KWV3’s fitted

[john-e89]

Popped the coil overs on and spent this morning fine tuning them....one of the perks of being self employed...All went smoothly fitting them, the only difficult bit really was getting the thick rubber seat for the rear springs onto the new ones, the KW’s are wound a little too tightly at their base and were an absolute pig to get the rubber onto, lots of swearing and washing up liquid plus large pump pliers finally got them on. I wouldn’t have wanted to fit these on my back with the car on axle stands, been there done that, so having a ramp is a gods send, same goes for fine tuning of them. I went with the factory settings to begin with but after a run I wound them all back to their softest and went from there, the factory settings are a touch hard, maybe they’d be ok for a totally stock car but this has M3 front arms, H&R front anti roll bar and a strut brace. Anyhoo, after approx 6 runs I’ve got it pretty much perfect for how I like it, in fact that’s it, I’m leaving it as is. I’ve set it for quite soft with aggressive rebound. It’s now dropped 30mm over the standard pervious sport springs so 20mm lower than the M sport 35i/is cars. It’s plenty low enough at that as far as I’m concerned .

So the result...well quite honestly it’s the old night and day saying again, but it simply is. Gone is the crashy ride even with pretty new stock shocks and springs that were fitted, the interior is quieter as regards to creaks and a couple of rattles over rough roads, the road through our village is shocking frankly. It’s tight, so much better control, get the settings right and there’s no bounce, just superbly controlled bump and rebound, it’s flat round bends, just a totally different car with no harshness, firm but supple. The quality of the units is superb. I always happy to admit if I’ve bought the wrong things but as with quality tools these are worth the outlay imho.

FOR:
Ride quality
Suppleness
Control
Better steering feel
Adjustability
Quality of the units
No movement under hard braking

AGAINST:
Quite honestly nothing.

Conclusion is if you have the funds don’t hesitate, these utterly transform an E89. :driving:

 

[Stevo1987]

Nice spannering! I take it you are fully mended again?

 

[john-e89]

Nice spannering! I take it you are fully mended again?

Pretty much Steveo yes....the shoulder tells me if I’m doing too much but on the whole it’s back to normal thanks.

 

[sunnydays]

They look good John. Makes sense that you have them at the softest setting. The stock ride on these cars is so hard.

 

[john-e89]

They look good John. Makes sense that you have them at the softest setting. The stock ride on these cars is so hard.

Not quite softest Sunny, 3 clicks on from softest. The thing with these is the springs are a much better poundage, cant remember off the top of my head what they are, so you do need to dial in a little stiffness, I tried them at full soft with more rebound but they were still a little too bouncy. They feel much more like the G29 springs, stiff but compliant. It’ll never compete with a G29 which I knew, but it’s not so far off you can’t make a comparison.

 

[Nictrix]

Couple of stupid questions coming up.....
Why are they called coilovers?
And the rear springs with the coils being so close together will they have the potential to make a bit of noise?

 

[john-e89]

Couple of stupid questions coming up.....
Why are they called coilovers?
And the rear springs with the coils being so close together will they have the potential to make a bit of noise?

1: Absolutely no idea tbh.... :lol:

2: Yes, and apparently they do, although I’m only 20mm off standard rear ride height so maybe they won’t. MrPT on here has put some cable management on his springs with 100% success so I’ll do that if they do click. No issues yet though. The rear springs look totally ridiculous with the shock attached dont they..... :lol:

 

[Nictrix]

Couple of stupid questions coming up.....
Why are they called coilovers?
And the rear springs with the coils being so close together will they have the potential to make a bit of noise?

1: Absolutely no idea tbh.... :lol:

2: Yes, and apparently they do, although I’m only 20mm off standard rear ride height so maybe they won’t. MrPT on here has put some cable management on his springs with 100% success so I’ll do that if they do click. No issues yet though.

Cheers.
Before seeing everything fitted I would have guessed that coilovers had the spring around the shock like most fronts but obviously not.

 

[john-e89]

Couple of stupid questions coming up.....
Why are they called coilovers?
And the rear springs with the coils being so close together will they have the potential to make a bit of noise?

1: Absolutely no idea tbh.... :lol:

2: Yes, and apparently they do, although I’m only 20mm off standard rear ride height so maybe they won’t. MrPT on here has put some cable management on his springs with 100% success so I’ll do that if they do click. No issues yet though.

Cheers.
Before seeing everything fitted I would have guessed that coilovers had the spring around the shock like most fronts but obviously not.

No tbh they’re just like regular springs and shocks but with ride height, bump and rebound adjustable. There’s nothing more to fitting them than standard either in the standard locations. What a difference though...

 

[Argyll Andy]

John, glad you’re happy with these.

Did you have standard or adaptive on this before?

If standard do the adaptives on mine sit somewhere between them and these or are these also a huge improvement on adaptives.

I think mine sits reasonably well but my adaptives were replaces just before I got mine.

