Its a re-map Jim, but not as you know it (One man's E89 N20 Dyno Tuning)

[enuff_zed]

For info I've written a detailed email to both Celtic and the dealer who fitted the re-map along with the charts..I can see from a trace report that its been delivered to both and the dealer has opened up the email..

We'll see what gives..

opcorn:

 

[PixelPeepZ4]

great write up, interesting read - and again, stunning colour

 

[Anonymous]

great write up, interesting read - and again, stunning colour

Thank you ...Atacama Yellow....the best .. :driving:

 

[craig3.2]

Nice work,Peter.
Looks like the correct place to go,and it does have a good spread of power and torque now
The Yellow peril just got quicker :driving:
Nice one.
You got much more to do to it,or is that it for now?
.....you have been busier than me probably, with the work you have done to it recently.
Its nice,having spent a chunk of money,at seeing some end result from it,isn't it

Hi Craig, to be honest I was doubting that travelling to Sunderland and spending £500 was going to be worth it..especially as even they said that sometimes they struggle to better other people's tunes..but with the de-cat I didn't want to take any chances..however.. :driving:

My real work dried up at the beginning of March so idle hands gives me time to mess around and tinker in a way for the last 25 years I really haven't had that much spare time for 'hobbies'..

Was pondering one of these babies for a Christmas present to moi? :rofl:

https://www.bimmerworld.com/Exhaust/BMW-Turbo-Parts-Kits/MHI-N20-N26-Big-Turbo-BMW-F30-328i-F32-428i-F22-228i.html

Haha,big turbo.....good for several more horses :driving:

Keep going and you will be into 30/35i territory,lol.

Cant beat some firced induction....love the ESS stage 2 supercharger giving circa 525bho on the M's..
Prices are high at the minute on them though.

 

[Anonymous]

Nice work,Peter.
Looks like the correct place to go,and it does have a good spread of power and torque now
The Yellow peril just got quicker :driving:
Nice one.
You got much more to do to it,or is that it for now?
.....you have been busier than me probably, with the work you have done to it recently.
Its nice,having spent a chunk of money,at seeing some end result from it,isn't it

Hi Craig, to be honest I was doubting that travelling to Sunderland and spending £500 was going to be worth it..especially as even they said that sometimes they struggle to better other people's tunes..but with the de-cat I didn't want to take any chances..however.. :driving:

My real work dried up at the beginning of March so idle hands gives me time to mess around and tinker in a way for the last 25 years I really haven't had that much spare time for 'hobbies'..

Was pondering one of these babies for a Christmas present to moi? :rofl:

https://www.bimmerworld.com/Exhaust/BMW-Turbo-Parts-Kits/MHI-N20-N26-Big-Turbo-BMW-F30-328i-F32-428i-F22-228i.html

Haha,big turbo.....good for several more horses :driving:

Keep going and you will be into 30/35i territory,lol.

Cant beat some firced induction....love the ESS stage 2 supercharger giving circa 525bho on the M's..
Prices are high at the minute on them though.

Well it will never close the gap on a similarly modded 35i or a supercharged M but...since I’ve started I’ll investigate further.. :tumbleweed:

 

[ronk]

I suspect that eventually you’ll make the leap into 35i territory - no evidence to support this - just a hunch

Ps -There’s a newbie looking for a yellow one :fuelfire:

 

[Boltz]

My 18 was mapped to a stage 2 last September by Celtic and No rolling road was done. My driving perception feels a massive improvement in torque and acceleration and I never had to drop a cog or two when overtaking and I have been pleased with the results. Since then more mods notably a Supersprint catback exhaust and in the last few weeks a Supersprint decat downpipe fitted. The downpipe has obviously generated a EML so I am looking in the near future to have a rolling road and another remap to take into account the decat. I cannot use Celtic as I am too far away and I am looking at P torque in the West Mids to do this for me. I am not using my Zed at the moment mainly due to work commitments and I will not use the Zed until the remap is done. So for Celtic but not having a rolling road to back up my driving experience I have been very pleased with the remap they provided and if it wasn’t for the fact I lived so far away from them I would have used them to do the new remap I need and a rolling road.

