List of problems.. Back from dealership with more problems..
- Thread starter JDM
- Start date
Absolutely done the right thing.
I completely agree with you. It's not acceptable that the car has these problems and they haven't fixed them and have caused more problems/damage.
I've been lucky with mine, not a thing to complain about apart from the hill assist and subsequent sub standard parking sensors they've put on.
They should replace your car as is your right under these circumstances.
I completely agree with you. It's not acceptable that the car has these problems and they haven't fixed them and have caused more problems/damage.
I've been lucky with mine, not a thing to complain about apart from the hill assist and subsequent sub standard parking sensors they've put on.
They should replace your car as is your right under these circumstances.
I feel your pain fella, its not been my most reliable car, still love it, but its tainted the BMW experience and I'm not likely to stick with the brand.
Just one note:
• The auto start stop is temperamental. Sometimes it will cut out at as it should do but then at the next stop it doesn’t.
Thats normal operation for auto start/stop. The car engine will only shut down after its warmed up, the battery charge is over a certain level, outside temp, the amount of time since the last stop of the engine, etc etc, lots of things on that list that state when it will and won't shut off the engine. I've driven quite a lot of start stop cars and they're all the same, some times it will shut down, then at the next stop or the stop after that it won't, for one of the reasons listed above.
Just one note:
• The auto start stop is temperamental. Sometimes it will cut out at as it should do but then at the next stop it doesn’t.
Thats normal operation for auto start/stop. The car engine will only shut down after its warmed up, the battery charge is over a certain level, outside temp, the amount of time since the last stop of the engine, etc etc, lots of things on that list that state when it will and won't shut off the engine. I've driven quite a lot of start stop cars and they're all the same, some times it will shut down, then at the next stop or the stop after that it won't, for one of the reasons listed above.
sp3ctre said:
They are lovely cars, but you'll be lucky to get one without issues. Depends how picky you are though. Personally, looking back, if I'd have known what stress was coming to me, I'd have opted for another car. Having gone through what I have, mine's in tip top state now, fingers x'd it stays that way. If you're happy with what you have, and its not causing you hassle.. stick with it.
But don't forget we generally tend to hear about problems as that's when people post.
How many owners just come on and stick a post on saying they've had no trouble with their new car? I haven't had any troubles with mine and I wouldn't have posted to say so, we only tend to post when we want advice or to sound off about something that's gone wrong.
It would be interesting to see some actual figures of people who had experienced problems and who haven't.
How many owners just come on and stick a post on saying they've had no trouble with their new car? I haven't had any troubles with mine and I wouldn't have posted to say so, we only tend to post when we want advice or to sound off about something that's gone wrong.
It would be interesting to see some actual figures of people who had experienced problems and who haven't.
beatle boy
Member
I really feel sorry for you and all the hassle you are experiencing ... BMW should replace car or refund without question. Keep us all posted on outcome. Good luck.
Best of luck John, I don't blame you for taking this course of action.
I'm sceptical you'll be able to reject the car but I hope I'm wrong. I think I would try to do exactly as you have but at the end of the day the car drives ok, hasn't broken down on you for example, although it leaks a little its not a deluge etc and can probably be fixed, its just that your dealer has so far seemed incapable of doing it. I'm no lawyer but I reckon you'd struggle to force through a refund because bad as it is that this happens on a £35k-odd car, it probably isn't bad ENOUGH to be able to justify a refund.
Having said all of that the dealer might opt to cut their losses and as a goodwill gesture exchange your car.
Good luck though
I'm sceptical you'll be able to reject the car but I hope I'm wrong. I think I would try to do exactly as you have but at the end of the day the car drives ok, hasn't broken down on you for example, although it leaks a little its not a deluge etc and can probably be fixed, its just that your dealer has so far seemed incapable of doing it. I'm no lawyer but I reckon you'd struggle to force through a refund because bad as it is that this happens on a £35k-odd car, it probably isn't bad ENOUGH to be able to justify a refund.
Having said all of that the dealer might opt to cut their losses and as a goodwill gesture exchange your car.
Good luck though
As Carol has said peopler dont usually post if they dont have problems and that means me I guess because I have had a (from new) 35is for 15 months and apart from dancing windows which doesnt bother me and a very intermitant rattle from behind somewhere which does bother me when it occurs but is so intermittant that I dont really believe that the dealer will be able to find/fix it (it can be weeks between occurances and I wouldnt leave my car with them for that long) and as Nick has found (sadly) having the interior taken apart is pretty much guaranteed to get it damaged so havent done anything about it , the car has been fine .
