Lifetime oil? Why?

Okay so I see very clearly that bmw doesn't want me changing my transmission fluid. I can very clearly see that bmw does not want want me to service my differential.

What I wanna know, is have any of you done these services?

What fluids did you use?

Did it prolong your transmission and differential life?

And if you don't do these services, why not?

In my honest opinion, I think the only reason any car manufacturer would do these things, is to force you into spending thousands of dollars in parts, or buying a newer vehicle. However, if I'm missing something here let me know.
 
I've no idea - it seems like a daft idea to me, but maybe it's enough to last the warranty. :roll:

I had the transmission oil in my E46 325ti replaced at 102K miles and my 2nd Z4 at 81K as part of a service - the invoices just show "MTF". I can't comment on prolonging their life as I didn't keep either of them too much longer, but I would have thought it must help.

I didn't get the differential oil replaced as I'm pretty sure my Indy told me they had no drain plug.

But my MC had fresh oil in both as part of its Inspection 2 service.
 
JustWantAclassic said:
Okay so I see very clearly that bmw doesn't want me changing my transmission fluid. I can very clearly see that bmw does not want want me to service my differential.

What I wanna know, is have any of you done these services?

Manufactures call this "planned obsolescence" However the items you refer to have both drain and fill plugs.

What fluids did you use?

Did it prolong your transmission and differential life?

And if you don't do these services, why not?

In my honest opinion, I think the only reason any car manufacturer would do these things, is to force you into spending thousands of dollars in parts, or buying a newer vehicle. However, if I'm missing something here let me know.

Manufacturers call this planned obsolescence. However the items you refer to have both drain and fill plugs, and reading through previous posts on this forum a change to both the gearbox and differential oils does make a subtle difference to the functioning.
 
Getrag and ZF estimate the life of a transmission to be about 7 yrs so technically they are telling the truth :P
Yes, you must change trans and diff fluids, depending on what car you have your handbook should say what kind.
 
it wasn’t always so. bmw always recommended regular oil changes and diff and tranny fluid changes but in the early 2000’s…bmw added several years of free scheduled maintenance with every new car and the intervals all changed. instead of oil changes every 5K mikes, it became 12k miles and certain fluids were labeled “lifetime” fill where that meant 7 years or 100,000 miles.
 
On thee ///M models it's an Ins II item to change both. On other E85/6 models I don't think it is, but others on the forum have changed them, So I think it is doable and a good idea. :thumbsup:
 
The problem with part of you question is that you can’t compare 2 different scenarios on the same car. So you can’t have one person saying that extra servicing did lengthen the life of their gearbox/diff if they can’t also do exactly the same driving without servicing. How many people have 2 identical cars, that are driven EXACTLY the same, over 100k miles?

For example, my Z4MC has an inspection every year, along with 3 or 4 oil changes…but this annual inspection is more like an Inspection 2 as I do spark plugs, gearbox & diff oils too. Mine is on 160,000 miles, but I can’t tell you wether the ‘over servicing’ has benefited it or not as I had a diff replaced under warranty at 70k miles (it had a slight whine), and it was replaced again at 150k miles after an accident. Gearbox is still original. Engine did 140k miles before it had bearing damage.

I don’t know what that info tell you, but there you go :thumbsup:
 
mmm-five said:
The problem with part of you question is that you can’t compare 2 different scenarios on the same car. So you can’t have one person saying that extra servicing did lengthen the life of their gearbox/diff if they can’t also do exactly the same driving without servicing. How many people have 2 identical cars, that are driven EXACTLY the same, over 100k miles?

Fair enough but still curious to hear other people's experiences.
 
I’ve had the automatic transmission’s oil changed at 30k miles and will do it again at 60k. At that time I didn’t have access to lifts, so doing it myself was out of the question. After reading all evidence for/against changing the oils and pros/cons of specific methods, I chose the flushing method, i.e. dealership’s service, to get the cooling lines and cooler covered as well. Nowadays I have lifts in my garage, but I think I’ll go with the flushing method again, although the idea of cleaning the oil pan from sludge is tempting.

Changed the diff oils at 50k myself, which was an easy task. Visually the old oil didn’t look that bad at all.
 
JustWantAclassic said:
mmm-five said:
The problem with part of you question is that you can’t compare 2 different scenarios on the same car. So you can’t have one person saying that extra servicing did lengthen the life of their gearbox/diff if they can’t also do exactly the same driving without servicing. How many people have 2 identical cars, that are driven EXACTLY the same, over 100k miles?

Fair enough but still curious to hear other people's experiences.