 

[Anonymous]

I suspect that eventually you’ll make the leap into 35i territory - no evidence to support this - just a hunch

Ps -There’s a newbie looking for a yellow one :fuelfire:

Hi ronk..you’re supposition could have been correct based on three variables...an outstanding legal claim against a former employer who owes me a large amount of money..(but that case is now 3 years old and they are dragging it out), I now have much more time to tinker and the issues with the 35i I could embrace with ‘improvements’ and finding another Atacama Yellow fully loaded..most 35i in yellow lacked a lot of goodies..

 

[ronk]

So I wasn’t too far off the mark :rofl:
I would agree that the car should have all the bells and whistles

 

[Anonymous]

So I wasn’t too far off the mark :rofl:
I would agree that the car should have all the bells and whistles

I did find one about 2 years ago but at that time money, time and the various possible issues dissuaded me, plus it didn’t handle as sweetly as the 20i..

 

[enuff_zed]

So I wasn’t too far off the mark :rofl:
I would agree that the car should have all the bells and whistles

I did find one about 2 years ago but at that time money, time and the various possible issues dissuaded me, plus it didn’t handle as sweetly as the 20i..

Given all the previous discussions around ultimate bhp and handling, and how easy it is to get it wrong, I would put a little wager on you wishing you'd kept the one you have now.
As you mentioned in a thread about tyre pressures, it all comes down to the individual. In your case, looking at what you have done so far, I suspect you'd prefer the ability to keep up a high speed through flowing bends, rather than brake, turn, point, squirt and repeat? Even if you covered the ground from A to B in exactly the same time, surely the more flowing drive would be more satisfying?

 

[Anonymous]

So I wasn’t too far off the mark :rofl:
I would agree that the car should have all the bells and whistles

I did find one about 2 years ago but at that time money, time and the various possible issues dissuaded me, plus it didn’t handle as sweetly as the 20i..

Given all the previous discussions around ultimate bhp and handling, and how easy it is to get it wrong, I would put a little wager on you wishing you'd kept the one you have now.
As you mentioned in a thread about tyre pressures, it all comes down to the individual. In your case, looking at what you have done so far, I suspect you'd prefer the ability to keep up a high speed through flowing bends, rather than brake, turn, point, squirt and repeat? Even if you covered the ground from A to B in exactly the same time, surely the more flowing drive would be more satisfying?

I think you’re fairly spot on..I’ve had a number of brake, turn, squirt type cars n bikes and it’s not my preferred style..having followed a few cars like that on runs it gets quite irritating after the short lived fun of seeing just how much they can or can’t get ahead..

I also feel like I’ve ‘developed a relationship’ with the Yellow Peril who has transported me flawlessly in all weathers and has never disgraced herself or held up other cars, so it would seem to be an act of betrayal...

 

[MACK]

I did find one about 2 years ago but at that time money, time and the various possible issues dissuaded me, plus it didn’t handle as sweetly as the 20i..

Given all the previous discussions around ultimate bhp and handling, and how easy it is to get it wrong, I would put a little wager on you wishing you'd kept the one you have now.
As you mentioned in a thread about tyre pressures, it all comes down to the individual. In your case, looking at what you have done so far, I suspect you'd prefer the ability to keep up a high speed through flowing bends, rather than brake, turn, point, squirt and repeat? Even if you covered the ground from A to B in exactly the same time, surely the more flowing drive would be more satisfying?

I think you’re fairly spot on..I’ve had a number of brake, turn, squirt type cars n bikes and it’s not my preferred style..having followed a few cars like that on runs it gets quite irritating after the short lived fun of seeing just how much they can or can’t get ahead..

I also feel like I’ve ‘developed a relationship’ with the Yellow Peril who has transported me flawlessly in all weathers and has never disgraced herself or held up other cars, so it would seem to be an act of betrayal...

For me at this point the benefits of a 35i/is over yours would be the noise they make, the potential for extra oomph and a slightly smoother power deliver etc. In terms of power, although your down on a standard 35i, the weight saving you have over one probably negates that. Obviously a remap and decat on a 35i would completely change that but it will never be quite as light on its feet as an N20.
IIRC yours is an auto and if you did go to the 3.0t I think the jerkiness inherent with the DCT at times, over the silky smoothness of the 8sp auto would probably annoy you somewhat. Without a doubt the biggest drawback would be swapping over all the mods you've made to the new car.