 

[john-e89]

John, glad you’re happy with these.

Did you have standard or adaptive on this before?

If standard do the adaptives on mine sit somewhere between them and these or are these also a huge improvement on adaptives.

I think mine sits reasonably well but my adaptives were replaces just before I got mine.

Thanks Andy...

It had just the standard sport springs and non adaptive shocks, so your car would have been 10mm lower than mine before the swap as you use M sport springs. Is the M sport half way between the two...? Tbh Andy no, not even close, really the adaptives are softer in comfort than mine was, but stiffer in sport as you’d expect but even in sport the adaptives are a world away from these KW’s, I’m not having a pop at the adaptives, in fact the shocks are good, it’s the springs that aren’t imho, too stiff to start with, plus you can’t adjust the rebound on the standard adaptives. If you had a drive in this you’d immediately see what I mean. If I ever have another 35is I’d rip the adaptives out and put these in without a seconds hesitation, they’re just so so much better than any standard 35i/is suspension. All imo obvs but I can only say what I find.

 

[Argyll Andy]

John, glad you’re happy with these.

Did you have standard or adaptive on this before?

If standard do the adaptives on mine sit somewhere between them and these or are these also a huge improvement on adaptives.

I think mine sits reasonably well but my adaptives were replaces just before I got mine.

Thanks Andy...

It had just the standard sport springs and non adaptive shocks, so your car would have been 10mm lower than mine before the swap as you use M sport springs. Is the M sport half way between the two...? Tbh Andy no, not even close, really the adaptives are softer in comfort than mine was, but stiffer in sport as you’d expect but even in sport the adaptives are a world away from these KW’s, I’m not having a pop at the adaptives, in fact the shocks are good, it’s the springs that aren’t imho, too stiff to start with, plus you can’t adjust the rebound on the standard adaptives. If you had a drive in this you’d immediately see what I mean. If I ever have another 35is I’d rip the adaptives out and put these in without a seconds hesitation, they’re just so so much better than any standard 35i/is suspension. All imo obvs but I can only say what I find.

Thanks John. I had an inkling that there would still be a big difference between mine and your new set up. Only haven driven the 23i SE before I don’t really have much to compare the 35 too.

I’m just doing a bit of forward thinking because after seeing how much the replacement adaptives were I think I’ll be looking at another solution if they need done again

 

[john-e89]

John, glad you’re happy with these.

Did you have standard or adaptive on this before?

If standard do the adaptives on mine sit somewhere between them and these or are these also a huge improvement on adaptives.

I think mine sits reasonably well but my adaptives were replaces just before I got mine.

Thanks Andy...

It had just the standard sport springs and non adaptive shocks, so your car would have been 10mm lower than mine before the swap as you use M sport springs. Is the M sport half way between the two...? Tbh Andy no, not even close, really the adaptives are softer in comfort than mine was, but stiffer in sport as you’d expect but even in sport the adaptives are a world away from these KW’s, I’m not having a pop at the adaptives, in fact the shocks are good, it’s the springs that aren’t imho, too stiff to start with, plus you can’t adjust the rebound on the standard adaptives. If you had a drive in this you’d immediately see what I mean. If I ever have another 35is I’d rip the adaptives out and put these in without a seconds hesitation, they’re just so so much better than any standard 35i/is suspension. All imo obvs but I can only say what I find.

Thanks John. I had an inkling that there would still be a big difference between mine and your new set up. Only haven driven the 23i SE before I don’t really have much to compare the 35 too.

I’m just doing a bit of forward thinking because after seeing how much the replacement adaptives were I think I’ll be looking at another solution if they need done again

It’s a shame you’re so far away Andy you’d be welcome to have a try in this.

I’ve never been a fan of the 35i/s in standard trim, awesome car let down by shoddy suspension and stupidly ridiculous run flats when compared to non run flats so a change to MPSS’s non run flats went some way to addressing the problem, but that problem never went away, even on a brand new car, it still had a weight transfer akin to a large drum of water in the boot transferring weight mid corner, so it went from initial understeer to mid corner oversteer once the back end, roof weight I imagine, decided to catch up. A shame because as I said the E89 is an awesome car hampered by the suspension. I’m quite shocked at the difference these have made tbh, on smooth road the E85 M roady is quite a weapon even in standard trim. rough roads it’s shocking but on smooth it’s superb, tight and controlled, this is now better than an M, no question, it handles and corners like the M but deals with the rough so much better. Of course an M on KW’s will get ahead again I’m sure.... :lol: But no, this is no longer like an E89, and it’s for the better it isn’t.

 

[Argyll Andy]

Thanks Andy...