That being said I know from reading this forum some people have had quite nasty shocks / times with their Z4's and I do feel sorry because its not what you would expect at this level.
I suspect that Nick may have issues in trying to reject car based on the expriences of a friend of mine who tried to reject his e46 M3 a few years ago the upshot of that being it was eventually swapped for a newish used version which he owned for about 18 months and hasnt owned another BMW since
Just to say I have ben an avid reader of this forum for many years having 3 Z4s (2 x Z4M coupes previously) and one of the things that I get satisfaction from is that everyone here are pretty cool people so (hopefully) that means I am to!
Cheers
Chas
That being said I know from reading this forum some people have had quite nasty shocks / times with their Z4's and I do feel sorry because its not what you would expect at this level.
I suspect that Nick may have issues in trying to reject car based on the expriences of a friend of mine who tried to reject his e46 M3 a few years ago the upshot of that being it was eventually swapped for a newish used version which he owned for about 18 months and hasnt owned another BMW since
Just to say I have ben an avid reader of this forum for many years having 3 Z4s (2 x Z4M coupes previously) and one of the things that I get satisfaction from is that everyone here are pretty cool people so (hopefully) that means I am to!
Cheers
Chas
Quote from Government website...
When you buy something, you have certain rights under consumer law. For example, the goods you’ve bought must be:
fit for purpose. They do what they're supposed to do
of satisfactory quality. They aren't broken or faulty
match their description. They look the way they were described to you.
If things go wrong with the goods or service you've bought, the contract you’ve made with the trader might be broken. This is called breach of contract.
J is within his rights as the car isn't of satisfactory quality and it is also faulty.
They are obliged to change it for him because of this. A refund on the other hand you may have to put up a fight for if that's what you want to do but you'd stand a good chance because of the above consumer law.
When you buy something, you have certain rights under consumer law. For example, the goods you’ve bought must be:
fit for purpose. They do what they're supposed to do
of satisfactory quality. They aren't broken or faulty
match their description. They look the way they were described to you.
If things go wrong with the goods or service you've bought, the contract you’ve made with the trader might be broken. This is called breach of contract.
J is within his rights as the car isn't of satisfactory quality and it is also faulty.
They are obliged to change it for him because of this. A refund on the other hand you may have to put up a fight for if that's what you want to do but you'd stand a good chance because of the above consumer law.
Really really sorry to read about your saga John. I am (touches lots of wood) in the same boat as Carol. No issues to report so far after 6 weeks of ownership. In fact my prior car (hill start saga) only had a very slight rattle over sharp bumps. It is so true that people (including me) only tend to post when they have issues.
I think you have been very unlucky and good luck in getting to a resolution. If the dealer is half way decent you should be in a replacement within a couple of months. Mind you it shouldn't have got this far.
I think you have been very unlucky and good luck in getting to a resolution. If the dealer is half way decent you should be in a replacement within a couple of months. Mind you it shouldn't have got this far.
A
Anonymous
Guest
I'm nearly at the same point with my leak - but as of this morning the dealer is finally making some progress so I've held off for now, but am not too far away from rejecting mine, so I am interested in the outcome of this.
I wouldn't want a refund cos that wouldn't allow me to buy another one due to the jan-mar discount I got, so a replacement would be my choice.
I understand from another forum though that that are within their rights to do either.
It just seems wrong to me that some people have had their cars replaced for higher spec (i.e. automatic) due to the hill start issue, yet those of us with faulty cars PLUS the hillstart issue might be forced to fight!
I think you have to give them a reasonable amount of chances to fix the problem, I've read that it is 3. They've got my car now...its 5th visit!
They've had your car twice, so they might say they want it again. You could stand your ground, or let them have it a 3rd time on the firm understanding that if it comes back and is still not right, then its rejected.
My take on these cars is simple : they are NEW cars - its accesptable for a few niggles, but not for them to remain unfixed, they are £30k - £40k cars - it is reasonable to expect such a priced car to be without faults and finally they are BMW's - it is reasonable to expect (due to the price premium and brand image) better quality.
The op's trim and subsequent further damage isn't BMW's fault...its the fault of that dealer and engineer. The other issues havent been rectified so he is within rights to expect another car. It will have to be built but I'm of the opinion that I wouldn't mind about my leak if I knew a new car was on its way!
Some people are more fussy than others, and some will let certain things slide, but at the end of the day these are £30k++ NEW BMW's and so shouldn't have any faults.
I wouldn't want a refund cos that wouldn't allow me to buy another one due to the jan-mar discount I got, so a replacement would be my choice.