 

[Anonymous]

Given all the previous discussions around ultimate bhp and handling, and how easy it is to get it wrong, I would put a little wager on you wishing you'd kept the one you have now.
As you mentioned in a thread about tyre pressures, it all comes down to the individual. In your case, looking at what you have done so far, I suspect you'd prefer the ability to keep up a high speed through flowing bends, rather than brake, turn, point, squirt and repeat? Even if you covered the ground from A to B in exactly the same time, surely the more flowing drive would be more satisfying?

I think you’re fairly spot on..I’ve had a number of brake, turn, squirt type cars n bikes and it’s not my preferred style..having followed a few cars like that on runs it gets quite irritating after the short lived fun of seeing just how much they can or can’t get ahead..

I also feel like I’ve ‘developed a relationship’ with the Yellow Peril who has transported me flawlessly in all weathers and has never disgraced herself or held up other cars, so it would seem to be an act of betrayal...

For me at this point the benefits of a 35i/is over yours would be the noise they make, the potential for extra oomph and a slightly smoother power deliver etc. In terms of power, although your down on a standard 35i, the weight saving you have over one probably negates that. Obviously a remap and decat on a 35i would completely change that but it will never be quite as light on its feet as an N20.
IIRC yours is an auto and if you did go to the 3.0t I think the jerkiness inherent with the DCT at times, over the silky smoothness of the 8sp auto would probably annoy you somewhat. Without a doubt the biggest drawback would be swapping over all the mods you've made to the new car.

I think you’re again probably spot on..although i’ve never got this ‘it’s has to be a six’ type thing..it is nice to see and engine bay stuffed with engine and when the E89 was designed there were only straight sixes in the stable plus the long bonnet/short arse look is fabulous..

I remember take a `Honda CBX1000’ transverse 6 out for a test drive and yes the engine was a technical masterpiece but it wouldn’t handle and didn’t go any better than other Honda 4s or my then Laverda 1200..

I did contemplate getting a 35i and then grafting all my ‘bits’ on..but again the LSD is different etc..

Yes the ZF8HP box I think is a great box..the 90ms per shift I could have saved with a DCT box I can cope without..

As I keep saying it’s what floats your boat..the rawness/weight/extra power of the 35i at my advancing years just doesn’t get me into the ‘I’ve just got to have one’ type mindset I have been attacked by at various points in my life..

 

[craig3.2]

Hi Craig, to be honest I was doubting that travelling to Sunderland and spending £500 was going to be worth it..especially as even they said that sometimes they struggle to better other people's tunes..but with the de-cat I didn't want to take any chances..however.. :driving:

My real work dried up at the beginning of March so idle hands gives me time to mess around and tinker in a way for the last 25 years I really haven't had that much spare time for 'hobbies'..

Was pondering one of these babies for a Christmas present to moi? :rofl:

https://www.bimmerworld.com/Exhaust/BMW-Turbo-Parts-Kits/MHI-N20-N26-Big-Turbo-BMW-F30-328i-F32-428i-F22-228i.html

Haha,big turbo.....good for several more horses :driving:

Keep going and you will be into 30/35i territory,lol.

Cant beat some firced induction....love the ESS stage 2 supercharger giving circa 525bho on the M's..
Prices are high at the minute on them though.

Well it will never close the gap on a similarly modded 35i or a supercharged M but...since I’ve started I’ll investigate further.. :tumbleweed:

Yeah,once you start looking,you can't stop...the addictiveness of modding or cars in general,lol

As has been shown on forum runs going back over the years people have had 2.0 zeds and kept right on the tail of some people with m's at the time.
Only in a straight line do they lose out.

Drivers Skill,or balls/bravery goes for alot.

Had a Blast in mine today,doing over 150 miles in some great roads....now my Brakes are knackered though,haha.
Probably need to renew the front Discs and pads, prior to the National meet,lol.
Thankfully got them there,ready to go on.
Pads are ok,but discs now warped,as happens alot in the m's especially.
Even o.e BMW ones!
One if the joys of using them as M division intended

 

[R.E92]

You need to take a 35i or 35is for a good drive, they are sedate in stock form but you will get an idea of the noise and handling at least.

