on here) didn’t have to it must have dropped out when stationary. Anyway, think I will have to annoy the dealership where I got it from, I aint paying over a hundred pounds each time a stone gets stuck, ridiculous!
Seen a few suggestions for do it yourself, anyone have a sure fire way that doesn’t involve taking the wheel off etc. (would do if really necessary).

I know your pain. Happened to me six times now. Once that stone gets right down into the gap between the disc and heat shield it is almost impossible to get out without taking the wheel off or getting the car up onto a ramp unless you are lucky enough for it to break up whilst driving the car. :thumbsdown: :headbang:

By the way, I was the one who opened this thread very early on to make others aware of this problem. Seems like BMW are not interested in altering the design to resolve the problem. Very poor show BMW. :thumbsdown:

Cheers for starting this thread Jim. I'm in the middle of an email to my dealership and to the man you suggested - Graeme Grieve.
 
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