Just do it change all the fluids and reap the benefits. :D
 
…and to answer the ”why” part of OP’s question, intending to keep the car way longer than the BMW’s definition of lifetime, 7 years.
 
BTZ461 said:
However the items you refer to have both drain and fill plugs

Diffs on the standard Z4s lost the drain plug around 2007 IIRC (I have a 2006 that still has one and went to check before I bought oil.)

Lifetime oil is an interesting thing. I hadn't realised that BMW had gone to a free maintenance model which does explain the outbreak of them. However, realisitically, diffs and manual gearboxes aren't particularly hard on oil in passenger cars. To a fair degree they'd run for a long time if they were just filled with jam so the idea of an oil that's left alone for 20 years isn't particularly hard to swallow. At the end of the day it's just a bunch of gears sat in a bowl of oil.

I changed the diff and gearbox oils in my 2.5 recently at 95k and 16 years. There was nothing particularly nasty about the old stuff and new oil might have made the gearchange a bit sweeter but it's pretty marginal and, crucially, Jo Soap owner number 4/5/6 wouldn't neither know nor care. Once cars become cheap maintenance goes out the window and, bar the small bucket of enthusiasts, few would bother even if mechanics suggested it.

I have been lambasted left and right on here about the high mileages of my other cars ( :rofl: :D ) and the one thing that's going to kill my 275k 320d isn't old diff oil (although I did change it at 160k) but rust (going a bit crispy), sudden failure of turbo (original) or finally wearing thru the clutch (also original) on a car that's worth less than the contents of its fuel tank (poor thing.)

Autoboxes are almost little different but they are harder on their oils. I changed the X5 oil at 150k'ish (and, to reiterate, 15 years old, long after the point at which it's just a few grand of 2nd hand car) and it wasn't horrendous. Presumably the additives were still working and nothing had chemically broken down as it wasn't a stew of burnt clutch plates. However, the one important thing is that there is a filter that does collect these bits of material and not changing that is A Bad Idea. Fresh oil in an auto can only be a good thing too so that is something that ought to go back on the schedule.

One final point, in industry changing oil is done by time because of static engines, etc, and, by comparison, cars run for nowhere near as long, maybe 500 hours a year. Cranes and other things doing a damn sight harder job probably have a gearbox schedule of 2500 hours. That'd be 5 years for a car but, as said, it's just not stressed enough so, realistically, it would be many times this. Long after the rest of it is iron oxide again....
 
DMike said:
but I think I’ll go with the flushing method again, although the idea of cleaning the oil pan from sludge is tempting.

Doing the filter is an important thing. I've done 2 autoboxes with nothing more than jacks and ramps and they're not that hard, just messy. You can drain the oil, take off the pan, drop and empty the valve body and get 95% of the oil out of the system directly which saves waste, especially with the expensive ZF oil!
 
The primary focus for car manufacturers is to get through the warranty period / lease period without breakdowns and minimising service costs.

So for example the old 600/1000 mile initial run in oil change is long gone, but, it would be a very good idea for ultimate long life.

Ditto extended oil change intervals.

ZF contradict BMW by stating that their gear boxes should have their fluids change in the region of 50k-75k miles.

There’s no great mystery or conspiracies.

Subject to mechanical competence there is never an argument about frequent serving based on time and distance and of course environmental factors as well as how you drive. :thumbsup:
 
B21 said:
Gearbox is still original

That statement there actually tells me quite a lot. Being a nissan technician, they only expect their transmissions to last at most 120k miles and they usually slip a belt in 60-80,000. The ex Hyundai technicians at my dealer say Hyundai expects no more than 60,000 miles from a transmission!!! So hearing that yours is still kicking at over 150k miles with regular service, gives me some serious peace of mind.

After having an old 1996 cutlas, 2007 Silverado, 1999 s10, 2006 Saturn ion (I know I've owned a lot of trash) all with original transmissions over 200k miles it irks me to see the lowered expectations of car manufacturers in the modern age.
 
Assuming you've got the standard 5/6 speed auto rather than the SMG box then it's in the oil pan on the bottom of the gearbox. It's a standard ZF 5HP19 used in many didn't different cars so there must be a million DIY videos and guides on the web
 
FWIW I know off several E89s and E85s that are running really well past 125k miles…

My friends E89 23i is past 130k miles..but when I sit in it when he’s driving it feels like it could be a 25k 3 year old car..the only major outlay on his was new suspension dampers n springs all round..

One E89 28i was shown running past 500k miles..with only oil changes and pads and tyres.. :driving: :driving: :driving:
 
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