The entire car is 100kg heavier than the N20 models but only 50kg of that is engine weight, the rest of the weight is in the drivetrain components so it's still 49% to the front.

I think the noise will sell it to you alone. You'll have to imagine how it feels with 420hp though, the standard 35i tune is very smooth so feels slower than it is.

 

[Anonymous]

Haha,big turbo.....good for several more horses :driving:

Keep going and you will be into 30/35i territory,lol.

Cant beat some firced induction....love the ESS stage 2 supercharger giving circa 525bho on the M's..
Prices are high at the minute on them though.

Well it will never close the gap on a similarly modded 35i or a supercharged M but...since I’ve started I’ll investigate further.. :tumbleweed:

Yeah,once you start looking,you can't stop...the addictiveness of modding or cars in general,lol

As has been shown on forum runs going back over the years people have had 2.0 zeds and kept right on the tail of some people with m's at the time.
Only in a straight line do they lose out.

Drivers Skill,or balls/bravery goes for alot.

Had a Blast in mine today,doing over 150 miles in some great roads....now my Brakes are knackered though,haha.
Probably need to renew the front Discs and pads, prior to the National meet,lol.
Thankfully got them there,ready to go on.
Pads are ok,but discs now warped,as happens alot in the m's especially.
Even o.e BMW ones!
One if the joys of using them as M division intended

Craig glad you had a good day out..better get those new discs on..the grockles in their motor homes will be clogging the UK roads this year..you’re closing speed on them could be quite high..

 

[craig3.2]

Well it will never close the gap on a similarly modded 35i or a supercharged M but...since I’ve started I’ll investigate further.. :tumbleweed:

Yeah,once you start looking,you can't stop...the addictiveness of modding or cars in general,lol

As has been shown on forum runs going back over the years people have had 2.0 zeds and kept right on the tail of some people with m's at the time.
Only in a straight line do they lose out.

Drivers Skill,or balls/bravery goes for alot.

Had a Blast in mine today,doing over 150 miles in some great roads....now my Brakes are knackered though,haha.
Probably need to renew the front Discs and pads, prior to the National meet,lol.
Thankfully got them there,ready to go on.
Pads are ok,but discs now warped,as happens alot in the m's especially.
Even o.e BMW ones!
One if the joys of using them as M division intended

Craig glad you had a good day out..better get those new discs on..the grockles in their motor homes will be clogging the UK roads this year..you’re closing speed on them could be quite high..

Yeah,booked in for a week today,Peter
Yes,this Staycation post lock down easing/fallout will go on into next year I reckon,with a lot less people going abroad in the short term...hopefully things will change by next summer? :driving:

My approaching speed,high..whatever do you mean Peter... I rarlely go above 60 these days,lol :driving: :rofl:

Yeah,will need to bed them in for a bit when fitted,now I have done enough miles to bed in my new Rear tyres,Pilot Suoersports

 

[MACK]

For info I've written a detailed email to both Celtic and the dealer who fitted the re-map along with the charts..I can see from a trace report that its been delivered to both and the dealer has opened up the email..

We'll see what gives..

Hi,

I take it they have both failed to respond so far?

 

[Anonymous]

Hi Mack, well funnily enough I did get an email from Celtic yesterday afternoon requesting car reg..I guess so they can pull the details / VIN number from there car/dealer/customer database..so maybe something will come from them...

And at the time you posted Andy the owner of B for BMW called...he thanked me for the post, fully understood what was said and asked if I had copied Celtic..

He said he had been dealing with Celtic for 14 years and 95% of the re-maps go A OK but said you can’t beat a rolling road to check, especially if going off-piste..

So warm words..I didn’t really expect more from him..he endorsed customer feedback which I know he does with his own work..

We’ll have to see how it goes..one further thought I had was..

At the time I did the re-map Celtic had just backed off their quoted figures from 295bhp to 280bhp..some examples like the E8918i showed 295bhp the E8920i showed 280bhp..

I rang them up and they said that given some reports of N20s letting go they had decided to back off their re-map..

So whether something in their processes went astray at that point?

I’ll update everyone as and when some papal smoke appears..