It had just the standard sport springs and non adaptive shocks, so your car would have been 10mm lower than mine before the swap as you use M sport springs. Is the M sport half way between the two...? Tbh Andy no, not even close, really the adaptives are softer in comfort than mine was, but stiffer in sport as you’d expect but even in sport the adaptives are a world away from these KW’s, I’m not having a pop at the adaptives, in fact the shocks are good, it’s the springs that aren’t imho, too stiff to start with, plus you can’t adjust the rebound on the standard adaptives. If you had a drive in this you’d immediately see what I mean. If I ever have another 35is I’d rip the adaptives out and put these in without a seconds hesitation, they’re just so so much better than any standard 35i/is suspension. All imo obvs but I can only say what I find.

Thanks John. I had an inkling that there would still be a big difference between mine and your new set up. Only haven driven the 23i SE before I don’t really have much to compare the 35 too.

I’m just doing a bit of forward thinking because after seeing how much the replacement adaptives were I think I’ll be looking at another solution if they need done again

It’s a shame you’re so far away Andy you’d be welcome to have a try in this.

I’ve never been a fan of the 35i/s in standard trim, awesome car let down by shoddy suspension and stupidly ridiculous run flats when compared to non run flats so a change to MPSS’s non run flats went some way to addressing the problem, but that problem never went away, even on a brand new car, it still had a weight transfer akin to a large drum of water in the boot transferring weight mid corner, so it went from initial understeer to mid corner oversteer once the back end, roof weight I imagine, decided to catch up. A shame because as I said the E89 is an awesome car hampered by the suspension. I’m quite shocked at the difference these have made tbh, on smooth road the E85 M roady is quite a weapon even in standard trim. rough roads it’s shocking but on smooth it’s superb, tight and controlled, this is now better than an M, no question, it handles and corners like the M but deals with the rough so much better. Of course an M on KW’s will get ahead again I’m sure.... :lol: But no, this is no longer like an E89, and it’s for the better it isn’t.

Yes it is a shame, we might cross paths at some point for me to get a look.

I have at least addressed some of the problem by getting it onto MPS4S’s not long after I got home. But even then I did experience a bit of weight transfer. The speed of course didn’t alleviate that in any way :rofl:

I’m back off on a road trip again this weekend and going to Inverness via Glen Coe then some of the NC500 so I’ll get a chance to see how it handles, weather permitting

 

[Anonymous]

Andy, several of us have fitted the Bilstein B8 dampers to N20 E89s with very impressive results too..

You can either buy the damper or a damper n spring combo ..

They are much cheaper than KWV3s...

The fact they are a fixed set up with no ‘tuning’ options may be seen as a good or bad thing..

I personally not aware of any 35i guys that have used them...

I know every time I talk about the relative weight differences of the N20 versus N54 there is a flame war..

So my only point is that whereas the Bilstein has proven to work very well on N20 versions whether Bilstein would work as well on the N54 with more weight both in front and more weight in front of the front axle..

My interpretation for what’s it’s worth is that almost any change to a quality suspension provider is a very positive result..

Some people also rave about Konis.

Interesting that people on E85/E86 don’t rate the Bilstein products as highly as the E89 guys..

I run my B8s on stock MSport OE springs and for me they are about as good a compromise as you can get between ride/handling/comfort.... markedly superior to the OE dampers..

Of course many people who are swapping out on older cars at 75,000+ miles is that the OE dampers are probably well past there sell by date anyway..so anything would seem to be a positive improvement..

On the 35i if it has adaptive dampers then you need to factor getting the error when removed coded out..

 

[enuff_zed]

Well given the amount of tweaking you've done, and the results you have, everything must be well.
But the rear springs look almost coil bound to me?
From the photo you'd think only the top and bottom coil are actually working?

 

[Argyll Andy]

On the 35i if it has adaptive dampers then you need to factor getting the error when removed coded out..

Cheers Peter, is this an easy thing for someone who knows how to do it and has the equipment/ability to do and is it expensive?

 

[Anonymous]

I think the coding is an expert level but not costly in itself ..the bmw s/w gurus would be the ones to ask..

 

[MACK]

John looks like your turning this into a very nice little car. If I'm reading things right though has it only got the new ARB on the front or also the rear? Overall how would you say it now compares with your previous E89s?

For those who haven't got the budget for KWV3 kit, of just dont want the hassle of adjustable shocks. Then I can thoroughly recommend the Bilstein/EIbach B12 Kit. Made a huge difference to my 20i M Sport and are well worth the circa £600. In short the handlings improved, there's less roll and its also more compliant than the M Sport stuff.
The E89's, particularly the I4 engined cars are really good value and with a few well chosen mods there's a pretty decent sports car in there trying to get out. Suspension, Tyres and by all accounts ARB's and M3 Front Arms really transform things.
It's almost like BMW thought "lets build a good little sports car as a base, then do our best to fook it all up so we've got an SLK in drag!" :rofl:

 

[keving1]

On the 35i if it has adaptive dampers then you need to factor getting the error when removed coded out..

Cheers Peter, is this an easy thing for someone who knows how to do it and has the equipment/ability to do and is it expensive?

I did a "How to" on this a while ago, it is fairly simply to do. See post below...
https://z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=46&t=101129