Internal Convertible Roof Tear
- Thread starter mdashi
- Start date
Okay, finally got round to sorting the pics I took when investigating this – sorry it took so long, but if you’re going to do a job then do it right, right ?
So this is the evil I wanted to banish, the marks being caused by the latch for my roof :
This is the latch... You can see how the plastic coating on the metal has come off over time and left some jagged edges. And the metal is not so smooth either – the hood rubs on this every time it goes up and down, and as others have said, eventually it can wear through the fabric. You can see the fraying in the pics above.
In order to get to the latch itself, you need to remove the rear centre console cover :
Open your cubby, scrunch down and peer upwards – you will be rewarded by this view :
You need to undo the two circled plastic expanding rivets with a normal Philips screw driver (I used a stubby one, felt appropriate). Unscrew them some of the way, give a wiggle, unscrew further if they don’t come loose and try again. Reason for this – if you are cack-handed like me you’ll unscrew it all the way, the screw will come out of the rivet and you’ll lose it somewhere in teh car or the bottom of the cubby.
Once you have pulled these out you want to grasp the bottom of the cubby, and pull outwards while gently pushing upwards. This will release the first two clips holding it on. You then need to lift it up so you can see the following view (it is very flexible, won’t break) :
The red arrow shows one of the second set of clips, one either side – I used a long flat head screw driver to push each of these back to release them. At this point there are two more clips right at the back of the trim that had me foxed. The next photo of the trim removed shows these at the top in the orange squares :
To be honest I just wiggled it gently and flexed the trim next to the latch a bit till they released. The other catches you have released are shown in red circles and blue squares.
This is the manual unlatch mechanism, operated by pushing the handle in the trim you have removed, which in turn pushes on the green circled ‘tongue’. This in turn pushes a mechanism at (and in the direction of) the arrow that unlatches the roof :
The catch on the roof is circled below :
At this point, if you are removing the latch you need to start taking out the screws shown in the pic of the tongue – I did not attempt this, reason below...
Worth saying that if your roof motor is buggered but the electrics that unlatch it from the front still work, you don’t really need to use this – you just press the close button for a bit, get out and lift the roof, as the electrics unlatch it for you. I think the latch mechanism is missing from later facelift builds going on what I have read on here. My dilemma was that it is still present on mine, and the roof moves quite easily when unlatched... so I decided if it ain’t broke then I shan’t try and fix it. Instead I will get some felt and try and cover the latch so that the rubbing is fabric on fabric, thereby preventing it actually cutting through the hood lining.
However, whilst I was in there, I determined to try and fix a squeak that has irritated me for ages when the roof is down, and I know can be fixed whilst this is off. Kind of like a random high pitched mouse in your ear which can only be banished by burying the loud pedal and turning the music up... which is fine, but sometimes I want wind and engine roar in their pure form :-D
So let’s go back to this picture :
A number of things collude to produce this squeak, but the main ones are the three plastic vanes that are circled in purple. These press on the tongue of the latch mechanism above to release the catch - you can see corresponding wear on each part, quite a lot actually for a mechanism that really is never used. Which indicates that it moves a little, rubbing enough to make a noise when the roof is down, latched and putting pressure on the mechanism. Other things like the edges of the handle itself rubbing may also contribute to the squeak. However the solution seems to be to stop the movement & mute any sound so I did two things :
1. I took the springs for the handle off (indicated by the green arrows) – they were almost flat, not putting a huge amount of pressure on the door to hold it closed. I guess this happens over time as they stay in the same position, so I bent them into more of a ‘v’ such that when re-inserted they exerted more pressure.
2. I put a couple of pieces of double-sided number plate tape on the tongue where I could see rubbing. Some on here have used felt, but I didn’t have any. Logic is, extra padding will increase pressure on the back of the handle, helping to prevent movement along with the extra spring pressure ; also, when the trim is back on the handle will stick to the tape, I don’t use it so it should stay in place ; finally, there is no plastic on plastic, so in theory there should be no squeak...
Putting everything back together is the reverse of the above, just be gentle getting the first two pressure clips in at the top – you’ll need to grasp the back of the trim on the left and right of the latch and gently pull it away from the latch a couple of millimetres to be able to push them in ; then just push the others in until they snap into place and put the expanding screw rivets back in.