I understand from another forum though that that are within their rights to do either.
It just seems wrong to me that some people have had their cars replaced for higher spec (i.e. automatic) due to the hill start issue, yet those of us with faulty cars PLUS the hillstart issue might be forced to fight!
I think you have to give them a reasonable amount of chances to fix the problem, I've read that it is 3. They've got my car now...its 5th visit!
They've had your car twice, so they might say they want it again. You could stand your ground, or let them have it a 3rd time on the firm understanding that if it comes back and is still not right, then its rejected.
My take on these cars is simple : they are NEW cars - its accesptable for a few niggles, but not for them to remain unfixed, they are £30k - £40k cars - it is reasonable to expect such a priced car to be without faults and finally they are BMW's - it is reasonable to expect (due to the price premium and brand image) better quality.
The op's trim and subsequent further damage isn't BMW's fault...its the fault of that dealer and engineer. The other issues havent been rectified so he is within rights to expect another car. It will have to be built but I'm of the opinion that I wouldn't mind about my leak if I knew a new car was on its way!
Some people are more fussy than others, and some will let certain things slide, but at the end of the day these are £30k++ NEW BMW's and so shouldn't have any faults.
oke:
A
Anonymous
Guest
In money or stress?
I am deliberately playing devils advocate here so what I am about to say isn't my actual opinion (I'd be doing exactly as John is) but.....
Is this really faulty ENOUGH? It drives okay, delivers the performance it was supposed to, the roof goes up and down when requested etc. There are minor niggles (and a lot of them) but I don't think collectively these are enough to win a court case for a refund and I think in legal terms arguing the car is not fit for purpose based on the faults John has described would be difficult too.
I think you'd also need to allow the dealer more than two attempts to rectify particularly as some of the faults John refers to in the letter have occurred since the last visit.
Is this really faulty ENOUGH? It drives okay, delivers the performance it was supposed to, the roof goes up and down when requested etc. There are minor niggles (and a lot of them) but I don't think collectively these are enough to win a court case for a refund and I think in legal terms arguing the car is not fit for purpose based on the faults John has described would be difficult too.
I think you'd also need to allow the dealer more than two attempts to rectify particularly as some of the faults John refers to in the letter have occurred since the last visit.
Cheers guys and girls. Not heard anything yet fom them but I guess I can't expect them to respond straight away. I just feel that the car is not right. Things keep cropping up with it. Yes the majority are only niggles but it's not right.
If you bought a £50 shirt and noticed it had a button missing, would the shop sew you a button on or give you a new shirt? Same principle in my eyes. Y :x
If you bought a £50 shirt and noticed it had a button missing, would the shop sew you a button on or give you a new shirt? Same principle in my eyes. Y :x
Best of luck John, in this instance you really need the dealer on your side to put your case to BMW. I would however be very surprised if they provide a refund or exchange as most of the faults are niggly ones which should be within the dealers competence to sort out, although put together is a real turn off for you. I would imagine BMW will send an assessor out to your dealer to work with them to get the faults rectified. Personally I would give them another chance to sort the probs as I reckon they will say they haven't had enough goes, If they still can't sort all the probs then push for a replacement car as this will be easier than trying to secure a cash refund and may turn to be a very drawn out affair. Not sure if having BMW finance helps your case though. Do you really want to go down the legal route?
The only time I was successful with rejecting a new car was due to it being a cosmetic fault which was on a new Peugeot 207 CC, the silver paint work was blotchy all over in bright sun and looked terrible, clearly a complete respray was unacceptable on a new car. I think with yours they will say the niggles can be sorted.
Hope I'm wrong and good luck if you feel you want to reject
Tim.
The only time I was successful with rejecting a new car was due to it being a cosmetic fault which was on a new Peugeot 207 CC, the silver paint work was blotchy all over in bright sun and looked terrible, clearly a complete respray was unacceptable on a new car. I think with yours they will say the niggles can be sorted.
Hope I'm wrong and good luck if you feel you want to reject
Tim.
I really feel for you and it certainly takes away all the enjoyment of owning a new car. Only problem I've had with new E89 is faulty water pump and I'm lucky enough to have a great local dealer who diagnosed problem on Friday and I got car back today. I was so worried about car being left at dealers but instructed them not to wash it and also that I wanted it kept indoors! When hubby picked it up today he was informed "the car has not been washed and has been kept inside as per your wife's instructions". I hope you get this sorted really soon and put behind you so that you can really enjoy the car - which you should be!