I haven’t had the roof down a huge amount since I did all this, but I have been out for a couple of long drives and over uneven road surfaces... and the squeak has (so far) been conspicuous by its absence, which is a result. Just need to sort the felt on the latch mechanism such that it sticks and doesn’t come off in a few weeks
So this is the evil I wanted to banish, the marks being caused by the latch for my roof :
This is the latch... You can see how the plastic coating on the metal has come off over time and left some jagged edges. And the metal is not so smooth either – the hood rubs on this every time it goes up and down, and as others have said, eventually it can wear through the fabric. You can see the fraying in the pics above.
In order to get to the latch itself, you need to remove the rear centre console cover :
Open your cubby, scrunch down and peer upwards – you will be rewarded by this view :
You need to undo the two circled plastic expanding rivets with a normal Philips screw driver (I used a stubby one, felt appropriate). Unscrew them some of the way, give a wiggle, unscrew further if they don’t come loose and try again. Reason for this – if you are cack-handed like me you’ll unscrew it all the way, the screw will come out of the rivet and you’ll lose it somewhere in teh car or the bottom of the cubby.
Once you have pulled these out you want to grasp the bottom of the cubby, and pull outwards while gently pushing upwards. This will release the first two clips holding it on. You then need to lift it up so you can see the following view (it is very flexible, won’t break) :
The red arrow shows one of the second set of clips, one either side – I used a long flat head screw driver to push each of these back to release them. At this point there are two more clips right at the back of the trim that had me foxed. The next photo of the trim removed shows these at the top in the orange squares :
To be honest I just wiggled it gently and flexed the trim next to the latch a bit till they released. The other catches you have released are shown in red circles and blue squares.
This is the manual unlatch mechanism, operated by pushing the handle in the trim you have removed, which in turn pushes on the green circled ‘tongue’. This in turn pushes a mechanism at (and in the direction of) the arrow that unlatches the roof :
The catch on the roof is circled below :
At this point, if you are removing the latch you need to start taking out the screws shown in the pic of the tongue – I did not attempt this, reason below...
Worth saying that if your roof motor is buggered but the electrics that unlatch it from the front still work, you don’t really need to use this – you just press the close button for a bit, get out and lift the roof, as the electrics unlatch it for you. I think the latch mechanism is missing from later facelift builds going on what I have read on here. My dilemma was that it is still present on mine, and the roof moves quite easily when unlatched... so I decided if it ain’t broke then I shan’t try and fix it. Instead I will get some felt and try and cover the latch so that the rubbing is fabric on fabric, thereby preventing it actually cutting through the hood lining.
However, whilst I was in there, I determined to try and fix a squeak that has irritated me for ages when the roof is down, and I know can be fixed whilst this is off. Kind of like a random high pitched mouse in your ear which can only be banished by burying the loud pedal and turning the music up... which is fine, but sometimes I want wind and engine roar in their pure form :-D
So let’s go back to this picture :
A number of things collude to produce this squeak, but the main ones are the three plastic vanes that are circled in purple. These press on the tongue of the latch mechanism above to release the catch - you can see corresponding wear on each part, quite a lot actually for a mechanism that really is never used. Which indicates that it moves a little, rubbing enough to make a noise when the roof is down, latched and putting pressure on the mechanism. Other things like the edges of the handle itself rubbing may also contribute to the squeak. However the solution seems to be to stop the movement & mute any sound so I did two things :
1. I took the springs for the handle off (indicated by the green arrows) – they were almost flat, not putting a huge amount of pressure on the door to hold it closed. I guess this happens over time as they stay in the same position, so I bent them into more of a ‘v’ such that when re-inserted they exerted more pressure.
2. I put a couple of pieces of double-sided number plate tape on the tongue where I could see rubbing. Some on here have used felt, but I didn’t have any. Logic is, extra padding will increase pressure on the back of the handle, helping to prevent movement along with the extra spring pressure ; also, when the trim is back on the handle will stick to the tape, I don’t use it so it should stay in place ; finally, there is no plastic on plastic, so in theory there should be no squeak...
Putting everything back together is the reverse of the above, just be gentle getting the first two pressure clips in at the top – you’ll need to grasp the back of the trim on the left and right of the latch and gently pull it away from the latch a couple of millimetres to be able to push them in ; then just push the others in until they snap into place and put the expanding screw rivets back in.
I haven’t had the roof down a huge amount since I did all this, but I have been out for a couple of long drives and over uneven road surfaces... and the squeak has (so far) been conspicuous by its absence, which is a result. Just need to sort the felt on the latch mechanism such that it sticks and doesn’t come off in a few weeks
Great write up Bing
I have to admit I did this search now, because my softtop squaks are driving me mad, and as it is winter tome, and my hardtop is on, I have to live with those squeaks every day!
Is it possible that I have a latch between the roll hoops, but dont have the thingey it attaches to on the softtop?
my car is 02.2006 so an early facelift model.
I have to admit I did this search now, because my softtop squaks are driving me mad, and as it is winter tome, and my hardtop is on, I have to live with those squeaks every day!
Is it possible that I have a latch between the roll hoops, but dont have the thingey it attaches to on the softtop?
my car is 02.2006 so an early facelift model.
McKoval, mine is 02/06 as well... So you probably have the latch on the roof too. Sad to say that I still have the squeak, if anything now a bit worse than before. Been meaning to bump this thread to report back, so thanks for that
I think I will try felting things up a bit in there, and if that doesn't work then I will try to remove the latch, though this is a 'final' option as I am really not sure about taking it off at all.
Anyone know where I can get some sticky felt ? A craft shop maybe ?
I will have a bash in the New Year, and if I succeed I will report back...
I think I will try felting things up a bit in there, and if that doesn't work then I will try to remove the latch, though this is a 'final' option as I am really not sure about taking it off at all.
Anyone know where I can get some sticky felt ? A craft shop maybe ?
I will have a bash in the New Year, and if I succeed I will report back...
Ok, so I have done some felting of the centre trim - just used some sticky-backed stuff I got from a craft shop. I have put felt :
Where the OEM strip was at the top of the trim, but larger
All the way down the edges, thin strips
Under both ends of the springs of the soft-top release handle
Round the spindles of the handle
On the top and bottom edges of where the handle touches the trim ; also very thin strips right along the edge of the handle door at the sides where there was a little obiousl catching / rubbing
On the plastic vanes that push on the latch release mechanism
Pic below, with arrows showing most of the locations :
You may consider this excessive, but I really cannot work out where the squeak is coming from, so I went belt and braces... I have a horrible feeling it may be coming from the mechanism itself, which I tried to get out but failed... I took two screws out then couldn't work out what else to do
I've not been out with the top down yet, but will test it in the next couple of days and report back.
Where the OEM strip was at the top of the trim, but larger
All the way down the edges, thin strips
Under both ends of the springs of the soft-top release handle
Round the spindles of the handle
On the top and bottom edges of where the handle touches the trim ; also very thin strips right along the edge of the handle door at the sides where there was a little obiousl catching / rubbing
On the plastic vanes that push on the latch release mechanism
Pic below, with arrows showing most of the locations :
You may consider this excessive, but I really cannot work out where the squeak is coming from, so I went belt and braces... I have a horrible feeling it may be coming from the mechanism itself, which I tried to get out but failed... I took two screws out then couldn't work out what else to do
I've not been out with the top down yet, but will test it in the next couple of days and report back.
I put PTFE lubricant on the visible parts of the roof mech which cured some irritating squeaks
VENDAR said:
I've not been able to have the roof down since I did it
However I shall do so this weekend and report back. I simply went into Hobbycraft and bought a couple of A4 sheets of black sticky back felt - has a paper backing that you peel off. Cost me about £2.
yg54sg, not really sure about that. Would need some serious accuracy and I think you would have to take everything apart. They are very elusive these squeaks and rattles. There was a thread started a while back to try and collate all squeaks and rattles and their solutions. When I now my solution works I will bump it by adding my pic. Have a search in the e85/86 problems section
VENDAR said:
Not had the chance to get the roof down until today, however I stuck it down for 5mins on a bouncy local road that has always provoked the mouse squeak in the past, and the results are in....
Not a sound. Nada. Needs to stand the test of time of course, but I am tentatively very pleased with myself
